eBay

davebhop · ‎05-10-2018

I recently sold a BRAND NEW $6500 embroidery machine. The customer had the machine for 2-3 days then opened a NOT AS DESCRIBED case. I sent return FedEx label and received the return a week later. when I opened the box there was a very used $1500 embroidery machine inside. I immediately contacted eBay and gave them the serial number of the item I shipped and the serial number of the item that was returned. I sent pictures of the item that was sent and pictures of the item received on the return. I filed a police report. I contacted FedEx and found the return shipment weighed 15 pounds less than the original shipment. I contacted the customer to see if there was a mistake on the item the returned. They told me they did not know what I was talking about.

This is what eBay told me... There was nothing we could or would do. because the customer did not admit to the fraud in the emails. They told me I was on my own and that they would send the full refund! at the end of the case's waiting period.

I then contacted Paypal and was told they only protected buyers and that sellers are on there own. And that I should hire a lawyer and open a civil case against the buyer. MY HEAD ALMOST POPPED OFF!

So sellers, I would just like you to know you are not protected from buyer scams on expensive items... by eBay or Paypal and for you scammers buying expensive items and then returning inexpensive items...IT WORKS. And works very well!

Need to upgrade your equipment? just buy new and send back your old wore out item. Ebay and paypal will help you. Just remember never admit to what you are doing in email! And you will get it for free!

hafoster · ‎08-14-2018

@bauble-babes wrote:
@glehns

Because of the rise in mail fraud, I now open all expensive returns at the post office in front of employees. If Fraud occurs, I have Federal witnesses who can quickly pull up my original listing and see what should be in the package. I can then file the fraud paperwork on the spot.

Fortunately, I've not had an issue yet. [Translation: Have never done it]

How does this package tell your imaginary federal witnesses which listing to pull up?

Official letterhead: Postal customer claims there should have been 3 gold ingots in the package from Kawaka. We don't know. Plus, it was mailed from Nuntuh.

hometownvintagecom · ‎08-14-2018

@sg51 wrote:
A while after that the guy was busted and went to jail.

Fine. He went to jail. No one disputes that these miscreants are out there committing crimes. Criminals usually get taken down eventually.

What did not happen was that he went to jail for faulty returns.

I know that doesn't fit the board narrative, but the board narrative is both false and misleading to would be sellers of expensive items. Would be sellers of expensive items need to know that no one is protecting them from exactly the kind of fraud presented in this thread.

When someone is convicted of a crime, the victims can seek restitution during the sentencing. The restitution must be paid before that criminal can be released from parole.

kcdcpa · ‎08-14-2018

@davebhop wrote:
I recently sold a BRAND NEW $6500 embroidery machine. The customer had the machine for 2-3 days then opened a NOT AS DESCRIBED case. I sent return FedEx label and received the return a week later. when I opened the box there was a very used $1500 embroidery machine inside. I immediately contacted eBay and gave them the serial number of the item I shipped and the serial number of the item that was returned. I sent pictures of the item that was sent and pictures of the item received on the return. I filed a police report. I contacted FedEx and found the return shipment weighed 15 pounds less than the original shipment. I contacted the customer to see if there was a mistake on the item the returned. They told me they did not know what I was talking about.

This is what eBay told me... There was nothing we could or would do. because the customer did not admit to the fraud in the emails. They told me I was on my own and that they would send the full refund! at the end of the case's waiting period.

I then contacted Paypal and was told they only protected buyers and that sellers are on there own. And that I should hire a lawyer and open a civil case against the buyer. MY HEAD ALMOST POPPED OFF!

So sellers, I would just like you to know you are not protected from buyer scams on expensive items... by eBay or Paypal and for you scammers buying expensive items and then returning inexpensive items...IT WORKS. And works very well!

Need to upgrade your equipment? just buy new and send back your old wore out item. Ebay and paypal will help you. Just remember never admit to what you are doing in email! And you will get it for free!

@davebhop

Any update for us on the status of this issue ?

If you have not already done this, I would be checking Craigs List ads in the buyer's vicinity every day to see if the buyer is trying to sell the machine locally for cash.

If you find an ad that looks suspicious, you can e-mail the buyer with a Craigs-List-Decoy-E-Mail address ..... ( i.e. you stay anonymous when you send the e-mail through the Craigs List Message System ) .... and probe the seller with relevant questions about the machine.

Then, if you are positive that the machine is yours, tell the seller that you want to buy the machine, get the seller's address and contact the local police and explain the whole issue to them.

twnpopcards · ‎08-15-2018

@justincomito wrote:
As a Seller we have absolutely no protection or recourse when a buyer opens up a case like this. As a result of being burned yet again on an item listed as "for parts or not working" I will cease selling on ebay once my remaining two items sell. EBAY will do NOTHING to help the seller and EVERYTHING for the buyer, always!

Especially since the buyer is using the new machine to manufacture items for sale on Ebay. So Ebay kept his FVF for the FALSE SNAD, the buyer got to keep the new machine for free and the Seller got the privilege of paying for the buyer to get rid of his broken machine. Sounds like the perfect Trifecta for Ebay as they continue to make money from the Scammer(s), which appears to be a major part of their current business plan. I wonder what % of Ebays revenue is actually attributable to these Fraud Scams where Ebay keeps their unearned FVF, and then continue to make more money on the FVF from the scammer? Anybody think that might turn Ebays stunted 3-6% growth into a negative growth number? I am sure they have that information readily available as they sure are able to pull every other number they want out of thin air. I would not be surprised to see that number reach between 10-15%, but we all know that is another one of those pieces of information that EBay will never share with anybody, even their auditors at Price Waterhouse. I wonder how Price Waterhouse would approach their next audit if they were made aware of this information though and the potential damage to their reputation were it to be made public that they have been ignoring it all these years.

Arthur Anderson paid a steep price for turning their heads the other way when Enron and Worldcom were finally discovered cooking the books and allowing fraud to happen, I wonder if Price Waterhouse is ready to even have to defend their actions as that would cost them a ton of business from other companies that do not want to be affiliated with them. Public companies can no longer afford to be linked with any other companies with unethical business practices as their stock price will dump as fast as the offending companies stock. Ebay is down almost 20% since February while Paypal is up almost 12% during that same time frame, we won't even mention the price differences since Paypal split from Ebay although they both started at $30 a share and Paypal is at $87 while Ebay is at $34.

Wall Street might ignore all the issues that Ebay has but I really doubt that their auditor can afford to once they are made aware of the business practices. Ebay needs to stop helping the Scammers rip off their sellers just so they can keep their jobs and learn how to make the site profitable for both their Sellers and Ebay as that is the absolute best solution to Ebays future.

bauble-babes · ‎08-15-2018

@hafoster

@bauble-babes wrote:
@dotphins

Because of the rise in mail fraud, I now open all expensive returns at the post office in front of employees. If Fraud occurs, I have Federal witnesses who can quickly pull up my original listing and see what should be in the package. I can then file the fraud paperwork on the spot.

Fortunately, I've not had an issue yet. [Translation: Have never done it]

How does this package tell your imaginary federal witnesses which listing to pull up?

Official letterhead: Postal customer claims there should have been 3 gold ingots in the package from Kawaka. We don't know. Plus, it was mailed from Nuntuh.

WOW, how abrasive you are in calling me a liar:

"Fortunately, I've not had an issue yet. [Translation: Have never done it]"

I certainly have done it!!! After reading what happened to the seller who started this thread, I called the USPS Office of the Inspector General to find out how I could protect myself and was advised to open my expensive returns at the post.

Regarding that label you posted, my returns always have the buyer's return address, not Pitney Bows. Should the return ever be fraudulent, my Postmaster and I can access the original listing via my sold page where she may see whats supposed to be in the box. No "imaginary federal witnesses" here!!!

210treasures · ‎08-16-2018

bauble-babes is right on this one. This is because you have an opportunity to get that tracking number on the return label if it shows up in the ebay return case details. If you do get that opportunity, log onto the USPS website and have them intercept it at the post office. Have it held for pick up, and then open it in front of a postmaster or federal postal employee there. If it were me, and depending on the value of the item, I might even put a temporary hold for pick up on all of my mail if I don't see a tracking number uploaded 1 day after hitting the approve return button on ebay. Anyway it needs to be at the post office when it is first opened, you can't just take it out of your mail box and bring it there to open. It would become a your word vs their word thing.

Reply to Imakesugar... The person returning an item must list the reason for return on the ebay case. For example let’s say if they wrote down that a diamond ring does not fit, and they open up a returned package at the post office only to find just a banana peel in it, you show the ebay return case details to the postmaster. In this scenario it would work.

calistas_closet33 · ‎08-16-2018

If ebay cared about the seller, yes of course. With recording of serial number and receiving a different item back, it should not be the decision it is, except ebay is completely and utterly inept, idiotic and short sighted in their decision. Every seller reading this post will definitely not be listing expensive items, except cash pay / pick up..and just to be safe, videotaped and a notary to sign document executed by both buyer and seller that transaction for item was acceptable, as described, period. It is infuriating to read about this situation. Ebay wake up! Don’t you realize you are definitely not the only platform available to sellers? duh

calistas_closet33 · ‎08-16-2018

Really sorry this happened to you.

net-gnat · ‎08-16-2018

Number one rule for eBay selling: NEVER list anything you're not willing to lose or give away.

bauble-babes · ‎08-16-2018

"Because of the rise in mail fraud, I now open all expensive returns at the post office in front of employees. If Fraud occurs, I have Federal witnesses who can quickly pull up my original listing and see what should be in the package. I can then file the fraud paperwork on the spot. Fortunately, I've not had an issue yet."

A big problem with returns is this, if you sold a diamond ring and the return is a piece of paper, how are you going to prove that to ebay if you open the return at home? It's a he says she says situation: buyer says returned diamond ring and seller says received paper. Proof will be the burden of the seller in this situation.

FLIP SIDE: Buyer purchases diamond ring. Seller sends paper. Here, the burden of proof is on the buyer. Ebay doesn't know who is fraudulent unless there's proof.

gripthis2009 · ‎08-26-2018

Another example of PayPal's fraudulent Seller Protection Policy. I spoke recently with authorities in Florida regarding my filed complaint. I'm confident PayPal is about to get hammered. When they're done with them we'll go the civil route. A finding of fact by Florida regarding PayPal violating Florida Statutes will allow us a "summary judgement" in a civil claim, and them it's just a matter of how many dollars PayPal must pay us.

It is a good thing eBay is getting rid of PayPal. Although the new system may be the same. However, it won't matter to us as we are going to focus on more productive websites like Amazon which kills eBay regarding sales. We plan on being off eBay at the end of this month. As much as I can't stand Bezos they do go after fraudulent buyers, and buyers that have a high return rate.

As I stated earlier. Stay away from PayPal, and get a merchant account. You will see many declines in doing so but that decline is a fraudulent transaction about to occur. In addition, the merchant account processor will back you on your conditions of sale, warranty, and return policy, unlike PayPal.