Global Shipping Damaged item Shipping Problem

[gjlutz]

I sent an item through global shipping and it was damaged during transit.  Usually  I have had no problem with getting reimbursed in the past for this, until now....  Buyer filed through Paypal as "not as described" instead of filing through Ebay, and because of this it has been a nightmare!  It has been 2 weeks, and now Paypal is saying another month to look into this??? My $200 in funds is being held, and I've called them twice with no luck.  They informed me that it should have gone through Ebay, (which I'm  aware of ), instead of them, but now there is nothing they can do about it.  My question is;  Is there a chance this will go wrong for me?  Why should it be different how they treat the case just because its Paypay and not Ebay?  I packed item extremely well and absolutely do not feel that this should be on me, nor do I feel the buyer should lose either.  If Global shipping is going to be so difficult to use, then I will not be using them anymore, not worth the risk.

[missjen831]

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@dtexley3 wrote:

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@ted_200 wrote:

Also in those FAQ's:

Who is responsible if the item is lost or damaged?

As between you and your buyer, the risk of loss or damage to a GSP item shall remain with you until the GSP item is accepted at the Global Shipping Center or has been returned to you by Pitney Bowes from the Global Shipping Center. As between your buyer and Pitney Bowes, risk of loss or damage to a GSP item shall transfer to your buyer from Pitney Bowes and/or its third party parcel processing service providers when the GSP item leaves the Global Shipping Center.

I have no idea if this stuff is binding, nor if it is contradicted or qualified with an escape hatch somewhere else.  There are enough mountains of weasel words covering this to keep an entire team of lawyers busy for a week.  But it looks to me like eBay/PayPal/PB don't want to live up to their obligations and they're Sgt. Schultz-ing sellers to avoid paying their liabilities under the program terms.   

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@Anonymous  This is straight from eBay's FAQ and are supposed to be an accurate representation of the policies.  Please explain how the seller is in any way responsible based on the guidance in the FAQ.

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I am pretty sure its going to fall under the same explanation given when we questioned WHY customer service advises sellers to ship to another address & assures them they have seller protection & they fail to mention that paypal will NOT cover the seller (because its not their job to educate on PP policy) nor do they recommend the seller check their payment processor to see if they will protected. I bet the answer here is that its the sellers job to check with their payment processor.

[Anonymous]

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@ittybitnot wrote:

 and we are not able to speak to the specifics of other resolution options a buyer may choose to use.

So it seems we are to assume the seller protections offered by the GSP simply do not exist if the buyer files a credit card SNAD complaint for damaged in shipping?   All this time, I was under the impression that a seller was not liable for such claims regardless of the funding source.  Won't be the first time I was ever wrong. Perhaps that explaination should be put in some policy somewhere to prevent the trial by fire issue we seem to see here.   

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Hi @ittybitnot, I apologize if my previous responses to this question have left any room for confusion. When I have discussed eBay protections only being available on eBay through the eBay Money Back Guarantee, I am clarifying that we cannot offer these protections when a chargeback is filed. A chargeback is not through eBay or the eBay Money Back Guarantee, but instead is filed through the buyer's financial institution. I don't want you to feel like you have to make any assumptions, as I have directly responded to this question within the thread to explain that our protections only extend to investigations on eBay. We do not offer protections for chargebacks under any circumstances. 

Though I understand that it has been requested for us to specifically mention the limitations of our protections on the Help Pages, we are not able to outline the many alternative options a buyer has to seek a refund for their purchase and it should be understood that all policies listed on eBay apply only to eBay. We have no authority to instruct other companies how to handle concerns from their customers as we are not the payment processor. Even the Payment Processor cannot instruct the financial institution how to address a customer concern, they simply work with the merchant in the investigation. PayPal would be the best resource on any questions regarding chargebacks as they are involved with the dispute the buyer has filed with their credit card company and have access to more details regarding the claim being made.

[bubbleman2010]

trinton so ebay along with PB are promising a service that in reality can't be delivered? What you're saying isn't what was in their press release today...

[bubbleman2010]

Heres the press release from today...   https://www.ecommercebytes.com/2018/05/01/ebay-global-shipping-program-keeps-pitney-bowes-on-board/

[ted_200]

I bet the answer here is that its the sellers job to check with their payment processor.

It better not be.  The TOS clearly states this problem is between the buyer and their contractor (Pitney Bowes), who they paid separately.   The seller has nothing to do with this, and as a party to the GSP the payment processor should be recovering the loss from the other party (PB).  The agreement clearly states the seller is not responsible, no matter how the payment was funded.

[ted_200]

I am clarifying that we cannot offer these protections when a chargeback is filed.

You already did offer them, you not only "offered" them, you are contractually obligated to it by the GSP TOS.  The only question at this point is whether "we" are going to honor that. 

[ted_200]

We have no authority to instruct other companies how to handle concerns from their customers as we are not the payment processor.

Your obligations per the TOS are not conditional on funding sources, and you mandated the payment processor who is clearly a party to the GSP.  eBay is not Pitney Bowes either, are you suggesting you have no means of making them perform either? 

[d-k_treasures]

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@bubbleman2010 wrote:

trinton so ebay along with PB are promising a service that in reality can't be delivered? What you're saying isn't what was in their press release today...

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Who is going to stay in the GSP if all someone needs to do is a chargeback and poof! You lost everything.

Glad I don't ship international at all anymore(well, since the ruin of here in 2008)!

[gjlutz]

Anyone know of any contract lawyers they could ask about this???

[lovtaco0]

@Anonymous, there should be an option within eBay for the seller to file a claim against the GSP so they can be made whole when this happens.

[Anonymous]

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@lovtaco0 wrote:

@Anonymous, there should be an option within eBay for the seller to file a claim against the GSP so they can be made whole when this happens.

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Hi @lovtaco0, while this is currently not an option I think it is a great suggestion and I will definitely pass this along for consideration!

@ted_200, @dtexley3 & @bubbleman2010 - as I stated earlier, our protections apply only to eBay. We do not offer protection for any avenues outside of eBay that your buyer takes to resolve a concern. This would include, but not be limited to, chargebacks filed with their financial institution. I am sorry if I have been unclear and, if there is any information that you have seen that indicates we offer this kind of protection, please let me know so I can get this addressed. When looking into these concerns I was unable to find any reference to protections we offer that extend outside of eBay.

[bubbleman2010]

Might run it by ebays vice president, B2C and Seller Experience and see what he thinks in the end he's the one thats  going to get all the heat.... Those facebook bloggers are a tough crowd...

[bubbleman2010]

Might even be a great idea to invite him to one of the weekly chats for a hour of Q&A...

[marnotom!]

I think it's important to remember that, as per the GSP Buyer Terms and Conditions, Pitney Bowes is the entity responsible for the Global Shipping Program.  eBay and PayPal offer seller protections associated with that program, but ultimately it comes down to whether Pitney Bowes is going to honour its responsibility for safe passage of GSP items once those items are in its possession.

@gjlutz, have you been in touch with Pitney Bowes about this at all yet?  Telephone contact may not be possible, but I did find an email address for them here.  I would send PBI an email with a few relevant details about the sale and ask if they are aware of an SNAD chargeback filed against them.  (They may decline to provide this info, of course.)  I would also ask how they intend to honour its terms and conditions insofar as your responsibility for safe passage of the item ending once the item is accepted at the Global Shipping Center.

Where is the buyer located?

[missjen831]

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@marnotom! wrote:

I think it's important to remember that, as per the GSP Buyer Terms and Conditions, Pitney Bowes is the entity responsible for the Global Shipping Program.  eBay and PayPal offer seller protections associated with that program, but ultimately it comes down to whether Pitney Bowes is going to honour its responsibility for safe passage of GSP items once those items are in its possession.

@gjlutz, have you been in touch with Pitney Bowes about this at all yet?  Telephone contact may not be possible, but I did find an email address for them here.  I would send PBI an email with a few relevant details about the sale and ask if they are aware of an SNAD chargeback filed against them.  (They may decline to provide this info, of course.)  I would also ask how they intend to honour its terms and conditions insofar as your responsibility for safe passage of the item ending once the item is accepted at the Global Shipping Center.

Where is the buyer located?

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It’s not PB that isn’t living up the terms. It’s eBay. And PayPal. Pitney Bowes isn’t going to help the seller. The seller doesn’t have a contract with pitneybows. eBay does. Contacting PB accomplishes nothing. They are the middle man.