ebay puts Rule Following Sellers (RFS) thru hell

[nympherrant]

Here's my story.  Feel my pain.  A buyer buys a painting from me.  I gave 40% discount, free shipping, shipped early and upgraded shipping.   No returns on my listing.  She gets the item and decides it doesn't match something in her house.   We correspond.  She admits it was her mistake and begs to accept the return.  I say no, because I did nothing to warrant a return.  She opens a return request.  I contact ebay twice to discuss her request.  They advised us to try to work it out, and say the earliest ebay could get involved was 4/9/18. They also reviewed the corresondence while I was on the phone and advised that I was in the right.   I committed to getting them involved on 4/9/18.  Today, 4/7/18, I get an email stating the buyer filed and won a case.  No way ebay reviewed the correspondence as they said they would.  I contacted ebay immediately and spoke with three different people.  I asked them to explain how they could have reviewed the correspondence and draw the conclusion they did.  They could not anwser that.  I reamed them good (like they care), explaining what the put RFS's through.  The lying buyer (who stated the item was different than what was listed) gets to sit back and collect her money, while I have to jump through hoops.  They advised me to appeal once I receive the item back.  Great resolution!  SOMEONE GIVE ME A GOOD OPTION TO SELLING WITH EBAY!!!!  They treat good sellers like criminals.

[keyofbflat]

The RETURNS black hole is so out of control...CHAOS!
Wish I had an answer for you.
Ebay has gotten itself into a pattern of OVER REGULATING independent sellers -
Power to control the private property of others should never have been give to them.
Not expecting that Genie to ever be put back into that bottle

[numisnorway]

The tendency is towards no responsibility for buyers at all. They can just claim whatever they want and get a refund and free return shipping. Don't wanna pay for shipping? Well then they get to keep the item free of charge. Oh and they punish your account if they decide to give away your item for free as well, making your listings be less visible etc.

I'm just thinking about how things used to be. Before buyers had some responsibility, you had to research who you bought from, what you bought, conditions,  if you acted like an asshat you could get negative feedback which again could make it so that other sellers didn't want anything to do with you, but that is all out the window these days.

if ebay goes much further from it's roots in this collapsing economy then the outcome is certain.

[turquoisetulips]

The RETURNS black hole is so out of control...CHAOS!-keyofbflat - op - unquote ---------------------------

There is really no such thing  as a '' no returns'' policy available to sellers . It's puzzling why  e bay adds it to the listing page . Tulips 

[ripcityresell]

---

@turquoisetulips wrote:

The RETURNS black hole is so out of control...CHAOS!-keyofbflat - op - unquote ---------------------------

There is really no such thing  as a '' no returns'' policy available to sellers . It's puzzling why  e bay adds it to the listing page . Tulips 

---

Sure there is. Unfortunately, unscupulous buyers use the MBG loophole to go around it.

I recently had a remorse return that the buyer tried to claim SNAD on and it was just closed in my favor.

[mirror-in-the-attic]

For all I read on these boards, and putting myself in the position of buying something online and the different colors, etc. that it can present (different colors on monitor, etc.). I would have sympathized with the buyer, and allowed the return but asked her to pay for the return shipping since you offered free shipping at time of purchase.    I do understand why you feel as you do, but in the end, if she does not want the painting, if I were the seller, I would not want to force her to keep it.   Again, I get that it is your policy of no returns, but particularly in paintings and such, it can really look different in person. the brush strokes the colors everything and maybe it really did not go with her decor.    I guess I will take some hits for this opinion, but, if she refused to pay for the return shipping, I would have offered halfsies on the return shipping, and if she refused that, I would have just paid to have the item sent back to me, without EBAY intervention.    That is just me.  

[michael_atw]

Just got my newest one today.  Guy buys an item, it is sent as described.. he is mad because it doesn't have double the parts.  They were not included.  I told him as such.  He asks if I have a second one.  I said nope.  He opens a return request and lies in it. 

This is about the 6th time since December someone has done this. 

[michael_atw]

As someone who buys $150k+ a year, I have an ounce of personal responsibility and if I buy something that I end up not wanting,

I keep it.

[bonjourami]

While I do sympathize with you, youve been here nineteen years and dont realize a csr will tell you anything you want to hear to get you off the phone and on to the next complaintaint.

[turquoisetulips]

I recently had a remorse return that the buyer tried to claim SNAD on and it was just closed in my favor. secondchancemedia - unquote 

Well that's good , but from what I've read on these boards e bay generally sides with the buyer . Everyone knows this story by now  but I had sold a holiday theme locket  to a buyer one time . AFTER the holiday[ Thanksgiving ]  was over she claimed the locket was covered in toxic chemicals that got on her hands , in her eyes and all over her clothes  so badly she was only able to wear the locket  for about an hour on Thanksgiving  day . So she demanded a full refund . It was the biggest bunch of B.S  I'd ever heard .Luckily I saved the messages between myself and the buyer  and asked e bay to please step in . It worked in my favor as well  but only because her story was so absurd . Tulips 

[luckythewinner]

---

@nympherrant wrote:

 I contacted ebay immediately and spoke with three different people. I asked them to explain how they could have reviewed the correspondence and draw the conclusion they did.  They could not answer that.  I reamed them good 

---

Here are the unwritten rules on eBay, which most sellers eventually come to understand: 

• Any buyer can return any item to any seller at any time, even if the seller says "no returns". 
• Any buyer can steal any item from any seller at any time, as long as he does not make a mistake while stealing it. 
• Returns and theft are not a problem for all sellers, but they are a problem for some sellers. 
• When eBay stops working for you, it's time to leave. 
• If there were a good alternative, we would all be there. 

[michael_atw]

If there were a good alternative, we would all be there. 

Ebay is an aggregate marketplace.  That means, there are alternatives and people are there.  That is why sites like Amazon have grown far faster than ebay.  ebay's luck will run out.  Ebay reduced fees in the musical instruments category last year because a start-up began to gut them.  They had to compete.  And that site I assume has grown.  I removed myself from ebay for 18 months while rebuilding my account - lost eBay probably $20000 in revenue.  Main reason I came back was the management of that company is worse than ebay's.   However, I was rewarded with lower FVFs and the elimination of their disgusting DSRs and old ratings systems.  So things have been better overall vs a few years ago but worse when the issues come in.  

I appreciate you admitted they are at the least an oligopoly though.  

[castlemagicmemories]

---

@ripcityresell wrote:

---

@turquoisetulips wrote:

The RETURNS black hole is so out of control...CHAOS!-keyofbflat - op - unquote ---------------------------

There is really no such thing  as a '' no returns'' policy available to sellers . It's puzzling why  e bay adds it to the listing page . Tulips 

---

Sure there is. Unfortunately, unscupulous buyers use the MBG loophole to go around it.

I recently had a remorse return that the buyer tried to claim SNAD on and it was just closed in my favor.

---

And that's what the no returns policy is for.  You don't accept buyer's remorse returns.  The MBG overrides in cases of SNAD, not as described, but yes, sadly some do file false SNADS.  

Congrats on the closed remorse return that was decided in your favor!

[behixso_62]

Return Are Still Automatically Thru Ebay Systems. 

---

@nympherrant wrote:

Here's my story.  Feel my pain.  A buyer buys a painting from me.  I gave 40% discount, free shipping, shipped early and upgraded shipping.   No returns on my listing.  She gets the item and decides it doesn't match something in her house.   We correspond.  She admits it was her mistake and begs to accept the return.  I say no, because I did nothing to warrant a return.  She opens a return request.  I contact ebay twice to discuss her request.  They advised us to try to work it out, and say the earliest ebay could get involved was 4/9/18. They also reviewed the corresondence while I was on the phone and advised that I was in the right.   I committed to getting them involved on 4/9/18.  Today, 4/7/18, I get an email stating the buyer filed and won a case.  No way ebay reviewed the correspondence as they said they would.  I contacted ebay immediately and spoke with three different people.  I asked them to explain how they could have reviewed the correspondence and draw the conclusion they did.  They could not anwser that.  I reamed them good (like they care), explaining what the put RFS's through.  The lying buyer (who stated the item was different than what was listed) gets to sit back and collect her money, while I have to jump through hoops.  They advised me to appeal once I receive the item back.  Great resolution!  SOMEONE GIVE ME A GOOD OPTION TO SELLING WITH EBAY!!!!  They treat good sellers like criminals.

---

Live Smart And Watch The Dumb

[tunicaslot]

Amazon has grown - not because of third party sellers but because they own a lot of their own items that are sold there. They also offer prime which people use to the fullest to get free shipping.

But I'm upset with the amt of sellers coming here because Ebay seems to be backtracking when it comes to returns. This past year - I've had great luck in getting remorse returns changed to buyer's remorse - but with the advent of their Free Returns policy they want to push - it seems we are worse off as sellers than we were in previous years as they seem to be no longer looking at each case as a separate entity but assigning one flat rule - buyer is right and seller pays return shipping. If that is the case - I think many sellers will move to the other venues and that's sad as to me - Ebay is home. I dabble in other venues but Ebay has always been my go to as far as selling. There is only so much risk I'm willing to take.