eBay

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-26-2018

Hope you will will forgive me if I'm unnecessarily starting a new thread...

After nearly 3 weeks of almost unbearable anticipation, my package had arrived with the promised fragrance and a few generous samples from the seller's collection that came as part of a deal that involved me selecting the "Buy it Now" option. A veteran eBayer with a perfect record and red star rating, I wasn't surprised to see how well packed everything was after I had opened the box.

Long story short, the atomizer on the main bottle was stuck when I tried spraying it on my arm for the first time. I only get what feels like half a spray and a weird clicking sound (I know this particular fragrance sprays a pretty decent mist by looking at youtube videos). And since I don't get a proper mist, the fragrance tends to dribble down my skin after making contact (not good!) The unique bottle design means I am unable to pop it off and see what the problem is like is possible on some other fragrance bottles (i.e. for decanting purposes)

The batch code checks out so it's not a fake, and the only saving grace is that it does smell amazing; but that's beside the point!

I contacted the buyer about this problem and was quickly assured that it was working just fine before.

Considering how well-packed everything was, it's hard to imagine this sort of damage happening enroute. Shipping was carried out by our respective countries' local courrier services as part of the EMS program.

What are my options with regards to the eBay Money Back Guarantee Policy. I'm not intending on returning the product.

Sorry for the long post! Any advice would be much appreciated!

Thanks!

mam98031 · ‎11-26-2018

To me it sounds like it is clogged up a bit. Since this is a second hand fragrance, it is hard to say how it was used or how it was stored. Both of which could be partially to blame.

Without seeing the bottle, I might suggest getting a fine pin and try inserting it into the channel to see if you can dislodge the potential problem. You might dip the pin in achohol, white vinegar a little vodka for cleaning. Hopefully if you can find a way to clear the channel that will take care of the problem.

Since you say it does spray, you just feel it should be a broader spray, it is possible that your seller did not realize there was an issue.

Hopefully this will do the trick for you.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-27-2018

@mam98031 wrote:
To me it sounds like it is clogged up a bit. Since this is a second hand fragrance, it is hard to say how it was used or how it was stored. Both of which could be partially to blame.

Without seeing the bottle, I might suggest getting a fine pin and try inserting it into the channel to see if you can dislodge the potential problem. You might dip the pin in achohol, white vinegar a little vodka for cleaning. Hopefully if you can find a way to clear the channel that will take care of the problem.

Since you say it does spray, you just feel it should be a broader spray, it is possible that your seller did not realize there was an issue.

Hopefully this will do the trick for you.

Thank you for your message!

The seller reassured me before I pulled the trigger that he stored all his fragrances in a cool dark closet. This is what we're dealing with here (some pics from the internet):

I will take up your advice. The seller is quite the fragrance afficianado, so I doubt he was unaware of the issue!

Few questions:

-The atomizer "half" works, and since it's a rare fragrance I do intend to keep it!

-I was hoping to be compensated by either the seller or eBay. It's my impression by reading the Money Back Guarantee policy that the onus to do so would fall on the seller as he had arranged the shipment method???

-Would it be fair to open a not as described case if it indeed was working fine before he had shipped it?

-Would it be realistic to privately negotiate for a partial refund and no return, or could eBay look into the case and provide compensation for the damage instead?

Thanks!

mam98031 · ‎11-27-2018

The atomizer "half" works, and since it's a rare fragrance I do intend to keep it!

Invictus Aqua is not a rare fragrance. It was released in 2016. It is a relatively new scent.

-I was hoping to be compensated by either the seller or eBay. It's my impression by reading the Money Back Guarantee policy that the onus to do so would fall on the seller as he had arranged the shipment method???

It is not Ebay's responsibility to give you some discount. Ebay is the site in which all of us sellers sell on. Ebay did not sell you anything.

By your own admission, you did not think this was damaged in the shipment, so why would you expect the seller to give you some money back due to the shipping method they used. You also said it was very well packed.

If you want a refund, then offer to ship the item back for a full refund. Your seller will let you do that as it is covered by the Money Back Guarantee.

-Would it be fair to open a not as described case if it indeed was working fine before he had shipped it?

Yes you can do this. Your seller will likely provide you with a shipping label so you can ship it back to them for refund.

-Would it be realistic to privately negotiate for a partial refund and no return, or could eBay look into the case and provide compensation for the damage instead?

Why? What good is that going to do you? Ebay isn't going to give you any money! You can return the item because you don't feel is sprays properly. Your seller thought it was fine. You have a difference of opinion, so if you are unhappy with your purchase, return it.

It is not Ebay's responsibility to give you some discount. Ebay is the site in which all of us sellers sell on. Ebay did not sell you anything.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-27-2018

Thank you so much for the quick reply! I also appreciate the blunt nature of your message... getting to the point is something I struggle with!

You're right about Invictus Aqua being a new and mainstream frag, but they discontinued it and the 2018 version was a reformulation, hence the reason why people who loved the original are willing to pay "astronomical" amounts to get their hands on the "vintage" version. My amateur nose may not have been able to discern the difference, but my OCD took over and I told myself that I had to get the "glorious" original!

Am I right in my understanding that the when eBay says that should negotiations about a return and "full" refund breakdown with the seller that that will be when they step in and "enforce" a full refund after looking into the case and on the condition of return of product? So, it's either keep it or return it.

fern*wood · ‎11-27-2018

How was this fragrance shipped? It is my understanding they can't go via air service, and since you are in Japan, I wonder where it was purchased from.

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-27-2018

@fern*wood wrote:
How was this fragrance shipped? It is my understanding they can't go via air service, and since you are in Japan, I wonder where it was purchased from.

thank you for your message!

You're right as far as hazardous and in this case flammable contents are concerned, courier services can often reject transporting perfume via air or even ground for that matter. This is especially the case if you are a private person sending only one or two bottles. Insurance is often out of the question, even for the likes of UPS, DHL, etc.

Large distribution companies that have long-term contracts with the likes of UPS, have no problem shipping dangerous goods via air service.

The fragrance was purchased from Israel.

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-27-2018

I may have been to quick to simplify my options down to keep it or return it...

It would be great to get your take on what this person on another board has had to say:

The Money Back Guarantee Policy (which is the first thing you should read) says they can, but I don't believe we have ever heard of its happening. I imagine that they mean this to apply when the two parties have agreed a partial refund, and the seller fails to actually pay it. So it is probably possible to have a partial refund only if both parties agree that it is in their interests., which it may well be.

Not as described depends on what you receive, not the way it left the seller, even if that is true. It would certainly apply to postal damage, and overheating might do it. If you win, the Money Back Guarantee says a seller must pay for return postage if he wants the item back, and although he can't supply a prepaid label through eBay, nothing in the policy lets him out of that obligation. So it makes sense to give a partial refund.

It is possible to agree a partial refund without opening a case. If you do open one, it would have to be a misdescription case, in which you (or indeed he) cold suggest a partial refund, bargain about it, etc. But he could insist on a complete return and refund if he wants to. I can't think why he would, though.

If it is the kind of atomiser that is actually a little pump, a partial refund would probably make it worthwhile to decant it into another bottle, or graft in the spray device from one. Or do whatever people did with cologne before atomisers were invented. A pressurised aerosol is trickier. You might be able to rig up some device to spray it into another bottle with the ordinary nozzle removed. But I wouldn't risk puncturing it.

lintbrush* · ‎11-27-2018

The Money Back Guarantee provides you with coverage to either receive what you ordered or to be made whole. It does not cover partial refunds.

If the seller wants the item back in order to issue a refund, they will need to provide you with return shipping up front.

If you open a return request (for not as described), the seller can offer you a partial refund, but they do not have to. They simply have to make you whole to abide by eBay's policy. If they choose Return for Refund, you have to ship it back to get your refund. If you keep it, that's fine too... but you won't be entitled to any monies.

Bottom line is how much do you want to keep the 'original' formula one (as you say it's very hard to come by)

You can open the return. You can say in your message to seller that you'd be willing to keep it for a partial refund, but if they don't want to do that, you will return it (and you have to mean it).

Sellers run into partial refund scam attempts all the time. If your seller has had it happen to them, they make think your "I'll settle for a partial" offer is just that. If you don't send it back (once they approve a return), you only strengthen their feelings. But not all sellers feel that way either. If you can prove that it doesn't spray properly (hard to do for a perfume without creating a video), they may be more than willing to issue a partial refund.

nicholashiraishilennaert-0 · ‎11-27-2018

@lintbrush* wrote:
The Money Back Guarantee provides you with coverage to either receive what you ordered or to be made whole. It does not cover partial refunds.

If the seller wants the item back in order to issue a refund, they will need to provide you with return shipping up front.

If you open a return request (for not as described), the seller can offer you a partial refund, but they do not have to. They simply have to make you whole to abide by eBay's policy. If they choose Return for Refund, you have to ship it back to get your refund. If you keep it, that's fine too... but you won't be entitled to any monies.

Bottom line is how much do you want to keep the 'original' formula one (as you say it's very hard to come by)

You can open the return. You can say in your message to seller that you'd be willing to keep it for a partial refund, but if they don't want to do that, you will return it (and you have to mean it).

Sellers run into partial refund scam attempts all the time. If your seller has had it happen to them, they make think your "I'll settle for a partial" offer is just that. If you don't send it back (once they approve a return), you only strengthen their feelings. But not all sellers feel that way either. If you can prove that it doesn't spray properly (hard to do for a perfume without creating a video), they may be more than willing to issue a partial refund.

Thank you very much for your clear and concise message!

The line I highlighted in blue is news to me. I thought that was only possible thought private negotiations and not through the eBay Money Back Guarantee route. I thought it was either keep it or return and get the refund.

The part about people exploting buyers and not following protocol is always disheartening to hear.

The seller and other posters have suggested I just decant the fragrance juice into another bottle, etc. as getting a refund will not solve the issue of the problematic atomizer. I do not mind the atomizer and am not neccessarily seeking a tangible solution. It's simply a case of whether I am entitled to some sort of compensation. A video may be in order.

How much do you think would be reasonable if I had paid just under USD150.

sam9876 · ‎11-27-2018

How much would it cost to ship it back with tracking?

mam98031 · ‎11-27-2018

I'm not sure that I understand what you actually desire. You started off this thread by seeking a way to unclog the sprayer. Now it is all about how you can get a partial refund from your seller. Was that always your intent?

It is important to remember that the sellers on Ebay are mostly just some person working from their home trying to make a little money. Most are not big companies with deep pockets. So anytime money is refunded to a buyer for any reason, that loss of income is felt by the seller and not always easy to absorb.

You previously stated that the seller did a fantastic job packaging the item and that there was NO shipping damage of the item. Your only complaint has been how it sprays. I gave you some easy ways in which to fix that issue. Yet here we are with a discussion on how you can get some money back from your seller.

Yes you can try to "negotiate" directly with your seller for a partial refund. Or yes you can file a Request for Return. Either of which would work so that you MAY get your desired result of some of your money back. Or it may backfire on you. It seems to me that you are trying to take advantage of your seller. But you do have the right to file for a return if you desire.

If I were the seller and you wrote to me about a partial refund or you filed a Request for return, my response would be the same. I'm sorry there are issues please Return for refund. Ebay will not force a seller to give you a partial refund even though that is what you want.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

fern*wood · ‎11-27-2018

It seems you just feel entitled to some money back, but you like the product and have no intention of returning and now also say you are fine with the atomizer. Getting an item that is discontinued isn't always going to be possible, and that in itself is worth something, so I would let it go.

lunalapin1912 · ‎11-27-2018

Put a tea kettle or pot of water on the stove and get it simmering. Take the top off the bottle, wrap the bottle in a towel with the spray visable. Allow the warm steam access to the spray top. That will loosen whatever is gunking up the nozzle. Don't get the perfume itself hot.

If the atomizer top is removable, pop it off and blow into it to dislodge the blockage, you can alse get a cup of hot water and drop the atomizer top into it. There are hundreds of ways to get perfume spraying like new. Google will help you find what you need.

I collect and use vintage and antique perfumes.

betst_11 · ‎11-27-2018

@nicholashiraishilennaert-0 wrote:
@lintbrush* wrote:
The Money Back Guarantee provides you with coverage to either receive what you ordered or to be made whole. It does not cover partial refunds.

If the seller wants the item back in order to issue a refund, they will need to provide you with return shipping up front.

If you open a return request (for not as described), the seller can offer you a partial refund, but they do not have to. They simply have to make you whole to abide by eBay's policy. If they choose Return for Refund, you have to ship it back to get your refund. If you keep it, that's fine too... but you won't be entitled to any monies.

Bottom line is how much do you want to keep the 'original' formula one (as you say it's very hard to come by)

You can open the return. You can say in your message to seller that you'd be willing to keep it for a partial refund, but if they don't want to do that, you will return it (and you have to mean it).

Sellers run into partial refund scam attempts all the time. If your seller has had it happen to them, they make think your "I'll settle for a partial" offer is just that. If you don't send it back (once they approve a return), you only strengthen their feelings. But not all sellers feel that way either. If you can prove that it doesn't spray properly (hard to do for a perfume without creating a video), they may be more than willing to issue a partial refund.

Thank you very much for your clear and concise message!

The line I highlighted in blue is news to me. I thought that was only possible thought private negotiations and not through the eBay Money Back Guarantee route. I thought it was either keep it or return and get the refund.

The part about people exploting buyers and not following protocol is always disheartening to hear.

The seller and other posters have suggested I just decant the fragrance juice into another bottle, etc. as getting a refund will not solve the issue of the problematic atomizer. I do not mind the atomizer and am not neccessarily seeking a tangible solution. It's simply a case of whether I am entitled to some sort of compensation. A video may be in order.

How much do you think would be reasonable if I had paid just under USD150.