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What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

ebay says you can ship trading cards in a plastic sleeve, yet the envelope can't be too rigid. How does one accomplish this? I've received cards in a protector, in a hard cardboard mailer as an ebay standard envelope, yet have gone to mail a paper envelope with cards in it and been questioned at the Post Office. If the envelope is stiff enough to prevent bending the cards, how can it not be rigid? Does any one know the fine line here? Thanks

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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

Unfortunately there is no fine line, the line is pretty blurry

 

The vague term "not too rigid" leaves it up to the judgement of whatever mail sorter that's handling your item when going through the system.

 

I can see how one mail handler might see an envelope with a plastic top loader as too rigid and most would just send it through with no problem

 

 

Message 2 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

Yes, this has bugged me since the ESE started. I have learned (I think) recently that the package does not need to bend much at all to qualify. On another thread I mentioned that I was going to test the 5x7 flat eBay pasteboard mailer  to see if it is machinable. This test is in process but the package has not arrived at the buyer's location  yet. I have been using, exclusively, plain white envelopes with postcards so far.

 

Our postmaster told me that the state issues auto license plates in a machinable (in this case pre-sort) envelope without any problems. She held my 5x7 mailer in her hands and proclaimed it to be OK. She pointed out that, in the past, machinable items had to bend much more than they do today. Coincidentally, a few days later I did indeed receive my two new license plates in such an envelope. And you know those aluminum plates don't bend very much, and they are much longer than the envelopes we are talking about.

 

There seems to be more leeway there than I was led to believe but am still awaiting the results of my test.

 

In the meantime, any method that seems to work for others should work for us all.

Message 3 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

A few years back I saw a postal machine on TV during a report on holiday mail.  Letters were bent in a U around a roller that looked about 1 1/4 inch in diameter.  In one side and turned 180 degrees and back out.

 

They must have had a way to keep credit cards out of it.

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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??


@caracy wrote:

 

What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??
 
 

 

@caracy, In practice, it's up to the postal workers to decide this.

 

Here's a link to the official instructions that are provided for the postal workers to base their decisions on. This has a lot of information, about other aspects of machinable mail as well as the rigidity, and the rigidity test does depend on the size of the envelope.

 

For full information, you can read the document here. In brief, for envelopes that are less than 10" long (in the longest dimension), they have to pass this test in both directions (lengthwise and widthwise):

 

https://pe.usps.com/archive/pdf/dmmarchive20080512/101.pdf

 

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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

I always bring my items to the post office. The clerk today mentioned the "flex test" over the edge of the counter. Well, there go your cards! So, what... put a hard sleeve on each end of an envelope and let it go floppy in the middle??? LOL! Its such a crap shoot. I may stop using it. The tracking is iffy as well.

Message 6 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

Yes I have experience a rejection of the ebay standard envelope for being too rigid. That means I cannot send valuable post cards or collectible items. I need to make sure that Post Cards do not get bent when being shipped. So now I am going to go through my listed items and do first class shipping on those kind of things. I just changed them all to the Standard Envelope yesterday. No free shipping for customers, or raise my price to include shipping.

Message 7 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

I ship some light weight items in 14x10 tyvek envelopes. With 2 pieces of cardboard that are 12X9. Before the item, the envelope and the 2 cardboard sheets only weigh 2.55 ounces. So something like a post card or a trading card cane easily be shipped at the lowest first class package rate. I also use some 9X8 padded envelopes from Ebay that I received as free shipping supplies. Wit 2 sheets of cardboard to protect the item, they would be perfect for post cards or trading cards. And they are definitely packages. 

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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

This shipping service sounds great and all, but the postal service is not equipped to process these types of packages until they come up with new fulfillment procedures.

 

What I've seen, most of my purchased orders arrive in a toploader and sometimes in a toploader sandwhiched between two flat cardboard pieces. For my sale orders, I use just a toploader, and it works every time.

 

The biggest issue with this service is, about 2-5% of my orders sent out do not have any confirmed deliveries. The customer gets them usually and all is well, until you get a customer who opens a claim for an item not received when they actually did recieve it in hopes to get a card they like for free. It's basically theft, but I'm honestly not even upset and don't blame them.

 

Bottom line is, do not use this service for higher value cards. If you can afford a small percentage of your stock going missing due to this service, or if the price of the service outweighs the cons, then it's actually not too shabby.

Message 9 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

I have went round and round with the USPS and eBay about this. I've even finally gotten through to upper management in USPS Business and Mailing Solutions with little to no answer. After a week, the USPS got back to me and stated they have no idea what the eBy Standard Envelope is. All of this was pver a year ago. I spent over three hours on the phone with eBay and got the same response. I believe this entire trainwreck was hatched by two or more management individuals and set into motion. NO communication has been passed down to USPS employees that do the majority of the process. 

My local post office has a few over zealous employees that continually refuse and return my purchases shipped with ESE 51 cent and 53 cent postage. I've also picked up the mail and observed a little envelope from the USPS asking me for additional postage for all these 51 cent and 53 cent ESE's. AS upset as I am, they are simply doing what they're trained to do. I'm pretty critical of our precious US government but just about all of us rely on the USPS so it's probably best not to make waves.

ALL of this stems from the "non-machineable" category that these envelopes fit into. But eBay has also ventured into another toxic mess when they say you can mail coins with an ESE. We all know coins will not bend so this entire process is a farce. Unless eBay fixes it correctly, we will always be stuck with this as it is. I end up sending a message to every seller when I purchase a card stating that I wish to have the envelope shipped with the 2 ounce or 3 ounce option because it covers the additional postage. When I ship, I always use the 2 ounce or 3 ounce option. This entire program would have been a success if everyone involved in the rollout would have put a bit more thought into it.

EBay, if you want to hire me to fix your mess, I'd be happy to have it corrected within a week. Please message me.

Message 10 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

ESE shipments are not non-machineable, they have to go through the sorting machines to get any scans or tracking

 

As for coins, I've shipped all coins on this ID purchased within USA with ESE for about a year with few problems

 

If a shipment is claimed as "lost" and has any tracking beyond "label created" you can file a claim with the insurance included with the service, I've had to file 2 and both were paid quickly

 

The non-machineable surcharge some buyers are getting hit with is the result of individual mail handlers interpretation of the vague "not too rigid" specification. I can se how a hard plastic toploader could be seen as too rigid by some while others would just let it pass

Message 11 of 12
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Re: What constitutes "not too rigid" on an ebay standard envelope for trading cards??

I had an invitation sized envelope with 1 card returned today for postage due.  It met all the requirements for size and weight and thickness.  The postal worker of 40 years told me if the item is to stiff, (rigid) the machine can't process it and it gets kicked back at a different rate . So it needs to be somewhat flexible but not that flexible to affect the card condition. I have not been happy with the Ebay standard envelop format. Items not showing up delivered which have been, some not showing any updates, lots of headaches. 

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