eBay

electrola_man · ‎01-14-2021

I recently sold something that I was unable to test, so clearly stated that and listed it with condition "For parts or not working," and stated it was "as-is," in both the condition statement and the description section. The buyer just opened a return request with reason, "doesn't work or defective." What is the best thing to do? It doesn't seem right that a buyer should be able to get a refund when he consciously made the decision to buy under those conditions. Do I have a chance at fighting it, or is it just a lost cause and I should accept the return? Should I write to the guy and try to guilt him into keeping it? I've made purchases that I later regretted, but I took responsibility and sucked it up, because I made the decision to buy under the conditions of the listing. I didn't blame the seller for a disappointing outcome to a chance I was willing to take, and try to get my money back at the seller's expense. That wouldn't be right, and it isn't in this case, as I see it. This is not a case of "not as described" because the declared condition was "for parts or not working."

lunarlullababies · ‎01-14-2021

Call ebay

I dealt with this. Theyll close the case in your favor. I have had it happen twice. They opened up an unfair return against you. Nope. Definitely call CS they'll guide you. I had someone try this a week after getting the item. They had buyers remorse. And item was found to be as described case closed in my favor in minutes

monster-deals · ‎01-14-2021

@electrola_man wrote:
I recently sold something that I was unable to test, so clearly stated that and listed it with condition "For parts or not working," and stated it was "as-is," in both the condition statement and the description section. The buyer just opened a return request with reason, "doesn't work or defective." What is the best thing to do? It doesn't seem right that a buyer should be able to get a refund when he consciously made the decision to buy under those conditions. Do I have a chance at fighting it, or is it just a lost cause and I should accept the return? Should I write to the guy and try to guilt him into keeping it? I've made purchases that I later regretted, but I took responsibility and sucked it up, because I made the decision to buy under the conditions of the listing. I didn't blame the seller for a disappointing outcome to a chance I was willing to take, and try to get my money back at the seller's expense. That wouldn't be right, and it isn't in this case, as I see it. This is not a case of "not as described" because the declared condition was "for parts or not working."

The outcomes of fighting a return include Lose and Lose Big.

electrola_man · ‎01-14-2021

I know I have been successful in the past with this, but I was wondering about right now. From what I hear, it seems the buyers usually win in these situations, even when it seems so ridiculous for someone to buy something declared "for parts or not working" and ask for a return/refund because it doesn't work. Thanks for your comment.

electrola_man · ‎01-14-2021

@monster-deals wrote:
@electrola_man wrote:
I recently sold something that I was unable to test, so clearly stated that and listed it with condition "For parts or not working," and stated it was "as-is," in both the condition statement and the description section. The buyer just opened a return request with reason, "doesn't work or defective." What is the best thing to do? It doesn't seem right that a buyer should be able to get a refund when he consciously made the decision to buy under those conditions. Do I have a chance at fighting it, or is it just a lost cause and I should accept the return? Should I write to the guy and try to guilt him into keeping it? I've made purchases that I later regretted, but I took responsibility and sucked it up, because I made the decision to buy under the conditions of the listing. I didn't blame the seller for a disappointing outcome to a chance I was willing to take, and try to get my money back at the seller's expense. That wouldn't be right, and it isn't in this case, as I see it. This is not a case of "not as described" because the declared condition was "for parts or not working."
The outcomes of fighting a return include Lose and Lose Big.

This is what I have been concerned about. That someone could ask for and expect to get a return/refund on something that was advertised as, "for parts or not working," because he finds it doesn't work, seems outrageous, but I've heard that the buyers typically are sided with. Thanks for your comment.

no_zero369 · ‎01-14-2021

eh, buyers don't read or the scummy ones buy and hope it works and if not try to claim NAD.

You have to make a business decision here, not an emotional one. If you try to fight this the risk is eBay thinks you are recalcitrant and just refunds the buyer and the buyer keeps the stuff. This is Maximum Loss scenario.

Alternatively, one could issue a return label and get the item back and resell it. This would allow one to cut their losses. Took me a while to internalize that selling had the risk of returns. Then I learned that when a return happens I was going to lose money. How much money I lose depended on the actions I took or didn't take.

So no one can tell you exactly what to do, because every seller's situation is different. Just use logic to make a business decision that is right for you. Glad to clarify if anything is murky. Good luck!

mtgraves7984 · ‎01-14-2021

"Do I have a chance at fighting it, or is it just a lost cause and I should accept the return?"

@electrola_man

You're stuck between a hard place and a harder place. Accept the Return, provide the return label and refund the buyer in full when your item comes back to you .

The harder place would be if you let eBay get involved. Then, you may face a full refund with no return. Plus, your Seller Metrics will take a 'ding'. It's always best to handle your business.

For what it's worth, I feel that if an item sells once, it will again. I wish you luck in future sales.

electrola_man · ‎01-14-2021

@mtgraves7984 wrote:
"Do I have a chance at fighting it, or is it just a lost cause and I should accept the return?"

@electrola_man

You're stuck between a hard place and a harder place. Accept the Return, provide the return label and refund the buyer in full when your item comes back to you .

The harder place would be if you let eBay get involved. Then, you may face a full refund with no return. Plus, your Seller Metrics will take a 'ding'. It's always best to handle your business.

For what it's worth, I feel that if an item sells once, it will again. I wish you luck in future sales.

I likely will accept the return, but I plan to point out all of this to the buyer. I have, in the past, sometimes accepted a return, but then after pointing out how outrageous the return request was, I was successful in discouraging the buyer from actually using the label and sending the item back.

electrola_man · ‎01-14-2021

@no_zero369 wrote:
eh, buyers don't read or the scummy ones buy and hope it works and if not try to claim NAD.

You have to make a business decision here, not an emotional one. If you try to fight this the risk is eBay thinks you are recalcitrant and just refunds the buyer and the buyer keeps the stuff. This is Maximum Loss scenario.

Alternatively, one could issue a return label and get the item back and resell it. This would allow one to cut their losses. Took me a while to internalize that selling had the risk of returns. Then I learned that when a return happens I was going to lose money. How much money I lose depended on the actions I took or didn't take.

So no one can tell you exactly what to do, because every seller's situation is different. Just use logic to make a business decision that is right for you. Glad to clarify if anything is murky. Good luck!

Yes, the key here is to make a good business decision vs. an emotional one. It is business, and my standing with Ebay is too important to jeopardize. I likely will accept the return, but I plan to point out clearly but nicely to the buyer that he bought something presented as, "For parts or not working," and that it is pretty ridiculous to then claim it doesn't work and think that is deserving of a return/refund. I have, in the past, accepted a return, but then after pointing out how outrageous the return request was, I was successful in discouraging the buyer from actually using the label and sending the item back, and the case timed out and was closed in my favor. It gives the buyer a second chance to reflect on his/her own responsibility and decide again. It works with some people, anyway.

jkbmjp1 · ‎01-15-2021

A few months ago, I had a similar issue with a buyer. I sold an iPhone 6 and after he received it he sends a message claiming the SIM card slot was defective and files a case against me all at the same time. He didn't show any proof such as pictures to support his claim. He files the case under "doesn't work or defective".

I accepted the return and a week later I send him a prepaid USPS label via messages. He told me once he receives the label he will return the phone. Well, he got the label but never returned it.

Several weeks go by and several messages to him go by and no response from him.

Somehow he was refunded the money and was able to keep the phone without any proof of his claims. Apparently, Ebay went on his word and didn't ask for undisputed proof that the phone was defective as he claimed it was.

electrola_man · ‎01-15-2021

@jkbmjp1 wrote:
A few months ago, I had a similar issue with a buyer. I sold an iPhone 6 and after he received it he sends a message claiming the SIM card slot was defective and files a case against me all at the same time. He didn't show any proof such as pictures to support his claim. He files the case under "doesn't work or defective".

I accepted the return and a week later I send him a prepaid USPS label via messages. He told me once he receives the label he will return the phone. Well, he got the label but never returned it.

Several weeks go by and several messages to him go by and no response from him.

Somehow he was refunded the money and was able to keep the phone without any proof of his claims. Apparently, Ebay went on his word and didn't ask for undisputed proof that the phone was defective as he claimed it was.

Did the the money refunded to the buyer come from your funds, or was it from Ebay as a courtesy refund?

no_zero369 · ‎01-15-2021

@jkbmjp1

Sorry things went this way for you. It sounds like there are few things that perhaps could be clarified? Hope you don't mind me sharing a bit of hard won advice?

When a buyer requests a return the seller is going to lose money. What actions one takes or doesn't take, will determine how much money is lost.

For A while I took returns personally, got mad or argued with buyers. Often I demanded proof of whatever was claimed and usually never got it. Got run over by the MBG a few times as a result. Then I learned....

The toughest thing for me was to internalize that "returns happen" as a normal part of retail selling. So once I got that, I had to learn how to handle returns and what plans to put into place when returns happen.

One of the things I learned is that if a buyer claims a item I sold is not as desribed (NAD): different, broken, damaged, etc., the buyer does not have to supply any proof whatsoever as to what they claim. Period! Yeah, I was mad, isn't that against the law? I mean you gotta prove things like that in court, right? er..... What posters here taught me was that NO! this was faulty thinking. This is eBay and they set the rules and their rules do not require a buyer to prove anything, just make a claim! Yeah, it stinks, but...

Then I had to accept that once a buyer opens a NAD claim I have to refund them. If I want the item back so I can resell it, I need to pay for return shipping. But in the MBG it says that once a buyer opens a NAD case, I as a seller have 3 business days to get a solution worked out or send the buyer a return label. Oh yeah, I fought with a few buyers or was so angry I ignore it for a few days and those 3 days "timed out" and then, per the MBG, the buyer asked eBay to "step in". eBay stepped in and refunded the buyer with my funds! I had no money and no item - this was a Maximum Loss!

So after a few Maximum Loss cases I decide I better make a few changes. So now when a return happens, I issue a return label and get my item back. If they do fraud, I have steps to handle that. But getting my item back & issuing a refund allows me to resell it which reduces my loss to round trip shipping.

Yeah, no one WANTS to lose money. But is is par the course for retail selling. I now set aside 5% from each sale as a contingency fund (self insurance fund) and use that fund to pay for return shipping and other costs associated with returns. Having a plan and funds to execute the plan helped me stay business like, work the plan and avoid upset emotions. Thankfully returns are less than 1% so the costs are manageable.

So hope there is something in my experience that you can use to help with your selling? Best wishes!

electrola_man · ‎01-15-2021

Thanks. I'm pretty much in agreement with everything here. I know the rules, and I don't like them all, but they are what they are, and for me to be successful here, I need to work within those and make decisions that are best for my business. I always accept the return, and pay to get the item back. I never let a buyer keep an item for nothing if I suspect an improper request, even if I expect it to not be worth the cost of return shipping. At that point, it is a loss I'm willing to take. I do try to professionally point out to the buyer that the request was improper, and I block that buyer to eliminate any future similar incidents. Over the years that has probably saved me a couple of refunds when the buyer never did use the label to ship the item back, and I didn't need to refund. I have a No Returns policy (and I know that's a hot button issue and I'm not looking for anyone to tell me that's wrong) because that is what seems best for a business that primarily sells used items. I get very few return requests, and I believe all but one or two in the past 10 years were really remorse returns that were improperly filed as NAD to get around my "no returns" policy and/or to make me pay for return shipping. I just live with the very few of those I get stuck with. It has worked for me. I've learned that there is a small percentage of people in the potential buyer pool for my items that I am better off without dealing with. Unfortunately in most cases I cannot discern that before I'm involved in a transaction with one of them. What really struck me about this particular case is that this buyer got exactly what was presented. A user with 5000+ feedback should know better than to do this.

jkbmjp1 · ‎01-29-2021

For me it isn't about getting the money back or trying to get the refund. I wanted the phone back. I blame Ebay because they were telling me one thing then telling the buyer something else. The buyer is to blame as well.

My selling days on Ebay is over. Ebay killed it for me.