Advice on suing buyer in small claims court for being refunded and not returning the item

[magesystems]

I recently sold a laptop without a battery to a buyer. The buyer received the item and wanted to return it because "it doesn't charge". I declined as this was stated in the listing. The buyer subsequently filed a claim "not as described" and won (?) and my appeal was denied (??). The buyer was automatically refunded and has not returned the item.

I live in Connecticut and the buyer lives in New Jersey. This is close enough that I don't mind going through the motions to sue in in small claims court and would otherwise like to learn more about the process first-hand even if it does not result in getting my money back in the end.

From what I've read, Connecticut has no jurisdiction over the buyer because they are out of state and I must file claim in New Jersey. The buyer's state says that a theft of "more than $200 and up to $500" is considered a fourth-degree felony offense. Sounds pretty clear.

I have reached out to the seller both via eBay messages and by phone. They have expressed no desire to return the item despite receiving a pre-paid return label.

I have the buyer's name, address, phone number, and place of business/work. I am keeping record of conversations and dates.

As a first order of business I believe that I should file a criminal complain with my local PD and to have it forwarded to the buyer's local PD and proceed from there.

Considering that the transaction may also be considered criminal (including misrepresentation and fraud), is small claims the right place to file?

I would appreciate any further advice on how I should proceed.

Thank you.

[dailyanew]

Simply claiming that a buyer is using Buyers Remorse to return and obtain a refund only works if the buyer actually admits to it, and even that is subject to the whims (opinions) of the eBay CS rep that you deal with

All the buyer needs to claim is "item not as described", and seller has zero recourse to disprove that claim.

I just went through this on a brand new iPad in a sealed package and had proof that buyer lied, but was never given the opportunity to present that proof, even pleading to provide that proof and making an appeal fell on deaf ears.

I remember years ago when buyers had zero recourse against dishonest sellers due to eBay policy, now it's sellers who are getting screwed (2 or 3 times due to non-refundable Final Value and PayPal fees) by shady buyers.

It went from one extreme to the other.

There's no in between here, and it's like eBay is implementing policies in a "learn by error" format.

[needitlikea0inthehead]

You know Ebay does have policy concerning bad actions on the part of the buyer.   I think the problem is they do not have an team informed to make the logical/legal decisions.   That would take time for them to research, know the current ways buyers are ripping sellers off,  etc. and follow the policy.  It is much easier to just get rid of the complaint, give the money back and be done with it.  They must think all sellers can afford the loss and they want to look good so the buyer keeps spending.  Does anyone know of them actually banning a buyer?

[hotwheelssales68]

I'm in a very similar situation. I sold a rare $1000 Hot wheel with "No refunds and no returns for any reason". Buyer sends a poor photo claiming that because the plastic bubble looks to have cracked during shipping, he says it's "not as described" and wanted reimbursed. These have been made into replicas because of the rarity so the eBay representative said they have to honor the buyer's protection even though I stated no returns and ensures me that "I'll have a chance to inspect it before they reimburse him".

I did get insurance on the item so I was trying to submit it in ebay. Little did I know that eBay has there own insurance and that this option doesn't work for USPS so that wasted a couple days. So, before I get a response from USPS about whether or not he can bring the item to the PO or ship back to me to bring in, he gets eBay to step in and send it off.

Well, next thing I know, I get notification that the buyer is refunded. I see an option to dispute so I did just that and contacted them a few times before I found out the tracking # and what address he sent it to... not knowing that whatever they decide would be final. That didn't ever cross my mind that it wouldn't eventually be resolved.

Mind you, my return label on the original box sent to him was correct, but someone found an old address in my profile and sent it there. This is the basis on why they aren't overturning the closed. They said "the buyer provided proof that it arrived" and that's why they refunded. The tracking # clearly shows that it arrived back at the buyer's home.  By this time, the dispute has been closed and they refuse to correct or reopen. It this insane or is it just me? I've spent many hours communicating with eBay help and the escalation team who always tell me that it's closed, but they will send it to the resolution or dispute team and I'll get a response within 24-48hrs. Always the same answer comes back. We're sorry but it's closed.

Is there any way to send the screen shots of the lies they told me throughout the process? Is there a secret # to talk to someone that will action use their brain?

[hotwheelssales68]

Is this in writing somewhere? "When a NAD (not as described case) is opened, the funds in your account are put on hold until the item is shown as delivered, then you have 2 business days to refund." 

I have a similar case that's blowing my mind. I replied to the the original post if you want to check it out. Anything I can do to try to force their had would be good. I think I'm already going to get hosed by USPS because my 20 day inspection period ends tomorrow and he still hasn't shipped it.

Thanks

[southern*sweet*tea]

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@hotwheelssales68 wrote:

Is this in writing somewhere? "When a NAD (not as described case) is opened, the funds in your account are put on hold until the item is shown as delivered, then you have 2 business days to refund." 

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https://www.paypal.com/us/smarthelp/article/why-is-my-payment-from-a-sale-on-ebay-on-hold-faq1377

"When you get paid for items sold on eBay, eBay may request that your payment be held temporarily. This means that the money won’t be available to use immediately, but is usually available within 21 days*.

How can I get more information about this eBay hold?

PayPal agents can't update, change or answer questions about your eBay hold. Please Contact eBay to learn more about why your payment is on hold and how you may be able to get your money sooner."

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/getting-paid/payouts-work-managed-payments-sellers/pending-payment...

"Why we put payments on hold and how to avoid it

Like you, we want to make sure buyers have a great experience when buying on eBay. To help ensure eBay remains a safe place to buy and sell, and to meet our legal and compliance obligations  we sometimes place a hold on funds if there is an open claim or dispute on the transaction, if your buyer reports a problem with the transaction, if your account is restricted or suspended, or if you owe eBay money. If your funds are put on hold, we will notify you by email and, depending on the reason, may request additional information from you to help resolve the issue"

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/managing-returns-refunds/handle-return-request-seller?id=4115

"When the buyer opens a return request we'll notify you by email (to your registered email address) and through eBay Messages - opens in new window or tab. You have 3 business days respond to the request and resolve the buyer's issue. We've outlined your response options below. In some cases, we may automatically accept a return request on your behalf.

If you're unable to resolve the issue within this time, the buyer may ask us to step in and help. In some cases, if you haven't responded to the return request, we may issue a refund to the buyer and seek reimbursement from you without requiring the buyer to return the item."

[luckythewinner]

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@magesystems wrote:

I recently sold a laptop without a battery to a buyer. The buyer received the item and wanted to return it because "it doesn't charge". I declined as this was stated in the listing. The buyer subsequently filed a claim "not as described" and won (?) and my appeal was denied (??). The buyer was automatically refunded and has not returned the item.

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IMHO you should review the policies quoted below with a lawyer before you go to the trouble of filing a case in small claims court.

Your buyer will (correctly) argue that you gave eBay discretion over whether the item should be returned, and your wishes do not supercede the eBay decision that you agreed to accept. 

When a buyer isn't required to return an item
In some instances, we may not require that an item be returned to the seller. In these situations, we refund the buyer and may seek reimbursement from the seller, for example if:

• The seller chooses not to accept a return request when they offered returns in the listing
• The return request was opened because the item was not as described

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy...

You agree to comply with the policy and permit us to make a final decision on any eBay Money Back Guarantee case.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/member-behaviour-policies/user-agreement?id=4259

[hotwheelssales68]

Thank you for the follow-up. There are so many things that they lied about when I called or chatted with the "helpdesk". I would have done it like a lot of you said and just issue the return slip myself. Instead eBay issued it from one of the 5 addresses they have on file, sending to a 2yo address. My shipping label to the buyer was correct. How does eBay shipping issuing an incorrect label justify $1040 scam?

[ra_201044]

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@hotwheelssales68 wrote:

Thank you for the follow-up. There are so many things that they lied about when I called or chatted with the "helpdesk". I would have done it like a lot of you said and just issue the return slip myself. Instead eBay issued it from one of the 5 addresses they have on file, sending to a 2yo address. My shipping label to the buyer was correct. How does eBay shipping issuing an incorrect label justify $1040 scam?

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What do you have as the 'return address' in your settings? That is the address they will use.

[ra_201044]

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@luckythewinner wrote:

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@magesystems wrote:

I recently sold a laptop without a battery to a buyer. The buyer received the item and wanted to return it because "it doesn't charge". I declined as this was stated in the listing. The buyer subsequently filed a claim "not as described" and won (?) and my appeal was denied (??). The buyer was automatically refunded and has not returned the item.

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IMHO you should review the policies quoted below with a lawyer before you go to the trouble of filing a case in small claims court.

Your buyer will (correctly) argue that you gave eBay discretion over whether the item should be returned, and your wishes do not supercede the eBay decision that you agreed to accept. 

When a buyer isn't required to return an item
In some instances, we may not require that an item be returned to the seller. In these situations, we refund the buyer and may seek reimbursement from the seller, for example if:

• The seller chooses not to accept a return request when they offered returns in the listing
• The return request was opened because the item was not as described

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy...

You agree to comply with the policy and permit us to make a final decision on any eBay Money Back Guarantee case.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/member-behaviour-policies/user-agreement?id=4259

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This is all true, however, ebay didn't take into account the initial return request for "doesn't charge" when the item listed stated no battery(so how could it charge?). Then, when declined due to that, they opened an INAD for the exact same problem.

I also agree that the seller should have accepted the return on the INAD case(as we all know how those go), however on appeal(usually the ONLY way to tell your story hoping someone will actually look into it), the first return request - if the INAD request was for the exact same thing -  should have been taken into account.

[hotwheelssales68]

Just to follow up with you, according to the wonderful help desk, I forfeit the right to 2 day inspection before refund because they said my address is wrong.

The return address on the item going out was correct, but eBay sent the buyer a shipping label from 1 of the 5 addresses they keep on file which was 2yo address.

ebay is quick to screw a seller and unscrupulous. $1040 and many hours of my life studying eBay law/arguing my point and even though they “feel for me”. Their simple answer is “it closed, nothing I can do”

[greatmidwestcoin]

Here's what I have done. Be precise on your actions and dates to the buyer. Start with letting them know that you will be filing felony mail fraud with the USPS Inspection Service. They should expect a knock on their door in a week or two. You will also file theft reports with your PD and their PD. Give their PD and address info to let them know you mean business. Put dates that if you do not receive your merchandise back by then you take that action. Inform them. If that fails, then give them the date when you will file in SC Court if you do not get your property back. If that dates passes, file. My local PD sends a certified letter to the buyer.  That usually is enough to shake them up and return the stolen property. Go for it. You seem educated enough in your post that you don't need others opinions. All you have to lose is court costs and a little time.

[chi-towncollectibles]

Ebay just did it to me. IN the middle of a case. Closed case in favor of buyer. keeps item and money. Ebay keeps their 9% Seller Screwed. Fighting ebay right now for $500 dollar item i wont get back! Good Luck I feel your pain. oh Plus $75 for refund label ebay told me i had to purchase for an unverified buyer address on paypal. Something they tell you not to do.   

https://community.ebay.com/t5/Shipping-Returns/Shipping-Return-Nightmare/m-p/31632036#M369575

[chi-towncollectibles]

All because i couldnt purchase A Return Label on Ebay.   Purchase of Return Label Should be refunded NOT the Full Cost with No Return. Opens the door to Fraud & Theft and using Postal Services to do it.  

[chi-towncollectibles]

Spoken like an Ebay Representative 

[powell-memorabilia]

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@chi-towncollectibles wrote:

Spoken like an Ebay Representative 

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Or like someone who has done some quick mental math on the gain from a small claims suit.  OP is going to be out $1000 just for his time and court fees.  Probability of success is low, so let’s say that the expected return from continuing on this course is -$800.  The original item loss is a sunk cost, at this point.