Land line phone number no longer sufficient for identity verification to sell on ebay

[brandonsvsu]

Maybe I'm the only person left on earth with a land line and who doesn't want to give his cell phone number to a company such as ebay, but I have found out today after a lengthy conversation with an ebay rep that unless I provide ebay with a phone number capable of receiving text messages, my seller payout funds will be put on hold indefinitely.

I find it ridiculous that they can't just call my land line number with an automated message containing a verification code.  Practically every other major company that requires verification offers this.  Ebay?  Nope.  You gotta have a cell phone to sell here.

[1786davycrockett]

@a_c_green 

"They want to send the confirmation code to an outside account (e.g. third-party email host, or phone number that can receive text messages) that's under your independent control. . .."

In the words of Hamlet, "Ay, there's the rub."  In your own words:  "under your independent control."  But how would eBay be able to confirm that the cell phone I would use would be under MY "independent control." 

Obviously, since I don't own (or even desire) a cell phone, it would be necessary for me to temporarily borrow one:  from my spouse, or another relative, or a neighbor, or a fellow worker, or the postal worker whom I encounter daily, or the woman who trims my hair every few months, or one of the folks with whom I play cards every two weeks, or the garbage collector who makes a pick-up each week, or one of the folks who mows our lawns or shovels our walks, or. . .anyone.  How would eBay even know the cell phone did not belong to ME?!?

I'll tell you, however, what simple form of communication is ENTIRELY "under my independent control" -- my eBay email account:  no one has access to that account except ME.  That sounds awful doggone secure to me, and it should be secure enough for eBay, as well.  After all, it was eBay that set it up in the first place, and not some hack-prone, third party telephone company.

Or they can call me on my land-line.  My wife refuses to answer phone calls on it anymore; so I'm the only one using it.  And eBay already has that phone number on file -- they've called me several times before, and one more time won't harm either of us.

And, if eBay is that paranoid about "identify fraud," they can send me a certified letter via USPS.  I'll gladly guarantee my identity, and even have it signed and sealed by a notary public.

How's THAT for security?!?

[reallynicestamps]

it would be necessary for me to temporarily borrow one: from my spouse, or another relative, or a neighbor, or a fellow worker, or the postal worker whom I encounter daily, or the woman who trims my hair every few months, or one of the folks with whom I play cards every two weeks, or the garbage collector who makes a pick-up each week, or one of the folks who mows our lawns or shovels our walks, or. . .anyone.

Playing devil's advocate-- if the owner will loan you a phone long enough to send and receive the text, they know you well enough to trust you with expensive equipment.

So there's that.

But I agree. Not everyone owns a phone, or has reception, or is comfortable with third party hosts.

[brandonsvsu]

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

elizabeth@ebay 

The bottom line is -- when does eBay plan to kick all of us non-cell-phone users off eBay?

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At least for me - the answer is January 23, 2023.

I find it absolutely ludicrous that despite me selling on ebay for 22 years, having the same land line for 22 years, ebay having had that land line number on file for 22 years, and me having verified my email already, that ebay has suddenly decided, without notice or official rule change (the terms of service the rep I spoke to pointed me to makes no mention of a cell phone number; rather just a phone number), that to them, my identity is somehow now in question.  I've been selling, on ebay, for 22 years, without issue.  This would be like if I owned a convenience store, had a regular customer who came in daily for 22 years, and then I just one day told them "sorry, I'm going to need to see some ID to verify your identity before I run your credit card or accept a check."  I'm at a loss for words how insane this is.  I MAYBE get it for new sellers, but someone who has been on the platform nearly since its inception?  Come on....

[a_c_green]

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

@a_c_green 

"They want to send the confirmation code to an outside account (e.g. third-party email host, or phone number that can receive text messages) that's under your independent control. . .."

In the words of Hamlet, "Ay, there's the rub."  In your own words:  "under your independent control."  But how would eBay be able to confirm that the cell phone I would use would be under MY "independent control." 

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Because you're the one who gave them the phone number when providing your contact info for your eBay account. They send a text link or a confirmation code to that number. You respond by either clicking a link on the phone or entering the confirmation code on eBay, and that shows that you can be reached via that phone number.

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

I'll tell you, however, what simple form of communication is ENTIRELY "under my independent control" -- my eBay email account:  no one has access to that account except ME.  That sounds awful doggone secure to me, and it should be secure enough for eBay, as well.  After all, it was eBay that set it up in the first place, and not some hack-prone, third party telephone company.

Your eBay messaging account is accessible via your eBay login, so that's not a backup means of reaching you; it's part of your main account. The point of having a secondary means of contacting you is that it is fully independent of your eBay account, so they can reach you via a secondary method to verify that it's really you trying to log in to your eBay account.

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

Or they can call me on my land-line.  My wife refuses to answer phone calls on it anymore; so I'm the only one using it.  And eBay already has that phone number on file -- they've called me several times before, and one more time won't harm either of us.

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For whatever reason, they don't want to call your landline. That's their choice to explain. I know my bank can send a landline/voice confirmation code if I choose that method: I get a short phone call where an automated voice reads me an access code, which I then type in to my bank account login to show that it's really me. You'd need to get eBay to explain why they can't do that themselves, but I doubt you will get a useful explanation. They prefer texting confirmation codes to a cellphone, so there you have it.

[1786davycrockett]

@a_c_green 

"They prefer texting confirmation codes to a cellphone, so there you have it."

Which, as I have previously demonstrated, is not a reliable sign of identification -- certainly anyone who has paid any attention to the news media, or social media, or even movies and television dramas should be able to understand why the simple act of possessing an individual's cell phone does not necessarily lead to identifying that particular individual. 

If that were so, tens of thousands of criminal cases in the United States would immediately be reversed, due to the insane logic that simply answering a cell phone constitutes ownership (and thus personal identity) of the individual responding to that cell phone.  That form of logic is not only comical, but inane.

If eBay intends to eliminate long-term sellers from their system, so be it.  As I have previously pointed out, eBay has had on file since 2010 at least THREE other secure methods to reach me, none of which has changed in over 12 years, and two of which have remained unchanged since 1996 -- predating the birth of many eBay staff members, no doubt.

And who is to say that five years from now, when an even newer technology comes along, that eBay will also demand that all sellers fall into line to confirm their identity all over again?  Maybe a DNA swab, or an implanted body chip, or a stool sample, or some other form of "hipster" technology?

Is this really what eBay is becoming -- simply another Orwellian pigsty?

[chapeau-noir]

This is a little nuts. eBay is a rather elderly site with an older demographic, and their demanding a cell phone rather than simple email (with code) verification is stupid.  I sell on a number of younger, more innovative sites which WERE mobile-only but matured to have also a web app, and they all accept email for receipt of verification code.

I've had a cell phone since 1998, so it's not a big deal for me , but there are a lot of people, and they're not olde fartes like myself, who have a choice of a land line or cell phone.

[yuzuha]

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

This is a little nuts. eBay is a rather elderly site with an older demographic, and their demanding a cell phone rather than simple email (with code) verification is stupid.  I sell on a number of younger, more innovative sites which WERE mobile-only but matured to have also a web app, and they all accept email for receipt of verification code.

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I think in this case they're trying to verify specifically that the phone number is a valid number, not that they're just trying to verify your identity. My Japanese reshipper, for example, requires a valid phone number for customs purposes, so they send an SMS verification to your phone to make sure that the number you provided is in fact a real, functioning phone number.

[chapeau-noir]

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@yuzuha wrote:

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

This is a little nuts. eBay is a rather elderly site with an older demographic, and their demanding a cell phone rather than simple email (with code) verification is stupid.  I sell on a number of younger, more innovative sites which WERE mobile-only but matured to have also a web app, and they all accept email for receipt of verification code.

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I think in this case they're trying to verify specifically that the phone number is a valid number, not that they're just trying to verify your identity. My Japanese reshipper, for example, requires a valid phone number for customs purposes, so they send an SMS verification to your phone to make sure that the number you provided is in fact a real, functioning phone number.

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I see what you're saying, but though I use mostly a mobile, a landline is indeed verifiable - I know, because for some years I lived in a mobile black hole - we literally could not get mobile signals, and I had to have any verifications sent to our VoIP (former landline number) via voice.  I can see where a reshipper in a more advanced country like Japan may make assumptions, but this is the US and eBay really skews older.

ETA: Mid-50s last time I read, though my own customers are a range.

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

This is a little nuts. eBay is a rather elderly site with an older demographic, and their demanding a cell phone rather than simple email (with code) verification is stupid.  I sell on a number of younger, more innovative sites which WERE mobile-only but matured to have also a web app, and they all accept email for receipt of verification code.

I've had a cell phone since 1998, so it's not a big deal for me , but there are a lot of people, and they're not olde fartes like myself, who have a choice of a land line or cell phone.

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eBay is turning from a site where it used to be easy to find what you were looking for to a site telling you what you want. Search from the tool bar to search by either click click click click click.... or google and then hope and pray for the best.  (Dropping a myriad of unrelated promoted listings.) From new features that you are unable to opt out of to mandating a new seller have a cell because it's the eBay ONLY way to go. For both registering and listing. We're going to update the listing tool. Maybe you like it...Maybe you don't. Tough. You're stuck with it. Sure, you can list on PC. We're just not  going to make it AS easy for you.  (Now it routinely takes me 1/3 the time to create a listing on my PC compared to before.) You want to be able to use your released funds for purchases? Yes you can,  you just can't change your mind after the fact and opt out. The list goes on. Are you seeing a pattern? I know I am forgetting many other questionable decisions. Those are a few that spring to mind.

-Lotz

[a_c_green]

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

"They prefer texting confirmation codes to a cellphone, so there you have it."

Which, as I have previously demonstrated, is not a reliable sign of identification -- certainly anyone who has paid any attention to the news media, or social media, or even movies and television dramas should be able to understand why the simple act of possessing an individual's cell phone does not necessarily lead to identifying that particular individual. 

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If the scammer has also stolen your cell phone, that rises to a whole new level of problem that would affect every single account touched by your phone. What we're talking about here is simply a method of verifying that the person trying to access your eBay account is you, and thus they want to contact you via a separate back channel to confirm that it's really you at the keyboard.

I'm not eBay so I can't explain why a landline would not be good enough for the task, but that is why they're asking for a phone number.

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@1786davycrockett wrote:

If that were so, tens of thousands of criminal cases in the United States would immediately be reversed, due to the insane logic that simply answering a cell phone constitutes ownership (and thus personal identity) of the individual responding to that cell phone.  That form of logic is not only comical, but inane.

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I have no idea what cases those might be that you believe would be reversed, but this has nothing to do with determining ownership of the phone. They simply want to verify that it's you trying to access the account. They send a code to the number that you provided previously, and wait to see you return that code via the eBay account. That is how two-factor authentication works.

[1786davycrockett]

@a_c_green 

"They simply want to verify that it's you trying to access the account. They send a code to the number that you provided previously, and wait to see you return that code via the eBay account. That is how two-factor authentication works."

How many additional times do I have to say this -- eBay already HAS that information, and has had it for nearly a dozen years now!  They have my street address and land-line phone number (both since 1996), plus the eBay email account, which THEY set up in 2011!  They have contacted me personally probably dozens of times over the past ten years, and have had NO problems whatsoever in determining my identity on ALL occasions.  What they are demanding now is simply some brand new millennial San Jose "hip" geekiness, simply because the technology exists, without comprehending that a cell phone might NOT be a "necessity" for some people, and may possibly be IMPOSSIBLE to use under certain circumstances.

If eBay is really determined to eliminate sellers from its site, simply because those sellers refuse to purchase a cell phone to satisfy the millennials in San Jose -- then so be it.

[buyselljack2016]

That's where I am at.

Presented with the idea of verifying a landline (google searchable linking to my name/address, listed in the phone directory, on my eBay account for over 2 decades) by sending a code to a random cell # is a complete loss of brain function. (but to note: the cell thing has not been directly presented to me as being needed, or as an option during 4 contacts with CS about the existing phone # update/verification)

Again, not trying to verify my identity, or starting up selling.  Just updating/confirming an in use, verified a dozen times over the years, called back on numerous times, can be seen by CS................. "phone #".

My wife has a cell, but there is no way that I am giving them that # for any purpose.  Do that, and they could be restricting her account  for suspicious activity associated with other accounts. If that were to happen.......   you wouldn't want to be me 🙂

Bottom line is.............................................. I have not been asked to do anything other than "update my account information by verifying my current phone #", which I have done.

As I have posted, there has been "no request" to provide another means of contact (cell), and my offer to provide a photo copy of a current phone bill was rejected by CS as "not needed" , but still I have an impending "payment restriction dated deadline" looming in the near future.

As I have posted, "blue" link provided to assist, as well as a link from "eBay for business", only result in connections to the off-shore CS that politely responds to my situation, but has no actual ability to provide any resolution.  "All is OK". "Will make a note on  account". "screenshot linked to tech team will be given priority". "24-72 hours for resolution". 2 months later, here I sit with that bright red banner still there requesting that I again do what I have done once, or twice a week for 2 months.

In threads we see.............. cell needed, then cell, or email for verification, and then cell needed. Existing accounts? New accounts?       ....................  ????????????????????????????? 

Verifying an existing account phone #, and verifying a new selling account are miles apart. Not one size fits all.  Can I send the bill for a cell phone to eBay, and get it deducted from my seller fees?  I have no need for a cell phone.

Left hand, and right hand are not communicating.

devon@ebay 

elizabeth@ebay 

[reallynicestamps]

the rep I spoke to

The phone reps don't work for eBay.

They are the undertrained employees of a sub-contractor  in Utah, and have little authority.

pointed me to makes no mention of a cell phone number; rather just a phone number)

Because younger people have only used cell phones and the two names are identical to them.

[buyselljack2016]

If the scammer has also stolen your cell phone, that rises to a whole new level of problem ..............

__________________________________________________

Apparently I am to dense to understand this......................

Scammer does not have to have " my cell phone". All the scammer has to do is to provide "their cell #" to have a code sent to..................     Who is going to "verify" that the cell # "is me"?

They have verified my email. They can send that code to my email just as other sites do 🙂

[fern*wood]

I don't have a cell phone, but I use magicJack on my computer and Ipad app which can receive text messages to that number.   I hope this is sufficient.