eBay do give an OOS defect for refunding, and will refuse to remove it

[ccrrefills]

I've been told countless times here to not worry about refunding and getting an out of stock defect even though I've had that happen to me before.

I had an order that wasn't delivered because of the Canada Post strike and decided to refund the buyer to be nice even though they didn't request a refund. I now see I got an out of stock defect, and after calling they refused to remove it because the I refunded the buyer without his authorization, how absurd is that?

Especially considering you're only allowed a fraction of a percent of OOS defects, and I even refunded and re-shipped the order a second time and that's how eBay treats me when they said they would protect sellers from defects related to the strike.

[hillbillymedia]

---

@fsdfasdf-0 wrote:

---

@ccrrefills wrote:

I had an order that wasn't delivered because of the Canada Post strike and decided to refund the buyer to be nice even though they didn't request a refund. I now see I got an out of stock defect, and after calling they refused to remove it because the I refunded the buyer without his authorization, how absurd is that?

---

In ebay's eyes it is apparently highly absurd that a seller would refund a buyer just to be nice.

---

I fully refunded a buyer from paypal once about a year and a half ago. My son wrecked his 4 wheeler and had to be flown to the hospital. I was 2 days late shipping his order so I shipped it and refunded him fully through paypal with my deepest apologies. Ebay got to keep their fees. The customer got their order and their money back and I got a late shipment ding as I deserved. I did not get an OOS defect. I thought it was the right way to handle it even though there was no customer complaint.

[hillbillymedia]

---

@slippinjimmy wrote:

The OP created the problem by not following procedures. If they really wanted the buyer to get a refund they should have told them to open an INR claim. If they had done that there would be no defect and the OP's fees would have been returned.

Instead they went outside the standard procedure and paid a penalty for it.

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

[myangelandmyprincess]

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

You do get a defect for refunding even if you don't do the cancellation   However I swear I've seen some of the blues say that if it shows it shipped that would be an exception to getting the defect for oos

---

Well now that will all depend on how the seller handles it and IF Ebay catches the refund without an email and/or cancellation in Ebay.

If a seller refunds a buyer for whatever reason there may be.  If the seller emails the buyer inside of Ebay and explains why they are issueing the refund in full or part, Ebay is not likely to give the seller a defect for OOS.  Well unless the email to the buyer said they were refunding for OOS.

What Ebay doesn't like is a blind refund.  No communication and or no cancellation.  But if you are refunding because they return the item or for overpayment of shipping for example, if you email the buyer and outline what the refund is for, the chances are extremely slim that Ebay would give a seller a defect.

You do NOT automatically get a defect just because you refund a buyer without a cancellation.  The Ebay bot would have to catch it AND the seller didn't email the buyer outlining the refund as I previously described.

---

My understanding based on what blues said was that if eBay can see it shipped it won't get a defect communication isn't requried

[mam98031]

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

You do get a defect for refunding even if you don't do the cancellation   However I swear I've seen some of the blues say that if it shows it shipped that would be an exception to getting the defect for oos

---

Well now that will all depend on how the seller handles it and IF Ebay catches the refund without an email and/or cancellation in Ebay.

If a seller refunds a buyer for whatever reason there may be.  If the seller emails the buyer inside of Ebay and explains why they are issueing the refund in full or part, Ebay is not likely to give the seller a defect for OOS.  Well unless the email to the buyer said they were refunding for OOS.

What Ebay doesn't like is a blind refund.  No communication and or no cancellation.  But if you are refunding because they return the item or for overpayment of shipping for example, if you email the buyer and outline what the refund is for, the chances are extremely slim that Ebay would give a seller a defect.

You do NOT automatically get a defect just because you refund a buyer without a cancellation.  The Ebay bot would have to catch it AND the seller didn't email the buyer outlining the refund as I previously described.

---

My understanding based on what blues said was that if eBay can see it shipped it won't get a defect communication isn't requried

---

The act of SHIPPING is not the issue of this thread.  It is the REFUND.

[myangelandmyprincess]

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

You do get a defect for refunding even if you don't do the cancellation   However I swear I've seen some of the blues say that if it shows it shipped that would be an exception to getting the defect for oos

---

Well now that will all depend on how the seller handles it and IF Ebay catches the refund without an email and/or cancellation in Ebay.

If a seller refunds a buyer for whatever reason there may be.  If the seller emails the buyer inside of Ebay and explains why they are issueing the refund in full or part, Ebay is not likely to give the seller a defect for OOS.  Well unless the email to the buyer said they were refunding for OOS.

What Ebay doesn't like is a blind refund.  No communication and or no cancellation.  But if you are refunding because they return the item or for overpayment of shipping for example, if you email the buyer and outline what the refund is for, the chances are extremely slim that Ebay would give a seller a defect.

You do NOT automatically get a defect just because you refund a buyer without a cancellation.  The Ebay bot would have to catch it AND the seller didn't email the buyer outlining the refund as I previously described.

---

My understanding based on what blues said was that if eBay can see it shipped it won't get a defect communication isn't requried

---

The act of SHIPPING is not the issue of this thread.  It is the REFUND.

---

No the act of shipping is what I’m saying I’ve seen the blues say will keep from an OOS defect with a refund.   If there is tracking showing the item was shipped it was my understanding it wasn’t supposed to be seen as an oos defect since it was shipped   

[yuzuha]

---

@hillbillymedia wrote:

---

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

---

There was no problem to solve if the buyer never even asked about the package.  Why are some sellers so bound and determine to CREATE problems for themselves?  The package was delayed, the buyer never even contacted the seller to ask about it, and yet the seller goes ahead and refunds anyway... why?  People keep saying "good customer service" but that's not good customer service, that's ASSUMING something on behalf of the buyer, who never gave any indication that they were concerned about the package whatsoever.  They may have been just fine with waiting for it to arrive!  Most people understand that the mail may be slow around this time of year; I just had a package from Japan spend over a week in customs when most of them are in and out in a day or two.

Good customer service would be messaging the buyer and letting them know that the package was being delayed due to the issues with Canada Post but that it was on its way to them, but even that isn't really necessary if the buyer never asked where it was.  They can see the tracking if the seller shipped with tracking. 

[mam98031]

No the act of shipping is what I’m saying I’ve seen the blues say will keep from an OOS defect with a refund.   If there is tracking showing the item was shipped it was my understanding it wasn’t supposed to be seen as an oos defect since it was shipped   

Oh I get it now.  We are talking about two different things.  Ebay doesn't ding the seller with an OOS defect when they refund without communication or a corresponding claim in Ebay because they were really OOS.  They do it because if you look at the very short list of reasons for filing a cancellation, it is the OOS reason that gives the seller a defect.  So that is the one they choose when applying a defect to a seller for issuing a refund.

It doesn't mean the seller was really OOS.  It simply means that this was the best option for Ebay in their opinion.

[fsdfasdf-0]

---

@robot-hands wrote:

---

@fern*wood wrote:

---

@robot-hands wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

I've been told countless times here to not worry about refunding and getting an out of stock defect even though I've had that happen to me before.

Always make sure you are taking advice from an actual seller in matters to do with selling and your stats.  

---

One of the boards most prolific posters went on and on about how it wasn't real...EVERY time it was brought up.

They are either gone or switched to a sock puppet now though.

---

Unfortunately, prolific doesn't always equal accurate.

---

Also unfortunate that this very forum rewarded that poster with heaping piles of thumbs.

---

Even more unfortunate is those providing accurate information can be reported for basically flim-flam reasons which will reduce them to eventual sock puppets as well.

Yes, it's true, you too can be a part of the big bad Lithium game of report-a-poster you do not agree with.

But fear not, if the above has reduced you they do "reset" the game every so often.

[fsdfasdf-0]

---

@hillbillymedia wrote:

---

@slippinjimmy wrote:

The OP created the problem by not following procedures. If they really wanted the buyer to get a refund they should have told them to open an INR claim. If they had done that there would be no defect and the OP's fees would have been returned.

Instead they went outside the standard procedure and paid a penalty for it.

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

---

Unfortunately the big box and the dropship sellers FREQUENTLY manipulate this system by using "buyer asked" as a reason for cancelling when the truth lies elsewhere, which is most likely why this seller got punished (although you may be correct as well)... The reason I abstained from judgement.

However, and sadly...

The big box sellers and the dropshippers continue to game the system despite ebay's best efforts to curb the abuse, once again it is the honest seller and the small guys who pay the price.

That, my friend, is the truth of the matter.

[mam98031]

---

@fsdfasdf-0 wrote:

---

@hillbillymedia wrote:

---

@slippinjimmy wrote:

The OP created the problem by not following procedures. If they really wanted the buyer to get a refund they should have told them to open an INR claim. If they had done that there would be no defect and the OP's fees would have been returned.

Instead they went outside the standard procedure and paid a penalty for it.

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

---

Unfortunately the big box and the dropship sellers FREQUENTLY manipulate this system by using "buyer asked" as a reason for cancelling when the truth lies elsewhere, which is most likely why this seller got punished (although you may be correct as well)... The reason I abstained from judgement.

However, and sadly...

The big box sellers and the dropshippers continue to game the system despite ebay's best efforts to curb the abuse, once again it is the honest seller and the small guys who pay the price.

That, my friend, is the truth of the matter.

---

You are making ASSUMPTIONS that are NOT necessarily true.  Just as there are bad sellers that sell stuff they have in stock or supposingly have in stock, there are bad sellers that drop ship.  But not all sellers that stock their own stuff are bad sellers NOR are those that drop ship.

Just as most anything in life there are right ways and wrong ways of doing stuff.  It is so rare for a blanket statement to actually be factual or true.

[myjunqueyourtreasure]

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

You do get a defect for refunding even if you don't do the cancellation   However I swear I've seen some of the blues say that if it shows it shipped that would be an exception to getting the defect for oos

---

Well now that will all depend on how the seller handles it and IF Ebay catches the refund without an email and/or cancellation in Ebay.

If a seller refunds a buyer for whatever reason there may be.  If the seller emails the buyer inside of Ebay and explains why they are issueing the refund in full or part, Ebay is not likely to give the seller a defect for OOS.  Well unless the email to the buyer said they were refunding for OOS.

What Ebay doesn't like is a blind refund.  No communication and or no cancellation.  But if you are refunding because they return the item or for overpayment of shipping for example, if you email the buyer and outline what the refund is for, the chances are extremely slim that Ebay would give a seller a defect.

You do NOT automatically get a defect just because you refund a buyer without a cancellation.  The Ebay bot would have to catch it AND the seller didn't email the buyer outlining the refund as I previously described.

---

My understanding based on what blues said was that if eBay can see it shipped it won't get a defect communication isn't requried

---

The act of SHIPPING is not the issue of this thread.  It is the REFUND.

---

No the act of shipping is what I’m saying I’ve seen the blues say will keep from an OOS defect with a refund.   If there is tracking showing the item was shipped it was my understanding it wasn’t supposed to be seen as an oos defect since it was shipped   

---

That was what I took away from it as well. It can't get an OOS defect if it was obviously IN stock as it shipped.

[mam98031]

---

@myjunqueyourtreasure wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

---

@mam98031 wrote:

---

@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

You do get a defect for refunding even if you don't do the cancellation   However I swear I've seen some of the blues say that if it shows it shipped that would be an exception to getting the defect for oos

---

Well now that will all depend on how the seller handles it and IF Ebay catches the refund without an email and/or cancellation in Ebay.

If a seller refunds a buyer for whatever reason there may be.  If the seller emails the buyer inside of Ebay and explains why they are issueing the refund in full or part, Ebay is not likely to give the seller a defect for OOS.  Well unless the email to the buyer said they were refunding for OOS.

What Ebay doesn't like is a blind refund.  No communication and or no cancellation.  But if you are refunding because they return the item or for overpayment of shipping for example, if you email the buyer and outline what the refund is for, the chances are extremely slim that Ebay would give a seller a defect.

You do NOT automatically get a defect just because you refund a buyer without a cancellation.  The Ebay bot would have to catch it AND the seller didn't email the buyer outlining the refund as I previously described.

---

My understanding based on what blues said was that if eBay can see it shipped it won't get a defect communication isn't requried

---

The act of SHIPPING is not the issue of this thread.  It is the REFUND.

---

No the act of shipping is what I’m saying I’ve seen the blues say will keep from an OOS defect with a refund.   If there is tracking showing the item was shipped it was my understanding it wasn’t supposed to be seen as an oos defect since it was shipped   

---

That was what I took away from it as well. It can't get an OOS defect if it was obviously IN stock as it shipped.

---

We are getting hung up on the "OOS" as being the reason.  It's Ebay, they make the decision.  Per the guys on the Weekly Chat, that is the reason Ebay chooses when interjecting a defect on a seller that refunds a buyer without the benefit of a cancellation or Claim in place.

It does NOT mean the seller was actually out of stock [OOS].  It ONLY means that is what Ebay selects as the reason for the cancellation because they want it to cause a defect on the seller's account.

For a further explanation of why OOS, we would have to get Ebay to tell us.  I can only share what they have told me several times through other threads where blues have participated and on the weekly chat.

Don't get hung up on the OOS part.  The important part is that Ebay can and does impose a defect on a seller's account for merely offering good customer service and processing a refund to take care of a customer.

[hillbillymedia]

---

@yuzuha wrote:

---

@hillbillymedia wrote:

---

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

---

There was no problem to solve if the buyer never even asked about the package.  Why are some sellers so bound and determine to CREATE problems for themselves?  The package was delayed, the buyer never even contacted the seller to ask about it, and yet the seller goes ahead and refunds anyway... why?  People keep saying "good customer service" but that's not good customer service, that's ASSUMING something on behalf of the buyer, who never gave any indication that they were concerned about the package whatsoever.  They may have been just fine with waiting for it to arrive!  Most people understand that the mail may be slow around this time of year; I just had a package from Japan spend over a week in customs when most of them are in and out in a day or two.

Good customer service would be messaging the buyer and letting them know that the package was being delayed due to the issues with Canada Post but that it was on its way to them, but even that isn't really necessary if the buyer never asked where it was.  They can see the tracking if the seller shipped with tracking. 

---

Tomorrow is Christmas eve. If I`m feeling generous tomorrow and want to refund all my paypal payments for the last 7 days with a note in each refund stating: "Merry Christmas, your purchase is on me" it shouldn`t be any of ebay`s business. Again, ebay got their fees(and kept them) and they have NOTHING left in the transaction to protect or guarantee, and therefore, NO reason to be dishing out defects.

This wasn`t a cancelled ebay transaction....it was a paypal refund.

[hillbillymedia]

---

@fsdfasdf-0 wrote:

---

@hillbillymedia wrote:

---

@slippinjimmy wrote:

The OP created the problem by not following procedures. If they really wanted the buyer to get a refund they should have told them to open an INR claim. If they had done that there would be no defect and the OP's fees would have been returned.

Instead they went outside the standard procedure and paid a penalty for it.

---

The OP created a problem?? No, the OP solved a potential problem by being proactive and s/he got a lashing for it and why? Answer: because of ebay`s need to control / micromanage everything with no rhyme, reason or consistency. Ebay got their fees in this transaction and they kept them so there was absolutely no reason for them to butt in. The only one that lost anything here was the seller.....just how ebay likes it.

---

Unfortunately the big box and the dropship sellers FREQUENTLY manipulate this system by using "buyer asked" as a reason for cancelling when the truth lies elsewhere, which is most likely why this seller got punished (although you may be correct as well)... The reason I abstained from judgement.

However, and sadly...

The big box sellers and the dropshippers continue to game the system despite ebay's best efforts to curb the abuse, once again it is the honest seller and the small guys who pay the price.

That, my friend, is the truth of the matter.

---

I understand what you are saying...I do but....this wasn`t a cancelled ebay transaction. It was simply a paypal refund. Big box sellers game the system because they  lie about the reason for the cancelled transaction and get their FVFees back. The OP simply refunded the buyer through paypal and forfeited the ebay fees.

[hillbillymedia]

OP....As a buyer as well as a seller here on ebay, I can say that I would have been more than pleased by the way you handled your transaction and I`m guessing your buyer was pleased as well. That is all that really matters. I hope ebay removes that defect for you as they stated they would.