a growing hatred of the return for not functional

[emtp117]

Hey trinton@ebay,

Here is another of those cases where you are going to tell me I should take one for the team, even though I included a picture of the turned on screen in my listing, and you can see some ghosting he did not seem to be concerned as he never asked.

Had a 3 year old piece of electronics that I sold, original buyer never completed the transaction, I offer a second chance to the next bidder, he asks a couple questions, scratches, damages, including why the item was not sold. Answered every question, there were pictures in the listing or the item as well as many extra accessories that I included at no charge, actually the accessories are valued more than the item at this point. He seemed fine and told me he would take it, made the payment and within 18 hours of payment it was in the mail, and the post office got it cross country and delivered in less than 48 hours, so total time from payment to at the destination 62 hours.

He gets the item and messages me saying the is a problem with the screen (picture of screen in listing) and he wants my help. The issue is there is a bit of screen ghosting on a 3 year old phone, bright screen is in the picture on the listing. In my photo you can see some faint shadows, he claims severe burn in, well after 3 years some ghosting is expected. We go back and forth, he wants me to pay to have a new screen put in, I have it listed as used, and no return/exchange. During the back and forth he mentions that if he know there was screen burn in he would not have bid as high. Needless to say we did not come to a resolution. 

I did a quick search and the price he paid is the agerage for a parts only phone, and those that are functional are more then this guy paid, and they don't include 3 extra batteries, on a hicap, a case a charger for the smaller batteries, I even sent the replacement nibs for the spen. I also reviewed a lot of listings for the note 4 as well as other large smart phones from that tims, not one had a listing that medtioned anything about screen burnin, most used the catalog listing and not much else.

So he opens up  SNAD and I am ticked because I listed as used, took a close up of the screen turned on with the welcome screen showing, which is white and you can see slight ghosting. He never asked about it. So now I have to wait until Thursday the 24th to be able to do anything because I get 3 days to respond, but oh buyers get months to do things it seems.

So I guess that I will wait until the 24th and close my account because I can find a lot more places that I can shop, and as I don't sell much is it really worth it????? 

Not sure if this has been suggested, but make it an effort to file a SNAD claim, make to buyer bring the packaging and item to a designated location for inspection, inspector looks at it, looks at the listing, make a decision, if its the same, ebay should say sorry but that is buyers remorse. Or because Ebay offers the MBG, then EBAY pays it, why because the seller did it right and the buyer regretted their decision

Ass I wait for the 25th when I can close my account because some off shore call center staff made the whole thing worse that it was, trinton were you working evenings on 19 Aug.

Just a couple more days then poof

[tarpedge]

Who pays for the inspector, and won't the seller need to inspected that the item is as described when it was packed.

Why can't you close your account now?

[bigchief2472000]

I don't see anything that stands out as an obvious problem with the screen in your picture.  If you knew about the problem, you should've mentioned it in the listing instead of expecting someone else to be able to spot every single flaw from a couple pictures.  I've got a phone that I've had for more than 3 years and there's no "ghosting" on the screen, so no, that's not something that should just be expected.

[yuzuha]

If an item has flaws, you need to explicitly state those flaws in the listing.  "No returns" is not a get out of jail free card for not describing everything that is wrong with an item, and screen burn in IS something that should be disclosed.  Just saying "well, you can see it in the photos" doesn't cut it either-- you need to mention it in the description as well.

[angelgirl327]

If you're thinking you will close down your account to avoid a refund - won't happen.   Your money was frozen in paypal as soon as the claim was filed and ebay won't close down your account until everything is taken care of.   Ebay will force the refund if you don't agree to have them return the phone - and they will be able to keep the phone.   You will lose your phone and your money.    Send them a prepaid return shipping label and when you get the phone back, refund completely.  

[deep-garnet-red]

I don't see any ghosting in the pic. Maybe you can see it because you know it's there? Since you knew it was there you should have mentioned it in the description. You withheld that info. Now it's SNAD. Pretty much an open and shut case. Hopefully you learned from this.

[emtp117]

In response, I had not used the phone in over 5 months, I looked at the photo on ebay and can see it, I did not know it was there. whenI got his request I looked at the listing and noticed it when I used the magnifacation option in the viewer. It is so faint that unless you look with magnification it can't be seen, unless you put the contract and brightness to max.

Also if you have done any reading on OLED screens they are well known to have the problem of screen burn in as part of the normal wear and tear not just for this phone but all phones that use this display type.

I guess that the odd screen that does not get burn in is the expected standard, not the exception. I have looked it up all over and it is a known issue with age as the pixels get used and develop a memory of sorts. It does not affect the function of the phone at all according to the research I have read, most say adjust the contrast and brightness to compensate and go on. Look at most of the listings on ebay now for the same phone, most are not even showing the actual item, thay are using the ebay catalog listing and nothing more than that with a description of used.

The ebay site will not allow me to cancel right now, and no I did not think canceling my account will make this go away, I am not that stupid and quite frankly found that comment offensive. My reasons for wanting to close my account are due to the way I was spoken to by an ebay csr on the phone and a supervisor defending it.

As I see it and from reading a lot of post in this forum a lot of people are upset with ebay favoring buyers who have remorse by forcing a return. I am ebays customer as I pay the fees, not the buyer and I am of the opinion that as the customer I should be treated better. 

As for expecting someone to to spot every flaw, I never thought that, but I also am of the opinion that normal wear and tear is to be expected and need not be listed line by line. If there were scratches, chips, cracks in screen or body yeah but under the theroy that the seller has to list every little detail then nowmal smoothing of the texture of the back cover would be a returnable item, but thats also normal wear and tear.

I will say it again, people expecting pristine products listed as used are not doing themselves any favors by not asking questions to clarify an uncertinty that may exist. caveat emptor if you do not ask questions. You may not agree but oh well.

[emtp117]

Here is the other problem, why should I have to bear all the expense because he did not like what he received? It is functional and not only complete but much more was in the package. If someone buys something mail order and don't like it they have to pay for the return shipping.

[angelgirl327]

---

@emtp117 wrote:

Here is the other problem, why should I have to bear all the expense because he did not like what he received? It is functional and not only complete but much more was in the package. If someone buys something mail order and don't like it they have to pay for the return shipping.

---

He "didn't like it" because there was a flaw and you didn't disclose that.   Doesn't matter about anything else - the item wasn't as described and you have to pay for return shipping (ebay's rules).  And if we buy something mail order and there is something wrong with it, most sites would pay for return shipping.  

[emtp117]

not a flaw, reseach the issue, it is normal wear and tear

[emtp117]

@angelgirl327 @deep-garnet-red @yuzuha @bigchief2472000 @tarpedge

I should have known not to bother expressing my frustration, so far everyone that has responded does not seem to care that there is a thing called normal wear and tear and it is to be expected. There use to be a thing called personal responsibility and as I have been looking at around a 100 other listings for the same item, only 1 mentioned burn in, no other from private sellers or companies mention it, why you ask, because it is normal wear and tear. The problem affects not just this model phone but all phones to some degree as they age

[bigchief2472000]

I'm very much against the way that buyers abuse sellers when it comes to returns, and I do agree that a buyer should have to bear the cost of shipping (both ways) if they want to return something that is as described (if the seller allows returns for buyers remorse).  If a seller accidentally or purposefully omits a defect from their description of the item and the buyer isn't satisfied, shipping is all on the seller.

I saw the dark line across the screen in your picture, but like I said before, it's not obvious from that one picture that it's an actual defect.  The only reason I'm able to spot it is because you mentioned it here, so I was looking for it.  You didn't mention it in your listing, so I'm sure most people wouldn't even notice it.  If they did, they could easily assume that it was just a lighting issue with the photograph since you didn't mention it as a burn in.

Simply stating that something is "used" isn't a clear description and expecting buyers to ask the right questions to find out if it will meet their expectations,  I think you're just asking for trouble with that strategy.

[bigchief2472000]

I deal with picky buyers on a regular basis and have learned that if I don't want to answer a million questions or be footing the bill for something I missed, I better go over anything I sell very closely and point out every little detail.  I'm not a picky buyer, but I know lots of people are, so I make sure even the pickiest person will be satisfied with what they receive, based on my description.

[angelgirl327]

---

@emtp117 wrote:

not a flaw, reseach the issue, it is normal wear and tear

---

It's not up to me or the buyer to "research the issue" - ebay puts it on the seller to disclose every single thing there is.   If you don't, this is what happens.

[mg152]

Always list items like that "as is for parts only". You won't make as much money but you'll have less problems. Return for refund is your only option, many buyers don't bother to return so you might be ok.