eBay

atlantafamilyjewelers · ‎05-21-2018

If buyers now select "Does not work or defective" as their reason for the return, the amount of proof offered to the contrary is now void, according to eBays new policy of their user agreement, and a "default" response of returning the item is initiated. Additionally, this affects seller level, which affects listing visibility, which affects sales figures.

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That is what was explained to me by one of the customer service managers over the phone after such a case was ruled against my store. He told me that Amazon is the number one seller of online goods and that part of why they are successful is because they offer a 60 day, no hassle return policy on items purchased from them. It was then implied that eBay is trying to compete with Amazon by gearing their policies in favor of returns. In my opinion this violates the liberties of sellers, and is probably not a violation of eBay policies, but still seems like injustice, and a store like my own can no longer securely adhere to a reasonable no-returns policy because of this loophole.

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This new policy potentially enables buyers to commit fraud and could be seen as a failure of eBay to uphold their fiduciary responsibility to both the buyer and the seller equally. Speaking with a lawyer, he said this sounds like a potentially legitimate class action lawsuit. Such a lawsuit would take exorbitant time and financial resources, making it prohibitive for an average person like myself, but it seems to be something eBay is getting away with that needs to change.

hvytoys2000 · ‎05-23-2018

with some of our experiences here on ebay we would be interested in joining into the class action lawsuit were you to start one.

atlantafamilyjewelers · ‎05-23-2018

My first concern with returns has been that eBay has no experts to properly evaluate the return cases. I'm an expert in my field, with 44+ years of experience, and I'm allready realizing that eBay is setting up the buyer to commit fraud. All but one of our returns has been fraud on behalf of the buyer! They lied to get their returns, and one person went as far as saying, "the entire piece was fake". We thought they were going to ship back a fake item! Instead, they shipped back our piece, that now has a credential card from a "Graduate Gemologist", establishing its' authenticity. Still, as a store we got "DINGED" by eBay on our seller level. This frustrates the heck out of our boss! If I ran eBay, in the arena of jewelry, I would have the seller ship the item to an established eBay location, then have our onsight expert check the item, and then make a ruling. (Instead, we have a person that does not understand the item and struggles with the English language, make the decision. All this for the sake of profitability!) If the buyer was wrong, their account is dinged, and they pay all shipping costs. If the seller was wrong, then the buyer has to accept the return and covers shipping expenses! In our field, we have items of higher value, so there is room to do this, but it may not be cost effective in eBay items that are inexpensive! Most problems have solutions, but eBay is setting up the seller to commit fraud, to get their return. The seller is the Loser, and is Harmed....... The buyer is learning what to say, or not to say, to get their return!

atlantafamilyjewelers · ‎05-23-2018

Correction: The seller has to accept the return, if the sellers item was not correct, and pays the all shipping expenses!

alimcgee7 · ‎05-23-2018

Thats the thing... the few.. and I mean few times ebay has agreed and said I was right, they covered the bill.. they still gave the buyer their money, though didnt make me pay it. This happened a couple of times. This really infuriates me, because I have had times where ebay just gave them their money back and let them keep the item, how is that discouraging their ridiculous complaints?

Its essentially telling them they were right, and now they get to keep it AND get their money. Granted, I didnt lose my $$ but it still reinforced this behavior from buyers. I highly doubt today ebay would cover any refunds, and they certainly wouldnt ever on a high priced item.

I have had people return different items as well.. but I cant prove they werent the right item because it was similar enough as far as random ebay employee was concerned it was the same thing, but I knew, and the buyer knew the item I sent them was worth 3 times the value of the one they returned as "inauthentic".

robot-hands · ‎05-24-2018

@cs43ls wrote:
The new " automated return " starting in Sept. will not even ask anyone to approve a return. If I understand it right, Ebay will auto approve return requests immediately and send the buyer a label (paid by seller) I did not see anything how this will affect sellers that have a no return policy.

According to Ebay, this is to increase efficiancy and shorten the turn-around time . I guess we can offer the same item more often, and with any luck make enough money for the postoffice and Ebay fees. I dont see how there is going to be anything left for my business. Its bad enough as it is ,but with all those new requirements and changes, I see a lot of problems ahead.

Yeah, beacuse amazon is all the people that got kicked off ebay.

Ebay is now making policy because of the bad sellers they got rid of to match amazons policy for dealing with those same sellers.

Makes no sense, just one more loss to sellers in the War of Inches ebay wages upon us every update.

dugoldstuff · ‎05-24-2018

What eBay may not understand is that AMAZON ships a seller's merchandise using AMAZON employees. They know what is sent out. Then, returns are handled by AMAZON employees. They know what comes back. If what comes back is not what was sent out, or if it is broken, cannibalized or was used, AMAZON can detect the fraud immediately and not refund money. Indeed, AMAZON is now going to suspend accounts of frequent returners, per recent news stories.

But, eBay wants to mimic AMAZON return policies without an AMAZON-type system in place. WE send our stuff out and WE receive it back, but eBay won't believe us since we aren't its employees. Therefore, there is no safeguard against fraud. Thus, to have AMAZON-type return policies without AMAZON-type system in place means the seller loses his item and his money in cases of fraud.

How are sellers going to want to bring their merchandise here if this is now the business model?

mysticlake007 · ‎05-24-2018

MAY????

PLEASE - I'LL BET MY LIFE ON IT!!!

mysticlake007 · ‎05-24-2018

@atlantafamilyjewelers wrote:
If buyers now select "Does not work or defective" as their reason for the return, the amount of proof offered to the contrary is now void, according to eBays new policy of their user agreement, and a "default" response of returning the item is initiated. Additionally, this affects seller level, which affects listing visibility, which affects sales figures.
.
That is what was explained to me by one of the customer service managers over the phone after such a case was ruled against my store. He told me that Amazon is the number one seller of online goods and that part of why they are successful is because they offer a 60 day, no hassle return policy on items purchased from them. It was then implied that eBay is trying to compete with Amazon by gearing their policies in favor of returns. In my opinion this violates the liberties of sellers, and is probably not a violation of eBay policies, but still seems like injustice, and a store like my own can no longer securely adhere to a reasonable no-returns policy because of this loophole.
.
This new policy potentially enables buyers to commit fraud and could be seen as a failure of eBay to uphold their fiduciary responsibility to both the buyer and the seller equally. Speaking with a lawyer, he said this sounds like a potentially legitimate class action lawsuit. Such a lawsuit would take exorbitant time and financial resources, making it prohibitive for an average person like myself, but it seems to be something eBay is getting away with that needs to change.

Remember me if you find a way to file a class-action - I'll be happy to join you!!!

56dodge2500 · ‎05-25-2018

I was shocked tonight when forced to accept a return on day 30 because the buyer claimed "Not Work or Defective" and without providing proof of defect. The Ebay rep I talked tonight said they take they buyers word when using defect not working claim, Rep could not tell me why buyers are not required to provide even minial proof of a problme, I guess something easy like taking a photo to give to Ebay to help prove a defect to hard for they buyer.. Alspo was told if a buyer claims Not Working or Defective and you have a 14 day return Ebay can force you to accept the return, not fair to seller when buyer does not have to provide proof of any kind...

dugoldstuff · ‎05-25-2018

I am wondering if the new policy, that eBay will automatically settle all disputes in the buyer's favor even if the buyer has patently committed fraud, with, additionally, eBay keeping the seller's FVF fees, is a violation of the RICO Act?

sai83her · ‎05-25-2018

Welcome to the real world.

castlemagicmemories · ‎05-25-2018

I believe this happened because sellers put that they accepted returns in their listings, but fought buyers tooth and nail over a return, even a legitimate SNAD return. All they wanted was increased visibility and more sales because of the false sense of security the fact that they took returns would give buyers. While the possibility exists that a buyer might take advantage of this, there is also the possibility the buyer is being truthful.

All buyers are scammers and there is no such thing as a legitimate SNAD.

Sellers who say they take returns, take returns. And if you take no returns, not as described overrides your no returns policy.

Many sellers feel that buyers are committing fraud because they are of the opinion that all buyers are scammers and there is no such thing as a legitimate SNAD.

castlemagicmemories · ‎05-25-2018

@56dodge2500 wrote:
I was shocked tonight when forced to accept a return on day 30 because the buyer claimed "Not Work or Defective" and without providing proof of defect. The Ebay rep I talked tonight said they take they buyers word when using defect not working claim, Rep could not tell me why buyers are not required to provide even minial proof of a problme, I guess something easy like taking a photo to give to Ebay to help prove a defect to hard for they buyer.. Alspo was told if a buyer claims Not Working or Defective and you have a 14 day return Ebay can force you to accept the return, not fair to seller when buyer does not have to provide proof of any kind...

Actually, to clarify, whether or not you have a return policy, you are required to accept a return for SNAD under the Ebay MBG; or you can just refund without requiring a return. Ebay's MBG overrides your no returns policy.

mysticlake007 · ‎05-27-2018

@dugoldstuff wrote:
What eBay may not understand is that AMAZON ships a seller's merchandise using AMAZON employees. They know what is sent out. Then, returns are handled by AMAZON employees. They know what comes back. If what comes back is not what was sent out, or if it is broken, cannibalized or was used, AMAZON can detect the fraud immediately and not refund money. Indeed, AMAZON is now going to suspend accounts of frequent returners, per recent news stories.

But, eBay wants to mimic AMAZON return policies without an AMAZON-type system in place. WE send our stuff out and WE receive it back, but eBay won't believe us since we aren't its employees. Therefore, there is no safeguard against fraud. Thus, to have AMAZON-type return policies without AMAZON-type system in place means the seller loses his item and his money in cases of fraud.

How are sellers going to want to bring their merchandise here if this is now the business model?

Amazon is BANNING customers with too many returns - where do you think they are going to go now???

foxbusiness.com/markets/amazon-bans-customers-who-make-too-many-returns-report

crushbrickandmortar · ‎05-27-2018

Agreed, been problems, looks like this will be more problems. Again this is eBay going with the buyer (without questions at all), Without any concern for their sellers.