eBay

tellmemama · ‎06-16-2019

So I sold a vintage doll outfit yesterday. The buyer is fairly new at 141 and her feedback left shows she has no idea how feedback or eBay really works. A few false/mistakenly left positives and a string of "how do you ship and does that include PO boxes?" left AS feedback.

She sent a few messages making offers on it and I replied I wasn't considering any offers right now. Then she said she wouldn't have the money until 7/1. I thought that was the end of it until she ended up buying and paying. She said she "borrowed" the money. Needless to say my hackles were already up.

Since yesterday I've gotten over 20 messages double checking that it was indeed vintage. I responded with the reasons why I'm certain it is and if she was still in doubt I would be happy to cancel for her. She would only say she wanted it if it was vintage. Clearly my 25 years of experience in my niche means nothing, nor does my feedback which she is free to review to confirm that I'm not in the habit of trying to defraud anyone.

I can already see what's on the horizon. She will receive it, claim it's fake, yada yada yada. So to all the posters who say "kill them with kindness" and "turn them into happy repeat customers with your great customer service skills", how would you proceed?

I'm one more message away from canceling and taking the hit.

Joe

turquoisetulips · ‎06-17-2019

@tellmemama wrote:
So I sold a vintage doll outfit yesterday. The buyer is fairly new at 141 and her feedback left shows she has no idea how feedback or eBay really works. A few false/mistakenly left positives and a string of "how do you ship and does that include PO boxes?" left AS feedback.

She sent a few messages making offers on it and I replied I wasn't considering any offers right now. Then she said she wouldn't have the money until 7/1. I thought that was the end of it until she ended up buying and paying. She said she "borrowed" the money. Needless to say my hackles were already up.

Since yesterday I've gotten over 20 messages double checking that it was indeed vintage. I responded with the reasons why I'm certain it is and if she was still in doubt I would be happy to cancel for her. She would only say she wanted it if it was vintage. Clearly my 25 years of experience in my niche means nothing, nor does my feedback which she is free to review to confirm that I'm not in the habit of trying to defraud anyone.

I can already see what's on the horizon. She will receive it, claim it's fake, yada yada yada. So to all the posters who say "kill them with kindness" and "turn them into happy repeat customers with your great customer service skills", how would you proceed?

I'm one more message away from canceling and taking the hit.

IMO enough is enough when the seller decides it is with things of this nature . I think you might be headed for trouble with this transaction . I believe I would have already called time out after the third message . This buyer obviously has a lot of time on their hands and it probably won't be any better after the order is delivered . Tulips

kensgiftshop · ‎06-17-2019

@esg-enterprises wrote:
You should have blocked her after the 7/1 thing, lol
But seriously I would cancel, buyer requested, of course, then block, my blocked bidders would fill a book.

Why would you choose buyer requested, buyer doesn't want to cancel the order.

If seller wants to cancel, they take the hit.

Have a great day.

poppyswag · ‎06-17-2019

Ugh, nightmare-y, condolences.

turquoisetulips · ‎06-17-2019

The only way to prevent a buyer from defrauding you is to not sell here. luckythewinner

Sort of the same sentiments are in the film '' War games '' .. '' The only winning move is not to play '' . Tulips

mam98031 · ‎06-17-2019

@tunicaslot wrote:
@nobody*s_perfect wrote:
@dippitydoo wrote: ... How is "not shipping and getting an INR" claim better than a cancellation defect? Is there something I am missing here? ... I would imagine Ebay would frown just as hard on sellers who repeatedly "forgot to ship" as they would sellers who ran out of stock. I imagine....
Stop imagining, and check your seller dashboard or read the seller performance standards:

The transaction defect rate is the percentage of your transactions that have one or more of the following defects:
eBay Money Back Guarantee and PayPal Purchase Protection cases closed without seller resolution
Seller-initiated transaction cancellation
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-performance-policy?id=4347

You get a defect point if you cancel a transaction for "out of stock" but not if you promptly issue a refund when a buyer files an INR claim.
So is this what people are now using for out of stock items or when you don't want problems with a PITA? I'm just curious as I never had heard of this go around. I've been honest in taking my defects even for ghost listings but now with lower sales numbers that % rate is awfully high.

I don't think so. While you may avoid a defect, you are certainly likely to get a nice negative FB. It is likely you haven't heard of this before because MOST would never even consider doing this. Personally I think it is really bad advice and certainly it isn't the right thing to do. It would mean that the seller would be hanging onto the buyer's money knowing they had no intention of shipping and just waiting for the buyer to file an INR.

To me all the seller would be doing is creating conflict and it just does not serve any good purpose for the seller or the buyer.

@tunicaslot

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

a_c_green · ‎06-17-2019

@tellmemama wrote:
I can already see what's on the horizon. She will receive it, claim it's fake, yada yada yada. So to all the posters who say "kill them with kindness" and "turn them into happy repeat customers with your great customer service skills", how would you proceed?

As it's now shipped, just spare yourself further what-if scenarios and wait to deal with what does happen, if or when something does. That's all you can do.

If she starts a fresh litany of complaining once it arrives, stay focused on only responding with a clear invitation to return for refund, and nothing else. Don't go down any garden paths with side issues, haggling, debating definitions of the word "vintage" and so on. Your answers may get rather repetitious, but need only say something along the lines of:

"I'm sorry that you're not satisfied with the item. You may return it for a full refund."

That's all.

P.S. To the poster who suggested that it might be a known problem buyer of a particular line of dolls or doll accessories, you might want to PM the OP and see if it is indeed that same person, because if so, you will be able to then share more-specific guidance (not here, but with each other directly) over how to deal with her. In general, though, my strategy above is how I would approach it.

tellmemama · ‎06-17-2019

@luckythewinner wrote:
@tellmemama wrote:
I don't recall anyone here saying that "killing them with kindness" or "great customer service skills" will prevent fraud.

Then you must have missed those threads. There are plenty of posters who have suggested exactly these little nuggets of advice when a buyer becomes difficult.
Difficult is different than fraudulent. I remember people making those suggestions about difficult buyers, but I don't recall them saying it will prevent fraud.

The only way to prevent a buyer from defrauding you is to not sell here.

Very true. But for the record, I never mentioned the word fraud once. You did.

Joe

tellmemama · ‎06-17-2019

@a_c_green wrote:
P.S. To the poster who suggested that it might be a known problem buyer of a particular line of dolls or doll accessories, you might want to PM the OP and see if it is indeed that same person, because if so, you will be able to then share more-specific guidance (not here, but with each other directly) over how to deal with her. In general, though, my strategy above is how I would approach it.

It wasn't a Ginny outfit. I don't even sell those on this site due to the trouble I've had in the past. They sell very nicely elsewhere.

Joe

tellmemama · ‎06-17-2019

Just wanted to say thank you for all of the input, suggestions, and support. I double checked each piece for condition compared to the description and shipped it this morning (in a box) first class with tracking. Just like any other order.

As a side note, I did offer to cancel a few times if she wasn't sure which was followed with four messages begging me to ship only if it was actual vintage then apologized for sending so many questions. I said it would ship in the morning as promised and after 28 messages in a 24 hour period from her there was no need for any further replies. And she hasn't sent any. Now it's a wait and see so I'll definitely keep you all posted.

Who knows? She may actually like what she gets.

Joe

tellmemama · ‎06-21-2019

So the first update. The package was delivered yesterday and as expected I wake up to a message from the buyer: "Fake???" I responded no it is not and if you are unhappy with your purchase please open a return request for a refund.

Somehow I doubt that's the route she wants to take...

Joe

myjunqueyourtreasure · ‎06-21-2019

Bet that was a "I knew this would happen" moment?

Reality is the leading cause of stress.

mam98031 · ‎06-21-2019

@tellmemama wrote:
So the first update. The package was delivered yesterday and as expected I wake up to a message from the buyer: "Fake???" I responded no it is not and if you are unhappy with your purchase please open a return request for a refund.

Somehow I doubt that's the route she wants to take...

Great choice of action. Often times when a buyer appears to be problematic or are just plain rude in emails, they are just building up to bullying you into a partial refund or even a full refund without return. When I get that kind of feeling about a buyer, I do exactly what you did. I respond that I'm sorry they feel there is an issue. If they'd like to return for refund, please open a return and I'll get them taken care of.

Typically I never hear back from them. They just go away quietly. Occasionally they will write for a second time, this time even more rude and trying to get their way. I respond EXACTLY how I did the first time. Eventually they go away.

I hope this is the way it goes for you.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

scga912 · ‎06-21-2019

I'm so sorry that you have to deal with this, but your reply was spot on.

Hopefully she fades silently into the night.

- Suzanne -

tellmemama · ‎06-21-2019

@mam98031 wrote:
@tellmemama wrote:
So the first update. The package was delivered yesterday and as expected I wake up to a message from the buyer: "Fake???" I responded no it is not and if you are unhappy with your purchase please open a return request for a refund.

Somehow I doubt that's the route she wants to take...
Great choice of action. Often times when a buyer appears to be problematic or are just plain rude in emails, they are just building up to bullying you into a partial refund or even a full refund without return. When I get that kind of feeling about a buyer, I do exactly what you did. I respond that I'm sorry they feel there is an issue. If they'd like to return for refund, please open a return and I'll get them taken care of.

Typically I never hear back from them. They just go away quietly. Occasionally they will write for a second time, this time even more rude and trying to get their way. I respond EXACTLY how I did the first time. Eventually they go away.

I hope this is the way it goes for you.

Thanks mam! I can't say I didn't see this coming. She will definitely not get back one penny unless and until I have the item back. I get very few returns but after reading so many "faulty return" threads, I've also begun opening the package in front of the postal carrier when it is delivered.

It worked great a few months ago when I had a vintage doll returned from another site purchase. That buyer also set the framework for a problem and lo and behold after she got it, it wasn't as described. When I wouldn't offer a partial refund the doll was returned naked because she kept the original outfit. What she didn't know was I opened the package and took photos with my mail carrier still present. She opened and escalated a PAYPAL case but I had all my ducks in a row. Including a police report and an affidavit from the mail carrier.

She got her refund from PAYPAL. But not from me.

Joe

mam98031 · ‎06-21-2019

@tellmemama wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:
@tellmemama wrote:
So the first update. The package was delivered yesterday and as expected I wake up to a message from the buyer: "Fake???" I responded no it is not and if you are unhappy with your purchase please open a return request for a refund.

Somehow I doubt that's the route she wants to take...
Great choice of action. Often times when a buyer appears to be problematic or are just plain rude in emails, they are just building up to bullying you into a partial refund or even a full refund without return. When I get that kind of feeling about a buyer, I do exactly what you did. I respond that I'm sorry they feel there is an issue. If they'd like to return for refund, please open a return and I'll get them taken care of.

Typically I never hear back from them. They just go away quietly. Occasionally they will write for a second time, this time even more rude and trying to get their way. I respond EXACTLY how I did the first time. Eventually they go away.

I hope this is the way it goes for you.
Thanks mam! I can't say I didn't see this coming. She will definitely not get back one penny unless and until I have the item back. I get very few returns but after reading so many "faulty return" threads, I've also begun opening the package in front of the postal carrier when it is delivered.

It worked great a few months ago when I had a vintage doll returned from another site purchase. That buyer also set the framework for a problem and lo and behold after she got it, it wasn't as described. When I wouldn't offer a partial refund the doll was returned naked because she kept the original outfit. What she didn't know was I opened the package and took photos with my mail carrier still present. She opened and escalated a PAYPAL case but I had all my ducks in a row. Including a police report and an affidavit from the mail carrier.

She got her refund from PAYPAL. But not from me.

I completely agree with you.

For me, over the years, I've come to realize that those that start communications in the attack mode, envoking God or a combination of both are usually not being forthcoming in their end goals.

Before anyone jumps on me, I'm a religious person myself. But I have no need to express that in every kind of communication I create. And certainly not when I'm contacting a seller regarding a perceived issue with a transaction. But some do. Some think by doing so it somehow makes them appear more honest than the average person or something. But when they do it in an effort to take advantage of someone else, it usually comes across in the tone of the email and certainly isn't reflective of someone that is actually a believer in anything but themselves and their wallets.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999