eBay

quadcitypickers · ‎06-14-2018

eBay needs a balance system that takes into consideration the amount of time, the dollar amount sold, and the number of items a seller has transacted, and compare that to someone with say a buying account that has been open a month, and this is the first item they purchased.

Otherwise there really is no trust. I would say 3 years, at least 30 grand, and at least 1000 sales.

Because anytime someone gets scammed, the pre-packaged response is "we have to treat everyone back to square one".

That makes little sense. Would you buy a $1,000 item from a retailer that has been around 10 years and has good ratings, or someone random dude in a alleyway?

There has been a lot of sellers leaving lately because they sell expensive items, get scammed, and then leave or sell more expensive items somewhere else. Ebay needs to wake up and realize "hmm, we are missing out on big fees by letting people get scammed and leaving".

The more people that get scammed, the more they will tell their little scammer friends and it will become rampant, moreso than what is happening.

eBay places zero trust in the seller, takes the buyers word, this is not in any means equal, balanced or fair.

tunicaslot · ‎06-15-2018

That's the problem - there are dishonest sellers here and those that simply don't describe their items correctly and don't seem to care.

How many times has a seller come here saying they were scammed and then looking at the listing - we see the item indeed qualified for item not as described as he didn't mention the broken handle, stain on the shirt, didn't include measurements ect...

sg51 · ‎06-15-2018

Again, the buyers ratings would be taken into an account.

Ebay creating a vector for seller scams would be corporate suicide.

sg51 · ‎06-15-2018

In a context where most seller scams are absolutely blocked, it's easy to get into a frame of mind which says "sellers with good reputations are never scammers".

But if it protected scamming sellers, we can bet that such sellers would acquire a good reputation, one way or the other.

Since it doesn't work, we don't see it.

luckythewinner · ‎06-15-2018

@quadcitypickers wrote:
eBay places zero trust in the seller, takes the buyers word, this is not in any means equal, balanced or fair.

No, it is not by any means equal, balanced or fair.

But it has been this way for a decade, and the number of sellers here, the number of listings here, and the volume of merchandise sold here has grown steadily.

Finding cases in the seller's favor based on experience would tear up the "Money Back Guarantee" that eBay has marketed for a decade now. And IMHO it would not be any better at determining who was defrauding who.

castlemagicmemories · ‎06-15-2018

@dhbookds wrote:
Seems to me, if you shift to trusting sellers word, even long time sellers, you shift to enouraging scamming on the seller side........i.e. claiming an empty box when the item was actually returned. Certainly, it probably doesn't happen now, as the claim doesn't work......but at least some sellers would try to game that system.

Good point, and I have had that happen. Sent back with tracking, showed delivery confirmation, had to get Ebay to step in for refund~seller claimed in feedback that she "tried' to refund but I refused to return. I entered the delivery confirmation number in the feedback and stated delivered. She posted this after I had already been refunded.

time4david5d28 · ‎06-15-2018

The problem with some sellers that "didn't mention the broken handle, stain on the shirt, didn't include measurements ect..." is that some of the 'defects' are often shown in pictures, but not mentioned in the actual description. The question is just exactly what is "required' to be in the description area versus what is an ethical choice. There are no EBay requirements for having a written description. For instance, why isn't there a form to fill out for that written description area that requires certain questions to be answered before listing an item? For instance why doesn't EBay require dimensions of Height, Width and Depth? Why doesn't EBay require Weight of object? Why doesn't EBay require a defects section to be filled out in the written description area or a box to check off that says "none" or "Perfect Condition"? Some of these SNAD issues could be resolved if there was a box to check that says "Perfet Condition no issues" . . . in which if a buyer receives an item with 'issues' then a SNAD could be filed . . but filed only if the "Perfect Condition no issues" box is checked. Having mandatory fields to be filled in, like measurements would eliminate some SNAD issues but if the measurements are wrong, a SNAD could be filed. But there would have to be a certain acceptable variance to those measurements . . . like on clothing perfect measurements might not happen considering one person measuring could be off by an inch compared to another. So it would have to be 'about' this length, not exactly this length.

The the problem with mentioning defects is that a seller might not notice all issus with an item. For instance, ceramic items are very tricky to sell. For instance there could be variations in color, there could be differences in how handles are applied on handmade objects, there could variations in size, etc. How does one account for inconsistencies that the seller might believe to be normal for a hand made item, versus a buyer who receives the items and says SNAD because a color difference was omitted from the description? Exactly how much is needed in the decription area to be a "perfect auction" that would not get a SNAD?

In my opinion, many buyers are picky. They want "PERFECT" items for no money and free shipping if possible. That's been my experience with a lot of buyers. But the point is, in order for there to be EQUALITY between the buyer and seller, the SNAD Return has to have some paramters so that there is a limitation to how a buyer can claim NAD item. Without limitations to how a NAD item can be returned, it is open to endless ways to abuse the system for the small seller . . . leaving EBay to enjoy the fees from large sellers that absorb the SNAD cost of doing business.

designforyou · ‎06-15-2018

"And if your idea was in place, you could sell an iPhone, send a frozen dinner, keep the phone, the money, sell the phone again, and use the $500 to buy another phone, and keep ripping buyers off."

As a seller, your buyer would receive a full refund for a SNAD in this scenario. So no, the seller would not be able to keep the $500.00, and would be bootd off the site sooner than a buyer committing this fraud would.

EBAY sellers are held(forced) to a higher standard.

Not saying bad sellers don't exist. Just a little harder for them to do so, with buyer money back guarantee.

castlemagicmemories · ‎06-15-2018

Any flaws showing in the listing's pictures should be noted in the description.

If not, SNAD. Buyers may miss those details in pictures, and that is why Ebay requires them to be detailed in the description. Buyers may not see what the seller can't see with the item physically in front of them. Board advice has always been Describe as if there were no pictures, and picture as if there is no description.

All of the things you mention as not being required, actually are. Now some may choose to not include them, and since buyers may just hit the back button, they could be losing sales as buyers often don't ask questions, they just move on, and they could be increasing their chances of a true SNAD.

And there is condition field at the top of the listing, and a condition drop down, complete with condition definitions, to be chosen. Hopefully a complete, accurate description and listing with consistent info, and all the info a buyer needs to make an informed buying decision, will drive sales while lowering the chance of a SNAD.

From Ebay Help Pages:

Item description policy

Your item description is one of the most important parts of a listing – it helps buyers decide whether to buy an item and what to expect if they do.

Our full policy below gives more detail on what information should be included in your item description, but generally, you should add details on the item's condition as well as your terms of sale. Make sure that the information you provide in the item description is consistent with all the details elsewhere in the listing.

Frequently Asked Questions

Can I include that I'm a Top Rated Seller in my item description?

No. If you're a Top Rated Seller, your Top Rated Seller logo appears automatically with your listing to tell buyers you provide a high level of service. We don't allow sellers to also list this information in item descriptions.

How can I tell buyers more about myself?

You can use your profile page to let buyers know more about your background, your hobbies, and your products – this kind of information shouldn't be included in your item description. Our profiles policy has more information.

Read our full policy

Item description policy overview

An item's listing page is where buyers go to find most of the information about an item, as well as your policies, such as shipping charges and returns. Information in the listing helps buyers decide what to buy and know what to expect when purchasing an item. The item description and all areas of the listing should convey the same information. These areas should also be used only to describe the item for sale and to communicate the terms of the sale. If the information you want to include doesn't describe the item you are listing, you might want to include it on your profile page instead.

You aren't permitted to host item descriptions or terms of sale outside eBay – these must be hosted within the listing. The item description or terms of sale also can't be in an image that is hosted outside of eBay.

Make sure your listing follows these guidelines. If it doesn't, it may be removed, and you may be subject to a range of other actions, including limits of your buying and selling privileges and suspension of your account.

What are the guidelines? Allowed

Allowed

Describing only the item you're selling in the listing and the terms of the sale
Providing complete and accurate details
Specifying the condition of the item
Describing any defects or flaws in the item

Not allowed

Including conflicting product information in a listing, such as saying you have a 16G MP3 player in your title, but 8G in the description
Including comments that discourage buyers from buying on eBay, or that could make them lose trust in eBay sellers and eBay.com. For example, we don't allow statements like "eBay holds me to a standard well above 4 stars. 4 stars will get me suspended, so please only leave 5 stars."
Including our PowerSeller, Top Rated Seller, or Top Rated Plus icons or similar logos and expressions. We'll automatically add these to listings if you are eligible.
Including terms such as "top rated seller," "top rated plus," "top seller," "trusted seller," or other similar terms in your listings, About Me pages, profile pages, or Store pages. (If you're a Top Rated Seller and your listings qualify for Top Rated Plus, a prominent Top Rated Plus seal will appear in your listings.)
Listing an item and stating that it may be out of stock at the time of purchase
Listing an item and stating that you're simultaneously selling it outside of eBay
Listing an item and stating the item listed may not be the one that the winning bidder receives upon auction completion
Listing an item and stating that you reserve the right to cancel a buyer's bid at any time
Listings that contain inappropriate or offensive opinions or comments about other eBay members
Listings that contain political views, public service announcements, or other content that does not relate to the sale of an item

Why does eBay have this policy?

This policy is in place to help buyers know what they will receive, and the terms of sale around an item.

With all due respect, many buyers aren't picky; they just want the item they ordered in the condition specified, and a thorough and accurate description and listing will cut down on SNADs.

dolldesigns4u · ‎06-15-2018

I agree with OP. IF a seller has been on Ebay for quite some time, and has good feedback and high sales, it is unlikely the seller is the scammer.

castlemagicmemories · ‎06-15-2018

With all due respect, many buyers aren't picky; they just want the item they ordered in the condition specified, and a thorough and accurate description and listing will cut down on SNADs.

Providing a complete and accurate description, as stated in Ebay rules, is to the seller's advantage.

deser92 · ‎06-15-2018

@designforyou wrote:
"And if your idea was in place, you could sell an iPhone, send a frozen dinner, keep the phone, the money, sell the phone again, and use the $500 to buy another phone, and keep ripping buyers off."

As a seller, your buyer would receive a full refund for a SNAD in this scenario. So no, the seller would not be able to keep the $500.00, and would be bootd off the site sooner than a buyer committing this fraud would.

EBAY sellers are held(forced) to a higher standard.

Not saying bad sellers don't exist. Just a little harder for them to do so, with buyer money back guarantee.

Read the ops statement again,

She basically says that if a seller has a really good reputation that should be taken into account and the buyer should be told to go pound sand.

So in her scenario if a buyer who whowho does not have much of a reputation buys from a seller whowho has her prerequisite requirements and is scammed, the buyer would be out of luck and a seller could continue doing this until their reputation started suffering from it.

castlemagicmemories · ‎06-15-2018

@tunicaslot wrote:
That's the problem - there are dishonest sellers here and those that simply don't describe their items correctly and don't seem to care.

How many times has a seller come here saying they were scammed and then looking at the listing - we see the item indeed qualified for item not as described as he didn't mention the broken handle, stain on the shirt, didn't include measurements ect...

That's the every buyer is a scammer, there is no such thing as a legitimate SNAD, but I had NO RETURNS seller.

designforyou · ‎06-15-2018

"Hopefully a complete, accurate description and listing with consistent info, and all the info a buyer needs to make an informed buying decision, will drive sales while lowering the chance of a SNAD."

I think that is wishful thinking now. The reality is a seller can describe the item, flaws, dirt, or parts only, does not work, etc. Provide 12 photos with the utmost of detail, and a buyer will still falsely claim a SNAD, or ask to cancel the purchase before you ship it. That is the reality today on EBAY.

EBAY simply does not support a sellers listing details, no matter how accurate and detailed they may be. It just makes me wonder why I work so hard to do research on an item, describe it in detail, show detail in photos, when EBAY is not going to care less, when it comes to a buyer falsly claiming snad.

If I miss something, I will certainly take responsibility. But being forced now to accept false claims, is just wrong. Yes, you can call ebay, and CS reps may agree with your listing and details, but they will stilll tell you to refund the buyer, and call them back if there is a problem with the return, and then do absolutely nothing, other then tell you what a good seller you are to refund(kinda like a pat on the head just like a dog)!

"Who's a good seller, oh who's a good seller, there you go, you're a good seller! Now go and list some more, that's a good seller, swallow our policy ripping you off, and go about your business now."

So what is a seller to do?? I will report buyers who abuse the policy(doubt if does any good), and put them on the very special buyers list.

Unfortunately, EBAY want's us to blindly trust that they are taking care of fraudulant buyer and sellers. Yet, everyday a buyer and/or seller is a victim of a fraudster/scammer, on EBAY. Truly I would like to know on a monthly basis the total number of fraud/scammer cases ebay actually prevents/solves/removes from selling here, versus nbr of sellers/buyers sales/purchases completed successfully with no issues. I don't need names, just totals. It would be transparency on ebays part, and a way of knowing percentge wise just how much fraud is occuring, and what the costs of fraud are here.

designforyou · ‎06-15-2018

So in her scenario if a buyer who whowho does not have much of a reputation buys from a seller whowho has her prerequisite requirements and is scammed, the buyer would be out of luck and a seller could continue doing this until their reputation started suffering from it.

That scenario does not exist on EBAY today. I think that happened more in EBAY's past, but not today.

What is a shame is that honest, successful, follow the rules sellers are now being hit with false buyer fraudulant snads. Returns are rising, not decreasing, and I do know from personal experience buyers do lie in SNADS in order to get a full refund and free shipping. Making it easy, attracts some of the worst behavior(lies, cheating, fraud) in people. I am not talking about sleazy sellers, or new sellers who don't quite yet understand ebay policies for listing an item. I am talking about sellers who have been here for years selling with very little to no problems with buyers, now suddenly seeing increased returns via SNADs and cancels.

castlemagicmemories · ‎06-15-2018

I understand and I feel your pain. I know that you can have all the details in the listing and buyers who didn't read or pay attention may just buy impulsively and so you feel it's wrong for them to do so.

I am not saying that it is right.

I have a friend who got back a return. My friend is one of the most careful, meticulous people you would ever know. Her listings are impeccable. She had measurements in the listing. Buyer bought on phone, did not know who to see the description, and so never saw them.

Conversely, though, there is a high incidence of true SNADs on Ebay. This thread is buy well know, respected, knowledgeable sellers (and some buyers), Board regulars, who detailed the high number of their recent purchases that were true SNADs and the abusive, hostile seller messages that ensued:

https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/I-m-beginning-to-see-what-buyers-contend-with/m-p/27854770

Many sellers think the buyer should ask any questions, which is true. But that does not absolve the seller of the responsibility of creating an accurate listing, and can cost sales as buyer hit the back button. Many think every buyer is a scammer, there is no such thing as a legitimate SNAD, and no returns means, you are stuck with it, sucker! No offense to all the great Ebay sellers out there!

Of the last four items I bought, three were not as described. Can I live with them? Yes Should I have to is another story, but the buyer should not be put in the position of deciding do they settle because they want the item. They did not get what they paid for.

Yes, they can open a SNAD case and return as the seller pays return shipping.