Seller leaves feedback 1st.

[airmail3001]

I'm a buyer on Ebay not a seller. I leave feedback same day item arrives. I feel the seller should leave feedback as soon as payment is received. That's all the seller has to judge the transaction. If seller hasn't left it by the time I receive item I post F/B as normal but rate the communication section as low as it goes. 

[herecometheplayas]

Here are some of the things I do as a seller:

• Search for items to sell, either wholesale new or around the house or in thrift stores
• Check to see if there would be a profit, or how these items sell on eBay
• Purchase the items
• Clean them up if used
• Write a description, take measurements, check for problems so I can give the best description  possible, even though it is very likely that buyers will never read it 
• Take pictures of the item, along with any blemishes or flaws
• Buy envelopes, tape, bubble wrap, pick up or order Priority envelopes and boxes from the PO
• Ship the item out same or next day, including Saturdays. 
• Check prices weekly to see how the market is doing, or to decide if it's time for a little sale
• Answer questions from buyers, even though 99% of the time the answer is in the description
• Contact the post office when something goes missing, or when the buyer didn't get it when eBay's magic 8 ball told them they would get it. Even if it is now in the BUYER'S post office, they simply can't be bothered to do this themselves.

Thing you did as a buyer:

• Paid for my item. Not necessarily in a timely manner, because it is immediate payment required and you wouldn't have gotten it otherwise. 

For this, you expect a participation feedback immediately. One that hasn't meant one darn thing for 10 years now. I have a family to feed, a house to keep up, shopping, pets, a LIFE. I post feedback on my one day off - Sunday. YOU try selling over 120 items a week and tell me you would have plenty of time to drop everything to leave a shiny  feedback to a buyer.

I will say this, though, thnk you so much for posting!!

[auventera]

As a seller, I leave feedback after the buyer does. Always. Period. No exceptions. Sellers cannot leave negative for buyers but we can comment "Took 3 days to pay. Tried to cancel. PIA buyer." Give me a bunch of **bleep** throughout the sale and I'll leave the comments in your feedback. 

[castlemagicmemories]

Some just don't accept that feedback is voluntary.

[lgl11]

As a buyer, when I receive my item I leave feedback. I always have. For me, it's about getting the item I purchased. While getting feedback is always appreciated, it never has made or broken a transaction for me.

[gew6463]

Exactly!! Thank you for taking the time to write this. Buyers (unless they are legitimate sellers themselves) have NO idea how much work goes into the process. 

Sometimes during busy times I don't get to leaving feedback until a few days after buyers receive an item (and of course I don't leave it right after payment, because the transaction is NOT complete at that time). To think I could pack an item with great care, and deliver an excellent product in reasonable time, only to be given 1 star for 'communication' (feedback not being fast enough) is completely unreasonable IMO. 

[diralect]

Feedback is meant for just that purpose, feedback of the transaction.  Too many prideful or to use someone elses term "possible nefarious reason" driven sellers wait for a buyer to leave feedback.

The transaction is just that, the trading of goods, service or money for something (typically is equal or greater value) in return.  The case of eBay, it is money for services/goods.  Once the money is received by the buyer, there is nothing else (no matter how you spin it) that the buyer has to do concerning the TRANSACTION, however, the seller is to SHIP the item or provide the services.  That is to say, the seller has to obligate their responsibility(ies) of the TRANSACTION.

I don't know when it became any different, but, rest assured, I'm a buyer that will not leave feedback for a seller until I receive said feedback.  Why?  Because, my part in the TRANSACTION was done when I paid.  Did you not like the color of my money when you withdrew it from your bank?  Take it up with your bank!

When I first began so many years ago, I was the nice guy.  I would get the item from the seller (always in good condition, as I've been fortunate enough to have never gotten scammed if you believe that), give a positive feedback (because the sellers responsibility was over with and thus could be graded via feedback) but then noticed, I never got one in return.. and why would they?  The leverage is in the BUYERS hands, rest assured.  If every buyer would understand the aforementioned words I've shared above, this would never have become backwards from how it should be.

What would a "nefarious" situation be of a buyer?  They leave a negative feedback just because?  Does their negative feedback have a matching PayPal claim?  Was said claim accepted/processed and found in favor of the buyer?  Well, sounds like the seller wouldn't have a leg to stand on, nor should be surprised by the negative feedback.  Think PayPal's system is flawed?  Then take it up with PayPal!  Stop using the buyers feedback as a bargaining chip.

What's to stop a seller from never leaving a feedback even after the buyer leaves one, regardless if it's a positive feedback with 5 stars... oh, nothing.. because "the buyer got theirs..."

But, unfortunately, in this world of complacency, too many weak minded buyers will continue to leave feedback for a buyer first and so long as that continues, despite a buyers TRANSACTIONAL responsibilities being over with upon payment (which is what the feedback is based on the TRANSACTION, they are NOT inter-changable).  Thus, nothing will change.

I'll continue to do as I have done.  And deserving buyers (again in my 19 years of eBaying I think it's been?) will continue to earn positive feedback from me, so long as their service (auction description matching the product received, the speed in which it was received in accordance with said auction, etc, etc.) matches that of the auction and if they left me feedback based on MY obligation of the TRANSACTION.  As a buyer alone, I must have lost out on 20 feedbacks because I was stupid enough to leave a positive feedback before receiving it.  Go figure.

TL;DR - Nothing will change until the buyers change it (back to where it used to be!).  Sellers have this sense of entitlement, that I never had when I was a seller.  Good luck and my flame suit is all buttoned up, rest assured.

[brum4devon]

I tend to find majority of sellers leave feedback but without fail the ones who don't are sellers where I have not had other bidders go against me and the item has gone for the minimum bid.

I always assume they are disappointed by this and having to go post the item for no profit. Naturally rightly or wrongly they can't be bothered to leave feedback in those circumstances. 

[castlemagicmemories]

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@mikeystoyz wrote:

With this being the 100th post, please, remember, ok top of page 6 101th post 😉  

FEEDBACK IS 100% VOLUNTARY!!!!!!

@mikeystoyz

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Mike, I know that.  The situation in this post was buyers practicing feedback extortion.  Threatening bad feedback if they don't get what they want.  That is against Ebay policy and reportable.  

Here is the post again:

@marigoldzcloset wrote:
Everyone one this thread who is defending the not leaving feedback claim....has clearly never experienced being extorted via feedback threats. buyers have done this many times to me. They use it as leverage. I hope it happens less and less and you dont experience it. However, when you do, you will understand.

Sorry this is happening to you.  You can report those buyers for feedback extortion; hopefully you are.

Add Tags...

[castlemagicmemories]

@marigoldzcloset wrote:
Everyone one this thread who is defending the not leaving feedback claim....has clearly never experienced being extorted via feedback threats. buyers have done this many times to me. They use it as leverage. I hope it happens less and less and you dont experience it. However, when you do, you will understand.

Sorry this is happening to you.  You can report those buyers for feedback extortion; hopefully you are.

[castlemagicmemories]

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@diralect wrote:

Feedback is meant for just that purpose, feedback of the transaction.  Too many prideful or to use someone elses term "possible nefarious reason" driven sellers wait for a buyer to leave feedback.

The transaction is just that, the trading of goods, service or money for something (typically is equal or greater value) in return.  The case of eBay, it is money for services/goods.  Once the money is received by the buyer, there is nothing else (no matter how you spin it) that the buyer has to do concerning the TRANSACTION, however, the seller is to SHIP the item or provide the services.  That is to say, the seller has to obligate their responsibility(ies) of the TRANSACTION.

I don't know when it became any different, but, rest assured, I'm a buyer that will not leave feedback for a seller until I receive said feedback.  Why?  Because, my part in the TRANSACTION was done when I paid.  Did you not like the color of my money when you withdrew it from your bank?  Take it up with your bank!

When I first began so many years ago, I was the nice guy.  I would get the item from the seller (always in good condition, as I've been fortunate enough to have never gotten scammed if you believe that), give a positive feedback (because the sellers responsibility was over with and thus could be graded via feedback) but then noticed, I never got one in return.. and why would they?  The leverage is in the BUYERS hands, rest assured.  If every buyer would understand the aforementioned words I've shared above, this would never have become backwards from how it should be.

What would a "nefarious" situation be of a buyer?  They leave a negative feedback just because?  Does their negative feedback have a matching PayPal claim?  Was said claim accepted/processed and found in favor of the buyer?  Well, sounds like the seller wouldn't have a leg to stand on, nor should be surprised by the negative feedback.  Think PayPal's system is flawed?  Then take it up with PayPal!  Stop using the buyers feedback as a bargaining chip.

What's to stop a seller from never leaving a feedback even after the buyer leaves one, regardless if it's a positive feedback with 5 stars... oh, nothing.. because "the buyer got theirs..."

But, unfortunately, in this world of complacency, too many weak minded buyers will continue to leave feedback for a buyer first and so long as that continues, despite a buyers TRANSACTIONAL responsibilities being over with upon payment (which is what the feedback is based on the TRANSACTION, they are NOT inter-changable).  Thus, nothing will change.

I'll continue to do as I have done.  And deserving buyers    SELLERS (again in my 19 years of eBaying I think it's been?) will continue to earn positive feedback from me, so long as their service (auction description matching the product received, the speed in which it was received in accordance with said auction, etc, etc.) matches that of the auction and if they left me feedback based on MY obligation of the TRANSACTION.  As a buyer alone, I must have lost out on 20 feedbacks because I was stupid enough to leave a positive feedback before receiving it.  Go figure.

TL;DR - Nothing will change until the buyers change it (back to where it used to be!).  Sellers have this sense of entitlement, that I never had when I was a seller.  Good luck and my flame suit is all buttoned up, rest assured.

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To clarify, the buyer's part is NOT done when they pay, that is the point.  All bad buyer behavior can happen AFTER they pay, and many sellers feel that they don't want to reward that bad behavior with a positive.  They would prefer to not leave any feedback rather than leave dishonest feedback.

Buyer can negotiate prices post delivery, threaten negative feedback if they don't get their way, file a false SNAD to get them to pay return shipping, send back a rock instead of the item, or their old, broken item, harass them, etc.  

Nothing is to stop either party from not leaving feedback as feedback is voluntary.  It is not owed either party.  Buyer pays, seller ships.  That is all that is required!

It's really not a sense of entitlement.  A sense of entitlement is thinking you are owed feedback or that the other party has to "go first".  This is in response to the fact that sellers can no longer honestly rate a buyer's behavior, as they can no longer receive negs.  True, many sellers posted false, retaliatory negs on buyers in response to the buyer's honest neg, and that is why Ebay eliminated negs for buyers.

There is nothing weak minded about the buyer who leaves feedback first.  Actually that is how it was supposed to work for many, many years.  You would expect to pay for anything you want to buy so why would that be something noteworthy for feedback.  Buyer leaves feedback first to indicate the transaction is fine, then seller reciprocates.  This changed in 2008 and became just a thank you, with the most rank scammer looking the same as the most responsible Ebay buyer, with the result that buyers no longer get truly meaningful feedback.

BTW I'm a buyer but I understand both sides.

[nowthatsjustducky]

Necro thread from April.

Just an FYI.

[gew6463]

An excellent explanation! 

[soh.maryl]

No buyer can possibly have "numerous or negative items" in his history because buyers can only be given positive FB.

[mudshark61369]

@diralect,

I usually do not reply more than once or twice to feedback topics, but you've basically started a new one, that will probably get another 6 pages of responses.

"When I first began so many years ago, I was the nice guy.  I would get the item from the seller I would get the item from the seller (always in good condition, as I've been fortunate enough to have never gotten scammed if you believe that),  give a positive feedback (because the sellers responsibility was over with and thus could be graded via feedback)".

As castlemagic wrote, The underlined portion of the quote is almost exactly how ebay use to suggest feedback was supposed to work?  

 "...but then noticed, I never got one in return.. and why would they?  The leverage is in the BUYERS hands, rest assured.  If every buyer would understand the aforementioned words I've shared above, this would never have become backwards from how it should be". 

Don't blame seller's for the "backward slide", blame ebay.  They changed the suggestion on how feedback should be done, and they are the ones who stopped buyers from receiving honest nonpositive feedback when deserved not the sellers.  Because of that many seller's opted out of feedback, or continued on  doing things according to the original suggestion. 

What gets me is that you feel feedback can be used as a club to get something that is not a part of any transaction, namely feedback.

I see you have left 483 feedback as both a buyer and seller, and have received from both 476 feedback.  I would say you are making a mountain out of a mole hill over 7 feedback. On this buying only ID, I've left 4,951 and received 4,601. I should be the one crying, I'd love to get that Green star before I die... NOT! 

It doesn't matter any more, because sellers do not care how many feedback a buyer has, they are all positives now, but how many nonpositives a buyer leaves.

  "Nothing will change until the buyers change it (back to where it used to be!).  Sellers have this sense of entitlement, that I never had when I was a seller". 

PLEASE,  as a buyer help change it back. If you're happy with a transaction, leave feedback once you realize that you're satisfied.  Maybe your sense of entitlement is what is causing you not to get more feedback. I don't look to see if I have received feedback or not before leaving it for sellers. If I'm happy I leave feedback sometimes in batches, if I'm not happy I give a seller a chance to work things out. 

I challenge you to go to several high volume sellers profile pages (the ones most likely to leave feedback first at payment), and look at how many were left for them vs. how many they left for buyers. The disparity is often 50% less than the number of feedback left by the sellers. 

I tried the suggestion to leave feedback first as a seller, and my received ratio went from receiving 90+% to 60% in nothing flat.  I went back to the original suggestion and am back to over 90% again, but because of my failed 6 month experiment  my overall percentage of received feedback is 72%. 

[castlemagicmemories]

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@gew6463 wrote:

An excellent explanation! 

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Thank you!

[castlemagicmemories]

There is a very simple thing that buyers can do to get feedback  but it is often overlooked.

LEAVE FEEDBACK!  Don't get upset about a seller who hasn't left you feedback, leave them feedback, and you JUST MIGHT get a feedback in response.  If not, it only took a few seconds of your time.

This stand off on feedback is really very easily and simply resolved~and if it isn't, remember it is NOT part of the transaction, not guaranteed to anyone as it is VOLUNTARY!