eBay

allen1853 · ‎09-13-2022

So I truly made a mistake listing a fossil walrus item, carved by a native American Eskimo in the 1970s with label and full provenance. I searched eBay for fossil walrus items and at the time thought it was an exception to their ivory policy since it was 1. Ancient Fossil and 2. Native Eskimo carved with 1970s provenance. My mistake. Ebay came down hard. Suspended my account for a week resulting in the loss of thousands in revenue. (This was after an agent lifted the suspension as unfair given all of the fossil walrus items listed at the time. This was reversed by a backroom fascist dictator.) I served my suspension costing me thousands of dollars.

But wait, eBay has given me a LIFETIME punishment, preventing me from using common words in my listings having nothing to do with ivory or marine mammals. It is a sadistic "gotcha" up yours seller punishment having nothing to do with the "crime".

Initially I figured out the prohibited words were Vintage, Antique and Victorian (90% of my items are vintage or antique.) These restrictions came up when I tried to amend my promotional rate from the newly unsupported rate of 1% to 2%. The error message only said I could no longer use the word "bone" even for bone items acceptable for everyone else like bovine, camel and ox. The error says nothing about anything except "bone". When I called (the listing had no bone at all) I was told about also not being able to use Vintage or Antique. I ultimately figured out I could not use Victorian either. Wanting to "play by the rules" I called to ask for a list of words I could no longer use. I was told it was a "secret", I would have to figure it out for myself.

Today I tried to revise a listing, removing bone, horn and carved. Still got error message. So I called again for help with the "offensive" word. Turned out to be EBONY. Ebony is a petrified black wood, having nothing to do with ivory, bone or marine mammals. So I again asked for a "complete" list of prohibited words. This time I got a partial list and was told it was not "secret". (One of the biggest frustrations with eBay is inconsistent info depending on which agent answers the call.) The list I was given was ebony, carved, horn, antique and vintage. I asked about bone. Yes bone. I asked about Victorian. No, let me check. Yes, Victorian too. What about elephant? No, I don't see it. Well trust me, I cannot use the word elephant either, not for a coloring book or a costume pin or anything. Finally I asked what about ivory? Oh no, you can't use that at all, not as a color, not for Ivory soap, not at all.

Now this only applies to us Top Sellers with 18 years on eBay who currently have over 5000 positive feedbacks, who made a mistake. Most of you can still use these words. But if you dare make a mistake, beware, the sadistic back room dictators at eBay will punish you for life and make your lives miserable.

ci1000 · ‎09-13-2022

What kind of an issue do you think it is?

maxine*j · ‎09-13-2022

@ci1000 wrote:
What kind of an issue do you think it is?

It's a policy issue; an issue of policy interpretation and enforcement.

OP did have something made of ebony wood listed, and he did have something of walrus tusk listed, and the bots caught them both. No technical problem there.

The problems, if problems they are, relate to whether or not the items were, in fact, being offered for sale in violation eBay of policy and, if so, how and to what degree the seller should be sanctioned.

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ci1000 · ‎09-13-2022

I would think that any support would be appreciated. Call it policy interpretation and enforcement or tech support. Bottom line... I would hope that everyone on this thread would like to know that someone is looking into it regardless of what you want to name it. CS is a waste of time.

gooseislandcollectibles · ‎09-13-2022

This issue of certain words being restricted must be category specific. I sell LP's, tapes, CDs and other media and right now I have albums listed as "Dinosaur Bones", "Fossils" as it is in the title of the album. I also have for sale a single listed as "Ivory Rag". I have listed in the past the words tusk and antique and nothing I posted was taken down or was told I would be suspended. So as others have noted it may have to do with the item and category listed in.

maxine*j · ‎09-13-2022

@ci1000 wrote:
I would think that any support would be appreciated. Call it policy interpretation and enforcement or tech support. Bottom line... I would hope that everyone on this thread would like to know that someone is looking into it regardless of what you want to name it. CS is a waste of time.

But what is there to look into? OP was told what the violations were. He was told what the sanctions are. Is there an appeal process I don't know about?

I do agree that CS is most of the time a waste of time. Poorly-trained, overworked, badly paid, no authority, working from inadequate scripts, saying whatever the callers want to hear just to get them off the line so they can take the next calls.

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ci1000 · ‎09-13-2022

Yeah, I guess there's nothing to look into other than the possibility that the OP made a mistake and was told about the violations and sanctions after the fact. He should never been allowed to list the item in the first place.

If eBay has the technology to take you down and punish you after the fact it's logical that they have the technology to take you down and cut you off when you are listing an item that is a possible violation.

I'm not talking about an appeal... I'm talking about an intervention with a possible internal solution from eBay.

maxine*j · ‎09-13-2022

@ci1000 wrote:
Yeah, I guess there's nothing to look into other than the possibility that the OP made a mistake and was told about the violations and sanctions after the fact. He should never been allowed to list the item in the first place.

If eBay has the technology to take you down and punish you after the fact it's logical that they have the technology to take you down and cut you off when you are listing an item that is a possible violation.

I'm not talking about an appeal... I'm talking about an intervention with a possible internal solution from eBay.

Ah, got it: Programming to stop a listing going live in the first place if it has an obvious violation of eBay policy and to then alert the seller to the listing issues. I wonder just how far some really good coders could get with that? Certainly there could be improvements over the existing feeble system.

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yuzuha · ‎09-13-2022

@gooseislandcollectibles wrote:
This issue of certain words being restricted must be category specific. I sell LP's, tapes, CDs and other media and right now I have albums listed as "Dinosaur Bones", "Fossils" as it is in the title of the album. I also have for sale a single listed as "Ivory Rag". I have listed in the past the words tusk and antique and nothing I posted was taken down or was told I would be suspended. So as others have noted it may have to do with the item and category listed in.

I'm 99% certain it is. Right now I have a toy listed in the Toys category as "plastic dinosaur fossils in a jar" and a set of plastic Halloween pumpkin lights listed in the proper seasonal decorations category as "Vintage pumpkin lights." Zero problems listing them.

chapeau-noir · ‎09-13-2022

@maxine*j wrote:
@ci1000 wrote:
Yeah, I guess there's nothing to look into other than the possibility that the OP made a mistake and was told about the violations and sanctions after the fact. He should never been allowed to list the item in the first place.

If eBay has the technology to take you down and punish you after the fact it's logical that they have the technology to take you down and cut you off when you are listing an item that is a possible violation.

I'm not talking about an appeal... I'm talking about an intervention with a possible internal solution from eBay.
Ah, got it: Programming to stop a listing going live in the first place if it has an obvious violation of eBay policy and to then alert the seller to the listing issues. I wonder just how far some really good coders could get with that? Certainly there could be improvements over the existing feeble system.

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It wouldn't be difficult to write a subroutine that would reject a listing in X category if it includes Y descriptor. Even with my rusty programming skills I can see that it could be done, it's just basic coding. How it would be done within eBay's structure is another question and I wouldn't even pretend to speculate.

I have a feeling that the policy being used with the OP is one of those "internal" guidelines that they can't tell anybody about because someone, somewhere might get around it. eBay really doesn't need sellers like they need buyers, so I doubt they feel the need to explain anything. Perhaps this 'sanction' is time limited, though.

“The illegal we do immediately, the unconstitutional takes a little longer.” - Henry Kissinger

"Do not obey in advance." Timothy Snyder "On Tyranny"

psfhobbies · ‎09-13-2022

I got Tamiya spray paint removed for hazardous materials but there are 2700 listings last time I checked for the same item we were selling I have no problem not selling a "restricted" item but they all should be pulled.I told that to a person here with severely broken english they did nothing about the others I pointed out to them.

bauble-babes · ‎09-14-2022

@collectfest "I am not a fan of 1990 hallmark ornaments described as vintage or antique."

An item is considered "Vintage" when it is at least 20 years old, so a 1990 hallmark ornament is indeed vintage.

The term "Antique" is generally attributed to an item that is at least 100 years old, but this can vary depending on the item. For example, Costume jewelry is antique at 50 years old (because it has a short lifespan) whereas Fine jewelry (precious metal) is antique at 100.

maxine*j · ‎09-14-2022

@bauble-babes wrote:
@collectfest "I am not a fan of 1990 hallmark ornaments described as vintage or antique."

An item is considered "Vintage" when it is at least 20 years old, so a 1990 hallmark ornament is indeed vintage.

The term "Antique" is generally attributed to an item that is at least 100 years old, but this can vary depending on the item. For example, Costume jewelry is antique at 50 years old (because it has a short lifespan) whereas Fine jewelry (precious metal) is antique at 100.

Maybe you define "vintage" as 20 years old, but others define it differently. "Vintage" has come to be used completely willy-nilly and is nearly meaningless as a result of that.

One thing I see is that people now use themselves as the center point for dating. People indicate something is antique by saying it was grandmother's. But grandmother could be 40 years old, or 70. People use vintage to mean remembered from childhood. But my childhood was in the 1940s, and and theirs was in the 1990s. I actually saw something listed with, "I was given this when I was a baby" -- as though that would date it for me!

I know we can't go back in time and undo things, but think how much confusion we'd have saved had we just stuck to original usagess: Vintage means "year" (orginally referring to wine) and the word is meaningless without a year. "That's a vintage 1963 Underwood Typewriter." Circa indicates an approximate date. "That house was built circa 1900."

I did not know that costume jewllery sellers now define "antique" as 50 years old. Many, if not most, American antiques dealers have used the "100 years" rule for antiques since the Smoot-Hawley Act of 1930 defined antiques to be that age for purposes of import-export regulation and tariffs.

It's true that antiques dealers in other countries don't necessarily use it, nor do American collectors of cars, rugs, or most Chinese artifacts, especially ceramics, and those who deal in books do not use the word at all. Now I learn there's another exception. I'm glad I'm getting out of this business while I still understand enough of the terminology to get by. 😄

Anyhow, I'm not trying to lecture. I just find it an interesting topic.

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juicydrupes · ‎09-14-2022

In the past, I've used "ivory colored" to sell a few cue balls...not sure I'd recommend that in light of the info in this post.

movieman630 · ‎09-14-2022

Word to the wise. Never list ANYTHING the "spirit of the age" considers offensive, protected or abusive. Ivory is a no no, Bone is a no no.

ANYTHING Native American that isn't made in China and isn't a T-Shirt Print is a No No.

Anything "Ebony", "Black Americana" or "African" that isn't made in China is a No No.

Nothing Name Brand, such as "Coach", Luis Vuitton", "Prada", etc if it's used or new and your name isn't "Macy's" or "Amazon".

Nothing with a "Swastika" even if it's the Hindu symbol.

Nothing with a confederate flag even if it's an authentic battle carried confederate flag that was passed down from generation to generation by your Union ancestor who captured it off the battlefield in 1863.

No "toy guns" even if they're 1" long unless they have an orange tip.

I could go on... Most of the above I've learned the hard way since I started selling on here 20 years ago. Now if I think there's a slight possibility that something may be "against policy" I don't list it. I won't even buy that kind of stuff to resell anymore. To risky and not worth the hassle.

Best to play it safe and just ignore that kind of stuff as if it doesn't exist. You'll be happier if you do.

cosmicvisitors · ‎09-14-2022

Just make an alternate account and sell on there. It won't be restricted. Ebay allows you to have as many accounts as you want. So long as one isn't suspended.