eBay

rockbottomauto · ‎08-21-2020

We are one of the larger sellers of OEM auto parts on eBay, and have been for many years.

We offer completely free returns, even for buyers that simply "change their minds", but of course every month we enter the "very high items not as described" threshold.

Every single case that has been opened against us for "items not as described" has been completely proven that the buyer simply ordered the wrong part for their application. The words "items not as described" should equate that we sent the customer the wrong part, or a part that was not in brand new condition etc. Buyers know in all facets of online shopping they just need to lie a little to get what they want.

Furthermore, if we are offering "free returns", why should we be penalized with an extra 5% of fees anyway? It's not like the good folks at eBay are footing the bill for us, we are still out the shipping costs both ways.

We sell exactly the same amount of parts on Amazon every single month, and guess what? We get about 80% less in returns from the parts sold on Amazon. Why is that you ask? eBay encourages scam behavior.

I know you guys are losing market share and there probably won't be an eBay in 10 years, but you really should strongly consider erasing this policy and I mean quickly. We started last year making plans to leave eBay, and are going to do so sooner rather than later.

Shameless cash grabs are a sign of desperation, and a message to the community that you are scared to death of going under.

chrispycritter007 · ‎08-22-2020

The surcharge is a 50% rise in fees, not 5%. Going from 10% FVF to 15% is a 50% increase. Forget the item price and focus on what is going in eBay's pockets to see the real cost.

ittybitnot · ‎08-22-2020

We do not cancel the sale, so as long as they do not open a case it does not count against us.

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply and indulging my inquiries. Are you saying that you "do not cancel the sale" when an item is returned and you refund, and let eBay keep the fvfs? Surely not!?!?!? or do you mean a simple return request with no reason is an option for your buyers, and refunding gets your final value fees credited?

I simply picked the "change my mind" reason as an example off the top of my head because I knew it was NOT a SNAD choice. LOL.

I was a seller here since 1998. Over the years I adapted to changes. The final straw for me was "phony SNADs" for which I had to pay return shipping. Yes, I got my share of empty boxes, different items, items that were exactly as described, a pile of metal nuts and bolts instead of the gold bracelet I sent etc. When eBay no longer wanted to hear about this (telling me to pound sand...lol) that was it. Luckily for me I started on other venues in 2008-9, so the transition of kicking ebay to the curb was not so dramatic. Yes, I relied on the income, but that "income" declined, became not worth it anymore. I was not a BIG BUSINESS, and they miss me not.

I still try new venues. I had one that was working real well until they rewarded your success by putting you in a mandatory ad fee camp which ON Occasion only increases your fees about 215% (no I did not leave out a decimal). As a result I have my own website now. Just a couple of months old, and already getting sales.

Again, I hope you and the rest of the sellers in the same predicament can find redress.

P.S. My fuel pump is in the gas tank...access is through a panel under the back seat. My car is OLD and the only year they didn't use those clips that require "special tools" to disconnect the gas lines. Flat head screw driver, fillips head screw driver, and I am good to go! Plug and play!

rockbottomauto · ‎08-22-2020

@chrispycritter007 wrote:
The surcharge is a 50% rise in fees, not 5%. Going from 10% FVF to 15% is a 50% increase. Forget the item price and focus on what is going in eBay's pockets to see the real cost.

Yes, that is how percentages work. It is the same thing no matter how you slice the math, and we are very much aware of the real cost.

rockbottomauto · ‎08-22-2020

@ittybitnot wrote:
We do not cancel the sale, so as long as they do not open a case it does not count against us.

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply and indulging my inquiries. Are you saying that you "do not cancel the sale" when an item is returned and you refund, and let eBay keep the fvfs? Surely not!?!?!? or do you mean a simple return request with no reason is an option for your buyers, and refunding gets your final value fees credited?

I simply picked the "change my mind" reason as an example off the top of my head because I knew it was NOT a SNAD choice. LOL.

I was a seller here since 1998. Over the years I adapted to changes. The final straw for me was "phony SNADs" for which I had to pay return shipping. Yes, I got my share of empty boxes, different items, items that were exactly as described, a pile of metal nuts and bolts instead of the gold bracelet I sent etc. When eBay no longer wanted to hear about this (telling me to pound sand...lol) that was it. Luckily for me I started on other venues in 2008-9, so the transition of kicking ebay to the curb was not so dramatic. Yes, I relied on the income, but that "income" declined, became not worth it anymore. I was not a BIG BUSINESS, and they miss me not.

I still try new venues. I had one that was working real well until they rewarded your success by putting you in a mandatory ad fee camp which ON Occasion only increases your fees about 215% (no I did not leave out a decimal). As a result I have my own website now. Just a couple of months old, and already getting sales.

Again, I hope you and the rest of the sellers in the same predicament can find redress.

P.S. My fuel pump is in the gas tank...access is through a panel under the back seat. My car is OLD and the only year they didn't use those clips that require  "special tools" to disconnect the gas lines. Flat head screw driver, fillips head screw driver, and I am good to go! Plug and play!

I should have elaborated, yes that is correct we handle it is a "return" without a case, once that is complete on our end the FVF's are refunded. It is really the only way to avoid the metrics 100% and ensure we are not cheated.

Like you, I too have been selling on here since the late 90's, and that is part of the reason my current company hired me to run this business. Our online sales only net 7-8% of our total revenue, the larger share comes from B2B sources. So it is not the end of the world for us to move platforms as our profit margin begins to take a nose dive on here, it's just sad eBay cannot run a legitimate business.

For your fuel pump, that is very good news and makes that swap beyond easy. If your application has an inline fuel filter it may be a good idea to change that out at the same time as well for piece of mind. (not at all necessary to do, but also an easy job)

Best of luck to you.

fashunu4eeuh · ‎08-22-2020

@rockbottomauto Sorry to hear of your experience. Hate to see good sellers dealing with this.

I think the reason there are no class action lawsuits is because of the rewrite of the eBay User Agreement in 2012. Essentially the UA states that, unless a seller had opted out, binding arbitration would be how legal concerns would be settled, with individual lawsuits and Small Claims court remaining for those seeking satisfaction. I don't recall what was going on at the time that might have precipitated this change, but thought it made eBay appear under-handed that they felt this was necessary. It indicated to my way of thinking, that they knew some of their practices were not in, or conflicted with, seller interests. I'm sure it was a financial move, but still, it did not build confidence in eBay's policies. (Well, perhaps it did with the shareholders.)

rockbottomauto · ‎08-23-2020

@fashunu4eeuh I appreciate you taking the time to comment, and you bring up a good point about the 2012 user agreement. (I had forgotten what a big deal that was at the time)

The shareholders have been feeling uneasy for several years now, and it is completely justifiable given just how much of the market share eBay has lost in the online shopping community.

rockbottomauto · ‎08-31-2020

For those wondering, eBay has now changed their policy to allow "doesn't fit" to count against sellers metrics as well. (we have been testing this over the past several days and can confirm it)

Why in the world would we be held accountable for customers that simply order the wrong part? We do not force them to make the wrong choice, they do that all on their own even though it clearly states in all our listings "email first for fitment".

rockbottomauto · ‎09-20-2020

I have left this post open on purpose to make sure any sellers that are having the same problems we are can comment if they need to. Nothing has changed with this policy, and it is still completely unjust.

dhbookds · ‎09-20-2020

You have over 11,000 items on ebay.........could you not id the ones with return problems and eliminate them, even if a couple of 1000.......

aldente28 · ‎09-20-2020

@rockbottomauto wrote:
For those wondering, eBay has now changed their policy to allow "doesn't fit" to count against sellers metrics as well. (we have been testing this over the past several days and can confirm it)

Why in the world would we be held accountable for customers that simply order the wrong part? We do not force them to make the wrong choice, they do that all on their own even though it clearly states in all our listings "email first for fitment".

Seller metrics is a relative measure that compares sellers with their peers. If one category has a higher rate of returns for fitment, for example, that should balance out. That's ebay's view, anyway.

Does that not work in your case? And if not, why not?

I think if ebay is every going to fix this issue, I think this would be the route to making it happen.

Posting ID

sellingin-60 · ‎09-20-2020

I would love to see an investigative report done about eBay, like by 60 Minutes, for example. I am a newb and have already learned to record the eBay help phone calls, because they will tell you whatever you want to hear. Then when you hang up, you get the automated email that basically says 'sorry chump, we aren't doing anything for a seller'.

rockbottomauto · ‎09-20-2020

We have 2 stores, know personally 4 other major companies stores, and yet we all see a different percentage as compared to our "peers".

Same volume, same sales bracket, same products, different comparison rate. It's called scamming your customers, there is no other explanation.

You cannot penalize sellers for bad choices on a buyers behalf. Claiming an item "does not fit" or "not as described" when you simply ordered the wrong part, is an unavoidable metric to claim extra final value fees by eBay.

aldente28 · ‎09-20-2020

@rockbottomauto wrote:
We have 2 stores, know personally 4 other major companies stores, and yet we all see a different percentage as compared to our "peers".

Same volume, same sales bracket, same products, different comparison rate. It's called scamming your customers, there is no other explanation.

You cannot penalize sellers for bad choices on a buyers behalf. Claiming an item "does not fit" or "not as described" when you simply ordered the wrong part, is an unavoidable metric to claim extra final value fees by eBay.

I don't doubt you. My thought is that if you can explain why you're being hit with higher returns (etc), and if that suggests a problem with the metric calculation process itself, ebay might take notice and consider revising their formula, or at least how they apply it to you or your category.

I suffer from the same problem. For me, the seller metric calculation fails (and I am unfairly punished) because I am lumped in with sellers who sell in a broader category, and this broader category does not suffer from the same "issues" as my smaller niche category.

Specifically, I sell perishables. The category used to determine my seller metrics is a huge category that is mostly not perishables. Therefore, my negatives are unfairly reported as "high" compared to "peers" due to the unavoidable challenges and natural issues inherent in shipping perishables.

In short, my "peers" are not really peers, and no matter how awesome my performance, I cannot compete with sellers who ship hunks of metal while I'm shipping live things in the dead of winter.

This is kind of what I was getting at - identifying an issue with how the calculation is done and why it applies to you unfairly.

Posting ID

rockbottomauto · ‎09-20-2020

I think maybe you skimmed over the posts of this thread, which is no biggie, but maybe read from the beginning and you will have a better understanding of what we have done since this started over a year ago.

I am keeping this thread alive and bumping it up every so often so other sellers that are not being helped can find this information more easily.

furrakooki_0 · ‎09-20-2020

I too struggle with this particular issue...

We sell small engine parts, most are new and we've tested hundreds of returns over the years.

Why, well because if the buyer claims the part is defective we can not in clean conscience resell it, and to throw it away with as many returns as we get would be a HUGE waste as well and that is why we test EVERY returned part (even ones that should work according to the buyer just so WE can be sure) but here's the real kicker:

Every last one that was returned as "doesn't work / defective" did in fact work just fine when we plugged it into one of our machines, mind you this "test" procedure literally means pulling apart a working machine and installing the returned part in place of the one it came with, we're talking labor hours here.

Not even ONE of the returns failed to work.

Not even ONE...

I grew gray hairs over this until one day I decided I had had enough.

We raised our prices.

Again and again, and a few returns later again and one more time...

An item that used to sell for $17 is now sitting at $26.

Granted it has reduced our sales on that item but:

1. It covers our costs now.

2. Someone else has our headache (mainly the $16 sellers).

3. Our metrics are back to TRS+

Last but not least...

Have you been to a real world Advance / Autozone lately?