eBay

jonathankirkland · ‎04-29-2018

I bought a Microsoft Surface Book. The pictures of it show that is in good condition, and shows the unit POWERED on.

However, once I receive the unit, not only is the battery completely dead, but I come to realize that no ac adpater is included with it.

I contacted the seller and they said "the listings states no accessories". I did go back and see there was one small line in the mid section of the listing that says "Accessornies: none".

I guess it is my fault for assuming that the charger would come with it, but is that really an "acessory"? I don't think it's an acessory at all, in fact, I would say it is a NECESSITY since you cannot use the thing after the battery dies...

To me it would be like a used car dealership selling you a car with an empty gas tank and telling you gasoline is an "accessory" and absolutely none is included...

ymeagainlord · ‎04-30-2018

A Surface with a dead battery is pretty much useless without a power cord. You CAN replace it if you're good with fiddly little electronics stuff (because getting at it is a royal PITB) and supposedly MS will also replace the battery (for a hefty fee of course).

Crusader Cat is watching

Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself. - L Tolstoy

"You are entitled to your own opinion, you are not however, entitled to your own facts."

montanatiki · ‎04-30-2018

Well - depends on how you feel - if you can live without the cord - keep it and look for one.

Otherwise - it would be item not as described - it showed powered up - it arrived not being able to power up - in my mind - something may be wrong with the battery storage and the intial charge can't hold power - WHICH MEANS...it should have come with the cord because that is the only way it works. Seems that the battery might not be able to hold a charge and that means you would 1) Have to buy a cord for it and B) now you would have to buy another battery to keep it operational - since the original battery seems to have a problem.

I know you hate sending it back - but I too (if I saw it powered up in the photos) would think that there was a source (i.e. power cord) that made it power up. I would NOT think that the CORD is not included (and NOT an accessory - i.e. loading dock, usbs, disc etc.) and if the cord was not included- it arrived DOA which means the battery is not capable of working for any length of time and thus - NOT AS DESCRIBED.

jonathankirkland · ‎04-30-2018

@montanatiki wrote:
Well - depends on how you feel - if you can live without the cord - keep it and look for one.
Otherwise - it would be item not as described - it showed powered up - it arrived not being able to power up - in my mind - something may be wrong with the battery storage and the intial charge can't hold power - WHICH MEANS...it should have come with the cord because that is the only way it works. Seems that the battery might not be able to hold a charge and that means you would 1) Have to buy a cord for it and B) now you would have to buy another battery to keep it operational - since the original battery seems to have a problem.

I know you hate sending it back - but I too (if I saw it powered up in the photos) would think that there was a source (i.e. power cord) that made it power up. I would NOT think that the CORD is not included (and NOT an accessory - i.e. loading dock, usbs, disc etc.) and if the cord was not included- it arrived DOA which means the battery is not capable of working for any length of time and thus - NOT AS DESCRIBED.

My hope is in this particular case that the item was just low on power upon testing and wasn't thoroughly charged, and perhaps just left on by the seller and drained completely rather than being powered down correctly.

I will just keep patiently my ac adapter and see what happens when it arrives.

Even if all goes well though I think this seller has still earned themselves a negative. They've sold dozens of these and if they are all coming without chargers I can't imagine I'm the only one who was taken by surprise and is unhappy. Potential future buyers need to be made aware of these things and no one else is going to do it when the seller doesn't seem to care much about chaning how they do business.

tellmemama · ‎04-30-2018

@jonathankirkland wrote:
@pburn wrote:
@jonathankirkland

The good news is (if there is any . . . ) that power cords are pretty inexpensive. I ruin mine all the time and have to replace it about every six months (I don't want to talk about it. LOL!) and I get them for about $12 or $15. I know it's a hassle--and you shouldn't have to do it, but it's not the end of the world.

You're real challenge is going to be discovering whether the battery can hold a charge if you do end up buying a power cord. Maybe best to return it under the policy @lacemaker3 cited above.

Good luck with this one.
I was just a little concerned about buying the cheap $20 and under Chinese knock off power cords because I am concerned that those can damage the device, but if you have been doing this all along with no problems that gives me confidence. The OEM ones seem to be $50 and up... and I am not willing to spend THAT much....

It's honestly just frustrating that this company would rather accept a return than provide me a partial refund so I can buy the appropriate charger. And believe me I am NOT the type to fish for partial refunds, but in this case I feel it would be warranted.

The thing looks practically like new with hardly any blemishes on it, most of these I"ve seen tend to be dinged, scratched or otherwise beat up so it'd be a shamed to have to pass on such an amazing specimen, especially since I take very good care of my things so I know I could preserve it going forward.

I'll just have to wait and see when the $20 charger I ordered arrives to be sure everything works properly. I will definitely do a thorough test to see how long the battery will hold a charge.

Thanks for the tip!

I can relate to trying to find something I've wanted for a while and it never quite working out. That said, I doubt I would throw more money at this problem to find out whether or not it even works properly. What happens if it doesn't? You send it back but now you've got a $20 cord that you don't need right now. I'd have sent it back immediately and started my search again.

For electronics, I don't even bother with eBay. I want new and I want warranty.

Joe

centexcompsvcs · ‎04-30-2018

If the Surface was advertised as “Manufacturer Refurbished”, you should have absolutely received a working power adapter with cable. I have a B&M computer repair and sales store (2nd job/hobby). I hold retail accounts and “refurbisher credentials” with HP, Toshiba and Lenovo. As such, I am able to both refurbish each of these company’s laptops and purchase discounted “refurbished” models for resale.

These companies have very strict guidelines that I must adhere to, if not, I would risk losing both the certification and the purchase/resale accounts.

The common guidelines with most of these companies ( HP especially) concerning the resale of a true “Manufacturer Refurbished” laptop are as follows:

They must include an original, working power supply,

They must have a brand new battery.

There must not have more that 10% overall noticeable blemishes ( minor scratches)., of this, the LCD can have no more than 5% blemishes.

Any and all parts used to refurbish must be brand new. i.e. if an LCD screen has more than 5% scratches based on total area, then it must be replaced with a brand new screen
A standard 90 day manufacturer warranty on the unit is always the norm.

That being said, I am not certain about Microsoft policies, but my best guess is that they have similar rules and standards for resale of "Refurbished" units.

Another note concerning the unit arriving with a dead battery. Before I ship any unit out, I always discharge the battery completely and remove it from the laptop. It is shipped with the laptop, but not installed. This is simply to adhere to the USPS guidelines for shipping laptop/lithium cell batteries.

Another cautionary note, be careful of the power cord that you are purchasing. As it is Microsoft themselves have had at least one or two recalls on their own brand-name charging adaptors/ usb cords.

Numerous charging issues : https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4040585/surface-ac-power-cord-recall-surface-pro-surface-pr...

The very bottom line is that it should have come with the power adapter/usb cord. If not, then this should have been clearly stated in the listing.

jonathankirkland · ‎04-30-2018

That is some very good information there. I am sure they just haphazardly chose "manufacturer refurbished" instead of "seller refurbished" and I am sure their definition of "refurbished" simply means they made sure it powered on and that's about it....

tev4all · ‎04-30-2018

@jonathankirkland wrote:
I bought a Microsoft Surface Book. The pictures of it show that is in good condition, and shows the unit POWERED on.

However, once I receive the unit, not only is the battery completely dead, but I come to realize that no ac adpater is included with it.

I contacted the seller and they said "the listings states no accessories". I did go back and see there was one small line in the mid section of the listing that says "Accessornies: none".

I guess it is my fault for assuming that the charger would come with it, but is that really an "acessory"? I don't think it's an acessory at all, in fact, I would say it is a NECESSITY since you cannot use the thing after the battery dies...

To me it would be like a used car dealership selling you a car with an empty gas tank and telling you gasoline is an "accessory" and absolutely none is included...

Put on your seller hat and think, What would I, as a seller, do in a situation like this?

AS a buyer in this situation, I would open a Return Request and wait for the seller's response.

a_c_green · ‎04-30-2018

@centexcompsvcs wrote:

Another note concerning the unit arriving with a dead battery. Before I ship any unit out, I always discharge the battery completely and remove it from the laptop. It is shipped with the laptop, but not installed. This is simply to adhere to the USPS guidelines for shipping laptop/lithium cell batteries.

Are you sure that's necessary? The USPS doesn't seem to mind lithium batteries installed in the device they are intended to operate. In fact, in some paragraphs of Publication 52, they seem to require it, or else it's non-mailable:

349.21 Nonmailable Class 9 Materials

The following materials are prohibited:

[...]

4. All lithium batteries in international mail, unless they are within the specified limits and only when properly installed in the equipment they operate.

5. All lithium batteries in domestic air transportation, unless they are within the specified limits and only when properly installed in, or packed with, the equipment they are intended to operate.

Ref: https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c3_027.htm#ep929910

Further paragraphs beyond that point contain even more hand-waving about what you're supposed to do if the lithium battery is not installed in the device. It seems simpler to just leave the battery installed, and ship it.

jonathankirkland · ‎04-30-2018

@tev4all wrote:
@jonathankirkland wrote:
I bought a Microsoft Surface Book. The pictures of it show that is in good condition, and shows the unit POWERED on.

However, once I receive the unit, not only is the battery completely dead, but I come to realize that no ac adpater is included with it.

I contacted the seller and they said "the listings states no accessories". I did go back and see there was one small line in the mid section of the listing that says "Accessornies: none".

I guess it is my fault for assuming that the charger would come with it, but is that really an "acessory"? I don't think it's an acessory at all, in fact, I would say it is a NECESSITY since you cannot use the thing after the battery dies...

To me it would be like a used car dealership selling you a car with an empty gas tank and telling you gasoline is an "accessory" and absolutely none is included...
Put on your seller hat and think, What would I, as a seller, do in a situation like this?
AS a buyer in this situation, I would open a Return Request and wait for the seller's response.

I wouldn't be in this situation as a seller because I'm intelligent enough to understand that an ac adapter is not an "accessory". And if I did sell something without the AC adapter I would have it in bold letters, underlined that it is NOT INCLUDED.

dougsue123b · ‎04-30-2018

Something necessary to use an item is NOT an accessorie.

And that should have been in the item condition box

tev4all · ‎04-30-2018

@jonathankirkland wrote:
@tev4all wrote:
@jonathankirkland wrote:
I bought a Microsoft Surface Book. The pictures of it show that is in good condition, and shows the unit POWERED on.

However, once I receive the unit, not only is the battery completely dead, but I come to realize that no ac adpater is included with it.

I contacted the seller and they said "the listings states no accessories". I did go back and see there was one small line in the mid section of the listing that says "Accessornies: none".

I guess it is my fault for assuming that the charger would come with it, but is that really an "acessory"? I don't think it's an acessory at all, in fact, I would say it is a NECESSITY since you cannot use the thing after the battery dies...

To me it would be like a used car dealership selling you a car with an empty gas tank and telling you gasoline is an "accessory" and absolutely none is included...
Put on your seller hat and think, What would I, as a seller, do in a situation like this?
AS a buyer in this situation, I would open a Return Request and wait for the seller's response.

I wouldn't be in this situation as a seller because I'm intelligent enough to understand that an ac adapter is not an "accessory". And if I did sell something without the AC adapter I would have it in bold letters, underlined that it is NOT INCLUDED.

Congratulations, you seem to be on your way to settling the argument, I guess.

IMO, you should hold the seller to the terms of the listing.

Without seeing the actual listing and taking in just one side of the story as accurate, I'd still advise to open a return request. I am not discounting your side.

Seeing a powered on device in the item description/pictures, if one purchases said device, one should recieve a device that powers on. Despite having the fine print stating accessories not included. The device should power up once, at the very least.

luckythewinner · ‎04-30-2018

My $0.02 is that if ...

- the listing did not show a power cord

- the listing did not say that a power cord was included

- the listing said "no accessories"

... then it is encumbent upon you to ask.

Trying split hairs about what is a "necessity" and what is an "accessory" is failing to take responsibility.

BTW, the Microsoft website itself calls the power supply an "accessory" :

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/collections/surfaceproaccessories

a1robotrepair · ‎04-30-2018

@luckythewinner wrote:
My $0.02 is that if ...

- the listing did not show a power cord
- the listing did not say that a power cord was included
- the listing said "no accessories"

... then it is encumbent upon you to ask.

Trying split hairs about what is a "necessity" and what is an "accessory" is failing to take responsibility.

BTW, the Microsoft website itself calls the power supply an "accessory" :
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/collections/surfaceproaccessories

I agree Lucky! All the electronic equipment I know of call chargers an accessory.

If you call a tablet manufacturer you can buy a tablet without accessories. Usually they are Manufacturer Refurbished, returns that the charger or battery was inop.

centexcompsvcs · ‎04-30-2018

"That is some very good information there. I am sure they just haphazardly chose "manufacturer refurbished" instead of "seller refurbished" and I am sure their definition of "refurbished" simply means they made sure it powered on and that's about it...."

If they are a very high-volume seller as you alluded to, you are most likely correct. But , man , that is just so wrong on so many levels. JMHO.

centexcompsvcs · ‎04-30-2018

Yes, I know you are correct, USPS guidelines changed sometime in 2012. I guess I am just stuck in my old ways. Plus, I always ship in original factory packaging , where there is always a nice, separate cubbyhole/space to place the battery. Thanks.