Are we getting scammed 3 times in a row?

[kaiomi]

Kinda' new here. Our account is old but we've only started selling in earnest these last couple of months.

We've had 3 different buyers in the last month claim that their item was damaged in shipping. 2 of the items were pottery and one was a silver-plated tea set. The first pottery person refused to send us photos for a week or so and when he did it looked like he had thrown half of the items on the floor to break them. He's demanding half of his money back through a claim with Ebay which is down from his original demand of about 3/4 of the purchase price while he kept the remaining good pieces (he's a collector of this specific potter he says). We haven't reimbursed him yet because I feel like I'm just rewarding a scammer. 

The second person was the silver plate tea set buyer who showed a photo of a leg broken off of the tray (the least valuable part of the set) so I just reimbursed her about 20% of the sale price so I wouldn't have to pay for shipping back from Japan. 

The third person bought a pottery vase and showed photos of 2 small chips that had occurred in shipping (supposedly.) I offered a full refund and to pay for her to ship it back but (she claims she is a collector of this specific potter) and wants to keep it but wanted me to pay for her to travel 90 miles to a professional restorer to repair the vase. I told her that would exceed the value of the vase and offered her 20% of the sale price in a refund. She accepted. 

Is this normal? I mean, I try to package this stuff as if it's going to go through a football game. Both of the pottery buyers immediately accused me of not packaging properly. We've shipped plenty of other pottery to people with no issue. Is being scammed a line item in selling on Ebay? How could I handle these situations better in the future? Am I being paranoid? 

[soh.maryl]

Are you claiming that any buyer who states his item is damaged is trying to scam you? Surely not.

And, BTW, buyers are not required to send you a picture to substantiate their claim.

It's my continued strong suggestion that ALL eBay sellers need to read the Money Back Guarantee for buyers, preferably BEFORE beginning to sell here.  If they do that, they will understand that a buyer is never required to prove his claim that the item is damaged or otherwise not as described. All the buyer has to do is open an NAD case and eBay will require him to send a prepaid return shipping label and to refund in total once the item is received back.  

[simply-the-best-for-you]

 Are you double boxing?   It seems odd that s'posed collectors would purposely break the items & pottery is not exactly a high scam item.   I mean anything is possible, but it seems more likely that they broke in shipping, as typically people who buy studio pottery are in fact, collectors of that particular potter or style & those folks are typically NOT damaging items they collect & appreciate.  

[espresso_warehouse]

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@soh.maryl wrote:

Are you claiming that any buyer who states his item is damaged is trying to scam you? Surely not.

And, BTW, buyers are not required to send you a picture to substantiate their claim.

It's my continued strong suggestion that ALL eBay sellers need to read the Money Back Guarantee for buyers, preferably BEFORE beginning to sell here.  If they do that, they will understand that a buyer is never required to prove his claim that the item is damaged or otherwise not as described. All the buyer has to do is open an NAD case and eBay will require him to send a prepaid return shipping label and to refund in total once the item is received back.  

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As someone who actually sells in this current climate, I can tell you this is a common scam(particularly the partial refund seeking) however it doesn't seem likely people would consistently do this with pottery. Instead of engaging with people and arguing about it, just send them a return shipping label. Don't do the partial refund game.

If you get into a disagreement with someone about damage and refuse demands for a partial refund, they might smash it and send you a photo. Honestly that sounds like what might have happened in one case.

Unlike the previous poster's claim of certainty you cannot be sure whether it was truly damaged in shipping or not. It could have been due to an irresponsible carrier, accident or your bad packaging. It also could be a buyer trying to get a partial refund.

If you get someone you feel is acting abusive, make sure to report them. Otherwise just try to get the item back. Hopefully things start to improve here.

[jahood1984]

It is pretty common for buyers to try and find some issue to attempt to get the item free or heavily discounted, I'm especially leery when they refuse to send pictures of said damage.  No they aren't required to but I've never made a request to a seller that didn't involve multiple pictures to back up my claim.  It's also common for a buyer to already own a damaged version of what they purchase and use images of it or even return it....   I've had a buyer send me pictures of a different laptop than the one I sent, they wanted half back to cover the "shipping damage".  Guess they figured I wouldn't look at the pictures and notice it's not the same laptop?  

  I'm of the opinion "please open a case and return for a full refund" is the best option in "most" cases.  That varies if return shipping is expensive and what the item and claim is of course.  I also keep in mind carriers do beat the crap out of packages more often than I'd like.

[kaiomi]

I guess I'm saying it's hard to tell when a claim is genuine and when it's not and so are any of these scenarios familiar scams to the more experienced sellers? I do ask for photos so that I can file an insurance claim if necessary and for my own knowledge. Since Ebay doesn't require any proof it leaves sellers as sitting ducks don't you think? Do you just accept this as part of business and budget it in and it's still profitable?

[kaiomi]

I imagine the scam is that you can get something of value at a discounted price. Saying that they are collectors of that potter is a way to say they want to keep the item and get a refund. 

I accept the possibility that these are all legit claims with a few irrational demands thrown on top and that the real problem is my packaging. I'm not double boxing. I've never heard of that. Boxes are expensive but so are refunds so I'll look into that. 

Thanks for the ideas and considerations!

[kaiomi]

Your advice about just sending a return shipping label makes sense. The partial refund thing could really eat you up. 

[yuzuha]

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@kaiomi wrote:

I'm not double boxing. I've never heard of that. Boxes are expensive but so are refunds so I'll look into that. 

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There's your problem. Anything fragile like pottery needs to be double-boxed to protect against impact during shipping.

[beautifulbeauty2012]

I bet you are a victim of a pottery pirate. Scam! They replace their old or broken pieces for free on ebay. 

I have some epic stories how those scammers tried to do it to me, and (after doing a dig on them - including contacting other sellers who left them feedback - this is a very important part of any seller who smells something fishy) one even said : don`t send the plate to me - she knew I knew about her dirty business and already scammed many sellers and run from me without asking for the refund (I wasted hours on her, so it was justified!)

This is a very risky category, especially if you sell an item, which is a part of a set. Try to avoid this category if you can, or have a plan how to deal with scammers who swipe their old or broken pieces for free.

[fashunu4eeuh]

Damage happens. Even well packed items can still get broken during shipping.

Like another poster suggested, there is no way to be certain of the arrival condition of a mailed package, especially with international transit.

So under such circumstances, it can be better to take a buyer at their word, rather than hold them in suspicion of scamming and lose their cooperation in resolving the problem. This situation is why shipping insurance exists. It is to make the sender whole after damage or loss is reported by the recipient.

Once they alert you, assure the buyer they will be refunded in a timely manner and request the buyer’s assistance. Ask they retain the item and packaging (to turn over to the carrier). Then ask for photos of both, explaining they are needed to file an insurance claim. If photos are sent, so much the better.

Most shipping insurance claims can be done online, including USPS. If the carrier pays out, then both parties are made whole again. If the claim is denied, take the expense as a loss when filing yearly tax documents. In either case, the transaction becomes a better experience for both buyer and seller when handled this way. (Keep in mind, shipping insurance can get voided if the buyer sends the goods back to the seller.)

This information doesn't help much now, after the fact, but hopefully its use may help for future issues.

[beautifulbeauty2012]

The problem is USPS has been denying all claims in the past two years (from other sellers and my experience). Even when they lose Priority package -even after you file an appeal, they switch to another story and deny again.

For all the years I`ve been selling online, I filed three claims with USPS. The first one was about three years ago, submitted pictures of the damage from a buyer - check was at my door in a day ($80). Then, about 1.5 years, there was another damage (small amount, about $30) - denial with some absurd reason. Then, about a year ago USPS lost Priority package ($40) -denied twice. Many other sellers have noticed this "change" in USPS "insurance". I now just ship the cheapest way possible and set the difference between the cheap and imaginary insured Priority in case there is an issue - that insurance type is more reliable.

[dbfolks166mt]

     I have had no problems with claims with USPS but it requires cooperation from the buyer because USPS is going to almost insist that the item along with the original packing be taken to a PO for inspection by the PM. If the PM acknowledges that the damage was the result of the shipping and the item was packed well they will submit the paperwork to the claims office in St. Louis. They will also keep the item(s) and the packing. 

     I have had a couple claim shipping damage and the minute I mentioned I was filing a claim with USPS and that USPS would be contacting them about bringing the package into the post office for inspection the claim stopped. 

     A lot of buyers are unaware that they can also file a claim with the carrier and in fact it is easier for them to do so since they are going to have to take the item into the PO anyway. 

     For international shipments one of the benefits of the eBay GSP is they cover, or they claim they will cover, buyer claims related to shipping damage. 

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/shipping-items/setting-shipping-options/global-shipping-program?id... 

[dbfolks166mt]

     I have to agree with you on this one not all are scammers some are simply buyers trying to get part of their money back. I don't get a lot of claims but I NEVER offer a partial refund. I simply request the item be returned for a full refund. Interesting how many of those cases suddenly close. That does not stop me from adding them to my BBL. 

[kaiomi]

Ebay International Shipping says it covers broken items but there is no mention of whether there is a dollar limit to that. I just sold an item to Australia and used USPS so that I could take out additional insurance. It cost me more in shipping than the buyer paid but I figured it was worth the piece of mind.... Does Ebay International have a blanket policy to cover all damaged items regardless of the cost?