Where do unpaid item strikes show up?

[myronann]

I just opened a case on my non-paying bidder. If he doesn't respond (and I don't think he will, as I already warned him about the pending UID) and he gets a strike, will it show up in his feedback or something? Or is the buyer the only one who will be able to see it?

[shivaarch]

Restating the problem statement.

eBay should consider making improvements to their process for:

1) Transparency in reflecting buyer performance

2) Compensating seller time/inconvenience/loss for unpaid items

3) Driving positive buyer behavior and discouraging system manipulation through inbuilt safeguards

4) Reducing inconsistency in treatment between buyers and sellers

5) Anything else???

A number of ideas and suggestions have been generated for each of these. #1 for example - current state is using unpaid item strikes which eventually could cause "behind-the-scenes" suspension from eBay. It would be more effective if manipulative/poor buyer behavior were exposed as it happened (more real-time) via multiple data-driven objective inputs such as negative feedback left for unpaid items, bid retractions, late payments and suspension was driven by these data in a holistic, non-subjective manner.

[hondamedic]

---

@shivaarch wrote:

Restating the problem statement.

eBay should consider making improvements to their process for:

1) Transparency in reflecting buyer performance

2) Compensating seller time/inconvenience/loss for unpaid items

3) Driving positive buyer behavior and discouraging system manipulation through inbuilt safeguards

4) Reducing inconsistency in treatment between buyers and sellers

5) Anything else???

A number of ideas and suggestions have been generated for each of these. #1 for example - current state is using unpaid item strikes which eventually could cause "behind-the-scenes" suspension from eBay. It would be more effective if manipulative/poor buyer behavior were exposed as it happened (more real-time) via multiple data-driven objective inputs such as negative feedback left for unpaid items, bid retractions, late payments and suspension was driven by these data in a holistic, non-subjective manner.

---

 Good morning and welcome to The Part Timers Forum!

While your suggestions are very well thought out.

They are intellectually presented.

Sound in business principle.

And reasonable for a perfect online experience.

Just one question, you do know you're posting on eBay, right?

[aceofspades2006]

I have some things to add to my original comment.

The thing about the unpaid item case is that I find that its too strict and could be detracting to buyers. I'm well aware that buyers and I make mistakes from time to time or that new buyers and sellers may be ignorant of the rules. I'd much prefer buyers that are willing to contact me and own up to mistakes instead of me wasting time relentlessly contacting buyers for 4 days and then waiting another 4 while the case is in motion to get fees back. Which is why I think that entirely relying on the system can detract new buyers.

This is another reason why I'd prefer a negative feedback system or an examination of strikes because it gives people accountability, I don't have to wait for 8 days to get my fees back (i.e. can pull the listing early because of bad buyer), and I don't have to punish new buyers/sellers by slapping them with a strike, I can just try to give them honest feedback and if negative feedback trends, it gives me more justification to try and suspend them with unpaid item or any other case/reporting methods.

At any rate. feedback is important to both buyer and seller and only allowing the buyer to see seller feedback and not the other way around is not condusive to sellers which make Ebay money in the most direct way with buyers only making ebay money if they buy something which apparently is a problem with buyers (gone through 5 unpaid item cases with no response after 2 invoices/contacts being sent). 

[hondamedic]

---

@aceofspades2006 wrote:

At any rate, you should be able to leave some sort of feedback after you've gone through the resolution center. 

Also, what prevents a buyer from having 2 unpaid item strikes negatives from just starting over since most buyers are blocked from viewing listings after 2, but aren't suspended bidding when on sellers BBL?

---

 Got it? A dishonest buyer can start a new ID no matter what you do... And I do believe something needs to be done about "chronic" bidders who don't pay. I think eBay needs to look at it like they have with buyers with too many INR or SNAD filings or excessive NEG FB. They must have some formula they're using for those.

[apollooxxi]

Hello all,

Long-time buyer, and relatively new seller here. I've sold about 4 items on eBay so far.

I just dealt with my first delinquent buyer, unfortunately. I gave him about three invoices, but the buyer never once communicated with me at all. I opened and closed the UIC without hesitation.

I was very disappointed to find afterwards that I could not leave negative feedback, and this delinquent buyer still maintains a ridiculous “100%” rating, with glowing reviews such as “A++ buyer!”. I wonder if trying to leave feedback before officially closing the case would have worked? I presume it might have bungled the whole process flow, however.

After all my research into the unpaid item process on eBay, reviewing this long-going thread, and after my own personal experience, I must say this entire unpaid item process does feel toothless and superficial. This leniency seems to come from some “customer is always right” mentality (the “customer” being the buyer in this case), but this directly conflicts and contradicts with the binding contractual agreement eBay itself is supposed to uphold. Are purchases on eBay not contractually binding? Is winning an eBay auction any less serious or less binding than winning an auction in person? If so, why let delinquent buyers off so toothlessly for breaking a binding contract, and wasting the seller’s time and money?

I do not buy earlier “credit” arguments I’ve seen made in this thread (that, if you miss a bill payment, the company doesn’t publicly shame you but hits your credit instead). That analogy is simply silly and does not hold up. A recurring bill or monthly payment is different from an auction. In an auction, the seller *volunteers* themselves, and their finances. To bid in an auction is to say “I will voluntarily buy this item,” and to say you have the money to do so. Much different from a recurring bill, where emergencies or tough times can occur in your life that understandably disturb your ability to make a usually consistent payment. A better analogy would be walking into a bar, ordering $100 worth of drinks, and then you bail on the tab. You voluntarily walked into the bar, and voluntarily ordered $100 worth of drinks, but now you can’t pay?

I propose that any unpaid item automatically result in an automated negative feedback on the delinquent buyer's page, and an automatic dock on their rating. There needs to be some kind of public accountability for a buyer's poor behavior, especially if its egregious (like in my example—the buyer didn’t even try, never once communicated with me, despite my messages and invoices—yet, they had no problem winning my auction, huh). Without public accountability, you do not incentivize delinquents to correct their behavior. A hidden “account hit” that only eBay knows exists is sorely insufficient to produce real change here. This coddling of buyers needs to stop, and eBay needs to seriously hold them to their contracts, and deliver real repercussions for breaking said contract.

Fears of “buyer flight” are exaggerated and misguided. Honest buyers have nothing to fear. I have a 100% rating on eBay from 28 transactions (mostly purchases), and in the few purchases in which my money was tight for whatever reason, I was forthcoming with the seller that my payment would take a while (maybe 5 days at most), and everything worked out. That’s what a good buyer should do if there is an honest problem with his ability to pay immediately, instead of just dithering or bailing on the transaction.

Selling has mostly been a pleasant experience, aside from this one delinquent, so I will carry on and not remain stuck or embittered by this one incident, but I would ask eBay to please take my suggestions into consideration, and hold buyers more accountable for delinquent behavior.

That’s all, folks.

[apollooxxi]

>In an auction, the seller *volunteers* themselves, and their finances.

Meant to be "the buyer volunteers themselves", not seller.

I also corrected other parts where I accidentally said "seller", when I really meant to say "buyer".

[ptheb]

it doesn't show the buyers id so they are protected but seller is not.  basically a buyer has rights and the seller does not.  they can leave whatever feedback they like no matter how hard you try.  buyers can leave feedback on the buying experience but the seller cannot.  I think it is very discriminatory, unfair and unacceptable.  the buyer can just open a new account and the seller is not protected at all.

[repeatseller]

Amen!! Amazing that a Buyer with Unpaid Item "strikes" can still manage a 100% Feedback score! I guess if I decide I no longer want an item that I bid on I will just not pay as there are absolutely NO repercussions.  Very sad and shame on Ebay,

[repeatseller]

Yes, there should be "public spankings" Ebay,  Maybe it would actually be a deterrent 🙂 If I am late on my "house payment" I know I would suffer the consequence of a posting.

[buononut]

Creating a new account gets a bad buyer out of the "unpaid item" jam as well as the "negative feedback" jam.  To quarantine a bad account due to unpaid strikes is thus rendered nearly useless b/c the account is abandoned anyway. 

The analogy of the unpaid strike being akin to a ding on your credit score for a late payment is a poor one; a late payment does NOT equal no payment.  Credit card companies are liable for fraudulent charges and ensure the seller still gets money (then, reflects this in the buyer's credit score).  eBay gives nothing but a refund on the Final fee.  How about the Listing fee, too?!?  Impossible to compensate for a seller's time or effort spent... so give us the proper tools!  Public Spanking would help...

If "a bad buyer will always be a bad buyer", then why not allow sellers to see them and even to block if the buyer has ONE strike? (Why TWO as a minimum?  What's the difference?)

Surely the biggest issue is robo-accounts, or whatever.  I've had a rash of 3 unpaids in 8 months.  Never before in over 10 years of part-time selling!

For me, I think I'll start to sell: BIN only & require instant PayPal only; no more auctions.  More costly, but worth it to avoid being scammed and avoid hassle/delay.

[1chiefsfan73]

I am equally disappointed in Ebay's "Seller's Protection".  I have 75 transactions and 100% feedback over 10 years.  My buyer refused to pay for a car.  No deposit, no balance and then tried to pull a shipping scam.  Why can't I leave negative feedback to warn other Ebay users?  I will not use Ebay in the future to sell higher priced items and I am extremely disappointed in Ebay's lack of buyer protection and non response to my concerns. 

[xl00]

I didn't read through the entire thread, but there is a way out. We can treat this in the way that other auctioneers and online commerce sites handle it, which is require payment information from the buyer before they can bid/buy. When the auction ends, the account is charged automatically.

There are complexities to this that ebay would have to work through, like ensuring that the payment method is valid, identifying a 'primary' method if you allow for more than one method, ensuring enough funds exist for large purchases like a car, etc. But it could solve the deadbeat buyer problem...

[hondamedic]

---

@xl00 wrote:

I didn't read through the entire thread, but there is a way out. We can treat this in the way that other auctioneers and online commerce sites handle it, which is require payment information from the buyer before they can bid/buy. When the auction ends, the account is charged automatically.

There are complexities to this that ebay would have to work through, like ensuring that the payment method is valid, identifying a 'primary' method if you allow for more than one method, ensuring enough funds exist for large purchases like a car, etc. But it could solve the deadbeat buyer problem...

---

 Welcome to The Part Timers Forum!

"There are complexities to this that ebay would have to work through"

eBay work through complexities to insure a bidder pays?

Been here awhile, you need a less complex solution, trust me.....

[wildonedeals]

I would be fine with a computer leaving negative feedback for non-paid items.  That way they KNOW it is coming and can't be changed.  In the case of NPD, no feedback should be able to be left from a buyer since they haven't done anything to deserve leaving any feedback.  They bid, they won, and chose to be deadbeats.  They get what they deserve.

[perseids812]

Ebay just told me that we can't see the unpaid item strikes, only ebay can see it.  I had a buyer that didn't pay and I went through all the steps ebay suggests and they did refund my final value fee BUT now  I've noticed that there is no way to leave a negative feedback for a non paying buyer because the case is now closed and my final fee refunded...called ebay and was told it's too late, I should have left feedback before opening case...BUMMER! because I didn't want to leave negative feedback while case was opened thinking that maybe buyer might still pay if they realized there was a non paying case opened on him/her...and I was thinking if buyer had seen negative feedback, they wouldn't pay for sure...so I held off on feedback...that was a BIG Mistake, because now there is nothing on his feedback record that shows he is a NON PAYING BUYER...they won't let me leave feedback for him now.  CRAZY!