eBay

christworks · ‎11-09-2023

Recently I made a purchase which included multiple items of the same product. A few hours after I paid, the seller called me on the telephone and informed me they did not have all the items to send. The seller stated they had miscounted, and also needed to keep some of the product they did have for themselves. The seller asked if I wanted the order cancelled. Of course, I wanted the order cancelled. Did the seller expect me to say, "No, you just keep my money"?

I told the seller I would not leave negative feedback. That said, when the seller cancelled the order, instead of owning the mistake and taking the hit, they selected that I wanted the order cancelled. I then realized that the reason why the seller called me was to avoid the hit on their account. I found the action sneaky and underhanded.

I used to sell on eBay years ago, and recently returned to selling earlier this year. I completely understand how mistakes happen from time to time. I made a made an error and miscounted how many items I had of a certain product. When the last one sold, I realized I did not have it. I cancelled the order, issued a refund, and apologized to the buyer. My account took a hit, but that was fine because I was in the wrong. It motivated me to do better and ensure I have everything I list in stock.

In my case as the buyer, I kept my word and did not leave negative feedback. I did leave neutral feedback because I did not appreciate the seller's tactics. Afterward, the seller officially asked me to revise the feedback, stating they called eBay and was told it was okay that they called me. I reached out to eBay through chat. They confirmed to me exactly what I recalled from having sold previously: Sellers should only call buyers in very limited circumstances; such as, if the purchase is a local pick-up or in cases where a vehicle is being sold. Ebay advised me to report the seller though my account so they can take action against them. I am hesitant to do that because I feel that is too harsh. The seller has sold well over 5,000 items, so they are not new at this.

Am I being too harsh? Am I not being harsh enough? I feel like the neutral feedback I left is more than fair. Notably, the seller did not leave me feedback. They seem to only be concerned about their own.

mam98031 · ‎11-10-2023

If the seller had to justify to Ebay that the buyer requested the cancellation they could not. Which is why it should have been handled in an email. Which is also why Ebay encourages us to make sure we cover stuff within emails.

Second, the OP stated they were concerned if they did not agree to having them cancel the order, they wouldn't get their money back. Something in the call made the buyer feel that way. Right or wrong, the buyer felt that way and it never should have happened.

The Seller also said that Ebay advised him or said it was OK to call the buyer regarding this situation. While sure the seller could have reached out to Ebay on this, but it is highly unlikely that they did.

There are times that a phone call to a buyer is needed. I've done it myself. Speaking for myself only, I've done it in the past when emails don't seem to be getting the attention of the buyer and there is an important issue I'm trying to resolved before, during or after a shipment.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

gurlcat · ‎11-10-2023

I don't see what he did as "slimy." Now that I have all the pertinent information, I think what he did was desperate, and that is because the scenario of realizing too late you don't have what someone ordered (or can't find it, or accidentally damaged it while packing, etc.) is one of the rock and hard place positions anyone can find themselves in, because of eBay's policies and because of how petty some buyers are.

Maybe he was one OOS strike away from being demoted to Below Standard, after only a couple of other misfortunes in the past year. If he sells replenishables that could happen oh-so easily. And yeah he feared a negative feedback too. Who doesn't? -You say you would have been fine with him doing X, Y and Z, but he had no way of knowing that -some buyers would throw a hissy fit over nothing. And chances are the hissy-fitters would be buying-only members, not sellers, so they wouldn't even notice what reason was selected for the cancelation, or know what difference it makes. Clearly this seller was worried about you being a hissy-fitter, more than he worried about whether you might know more than the average buyer. He didn't lie to you, in fact if anything he was honest to his own detriment, by admitting he wanted to keep some quantity of envelopes for himself.

As someone who buys here almost as much as I sell, I can put myself in your exact position, and here's what I see. -A seller who contacted me "a few hours" after my purchase. WOW! That means he LEAPT to fulfill my order immediately. You know what I can't stand? A seller who stalls to ship for days, especially if it's a replenishable that I really need. And if it was days after I ordered before they informed me they didn't have the item, okay then I would be mad for sure. But immediate notification -that would enable me to find another source immediately. As for the part about the phone call, it's really unclear how you feel about that. One thing you didn't state is what his tone was like, and did he say "I'm so sorry, but ..." You did say in this last reply that you would have been fine with him cancelling "properly" and then calling to apologize. -So being contacted by phone, in and of itself, is not the issue. It's the fact that he did it as a tactic to get you to cancel, without digital evidence that it's what he did.

Okay, I guess that could warrant a neutral, but that's it. Reporting him would just be vindictive for no reason. His menu reason for cancelling doesn't affect you whatsoever. There are also a bazillion other padded envelope slingers to buy from, and you were notified almost immediately that you needed to do exactly that. Honestly, as many times as I've sat and watched day after day go by with no tracking number for stuff I needed fast, I am jealous of how "slimy" this guy was to you.

gurlcat · ‎11-10-2023

Off-topic but related: eBay should not weight all OOS cancellations the same, against Seller Performance. And the fix would be as simple as differentiating between AUCTION sales vs. BIN, because the difference is night and day. We already know that abusing OOS is a tactic a seller may utilize to avoid sending an item whose winning bid was disappointing -and that's why eBay allows so few OOS cancellations; if sellers had more free reign to do that with auctions, many would abuse it left and right, some would do it just to get an idea of what BIN price they should relist it for, and eBay would hemorrhage angry buyers. What's more, the fact that an auction last only days means there is virtually no excuse for being legitimately, accidentally, out of stock -you just photographed the thing days ago! Granted you could still accidentally break it while packing, so there should be a tolerance greater than zero, but maybe even lower than the 0.3% currently allowed.

On the other hand, why be so harsh on OOS's for BIN's? How many customers does Walmart lose completely because of occasionally finding an item out of stock? How many people will never eat McDonald's again because their ice cream machines are "down" every other time you try to buy a sundae? Stuff runs out, stuff goes missing, stuff gets damaged, it happens. And with stuff that may have been listed literally YEARS before selling .... it's even more likely to happen. So eBay shouldn't treat sellers to whom it happens just as harshly as if they refused to send an auction item because they failed to set the minimum bid high enough.

5594shelleys · ‎11-10-2023

Am I being too harsh? Based on the described events? Yes.

monster-deals · ‎11-10-2023

@christworks wrote:

I told the seller I would not leave negative feedback.

...but you left bad feedback anyway

christworks · ‎11-10-2023

I told the seller I would not leave negative feedback. Likewise, I did not promise to leave positive feedback.

christworks · ‎11-10-2023

I think you are spot on with a lot of you what you say.....and your points are well taken.

Their tone was fine - no issue there.

I also agree that reporting them would be vindictive, so I will not be doing that. I will let the neutral stand as long as they do not contact me anymore about the issue and can move on.

stainlessenginecovers · ‎11-10-2023

To simply deal with the TITLE of the thread;

It's ALWAYS ok for a seller to call a buyer as:

Some buyers don't read and have purchased things, from me, for 3 different cars.

Some buyers dont' "respond" or j"read" messages- so a Call is necessary after 24 hrs.

monster-deals · ‎11-10-2023

@christworks wrote:
I told the seller I would not leave negative feedback. Likewise, I did not promise to leave positive feedback.

You must be fun at parties.

gone.c-33 · ‎11-10-2023

I personally don’t understand people who say they shouldn’t have to go through a third party service to communicate with customer service when referring to Facebook/X/Insta but have no qualms about using email or the phone to do so. Those are also third party services one must sign up for.

It’s 2023. Facebook Messenger (you do not need a FB profile page to use it) is a commonly used communication tool, on par with texts, emails and phone calls.

fern*wood · ‎11-10-2023

Your user name may have played a part to make the seller feel you were approachable and would be more than likely willing to offer forgiveness for their error.

gurlcat · ‎11-10-2023

@gone.c-33 wrote:

It’s 2023. Facebook Messenger (you do not need a FB profile page to use it)

I didn't know that, I guess because I've had a FB account since 2008. And I'm sure most people who never had one (or did but closed it before the in-platform private message feature became Messenger) would know that either. I would commend you for sharing this info with anyone who might want it, except I don't see you giving instructions on how to sign up for Messenger (only), so it seems more like you are just exhibiting how you're more 2023 savvy than others.

lakefor94 · ‎11-11-2023

@gurlcat wrote:
I don't see what he did as "slimy." Now that I have all the pertinent information, I think what he did was desperate, and that is because the scenario of realizing too late you don't have what someone ordered (or can't find it, or accidentally damaged it while packing, etc.) is one of the rock and hard place positions anyone can find themselves in, because of eBay's policies and because of how petty some buyers are.

Maybe he was one OOS strike away from being demoted to Below Standard, after only a couple of other misfortunes in the past year. If he sells replenishables that could happen oh-so easily. And yeah he feared a negative feedback too. Who doesn't? -You say you would have been fine with him doing X, Y and Z, but he had no way of knowing that -some buyers would throw a hissy fit over nothing. And chances are the hissy-fitters would be buying-only members, not sellers, so they wouldn't even notice what reason was selected for the cancelation, or know what difference it makes. Clearly this seller was worried about you being a hissy-fitter, more than he worried about whether you might know more than the average buyer. He didn't lie to you, in fact if anything he was honest to his own detriment, by admitting he wanted to keep some quantity of envelopes for himself.

As someone who buys here almost as much as I sell, I can put myself in your exact position, and here's what I see. -A seller who contacted me "a few hours" after my purchase. WOW! That means he LEAPT to fulfill my order immediately. You know what I can't stand? A seller who stalls to ship for days, especially if it's a replenishable that I really need. And if it was days after I ordered before they informed me they didn't have the item, okay then I would be mad for sure. But immediate notification -that would enable me to find another source immediately. As for the part about the phone call, it's really unclear how you feel about that. One thing you didn't state is what his tone was like, and did he say "I'm so sorry, but ..." You did say in this last reply that you would have been fine with him cancelling "properly" and then calling to apologize. -So being contacted by phone, in and of itself, is not the issue. It's the fact that he did it as a tactic to get you to cancel, without digital evidence that it's what he did.

Okay, I guess that could warrant a neutral, but that's it. Reporting him would just be vindictive for no reason. His menu reason for cancelling doesn't affect you whatsoever. There are also a bazillion other padded envelope slingers to buy from, and you were notified almost immediately that you needed to do exactly that. Honestly, as many times as I've sat and watched day after day go by with no tracking number for stuff I needed fast, I am jealous of how "slimy" this guy was to you.

The voice of reason comes thru again. Well thought out and presented.

Posting ID

gurlcat · ‎11-11-2023

@lakefor94 wrote:
The voice of reason comes thru again. Well thought out and presented.

Aww, thanks. Reckon a science bachelor's with minor in sociology, followed by a master's in education has prepared me well for finding logic in human interactions and presenting those findings in a way that makes sense ..... but I wouldn't borrow eyeballs-deep debt for it again. Womp womp. 😫