Very Very Bad - Sellers is not protected.

[young-1129]

I am going to write short so everyone can read without killing time.

1. Sold Brand New Billionaire Boys Club Jacket $504 (w Shipping) Brand New with tag in garment bag.

2. Buyer open received wrong item 3 WEEKS AFTER item delivered.

3. Spoke to eBay bunch of times before buyer open up return.

4. eBay gave buyer 3 WEEKS to send back.

5. Return came last day of return will be closing if did not send back.

6. Some used cheap Steelers jacket cam back to me.

7. Gave full refund to buyer.

8. Told me to prove that I did not send what he claimed that I sent.

9. Sent prove but said I took longer than what I have so no seller protection for me. Gave me less than a week.

10. Lost Jacket Lost money.

11. I am not a liar and still have lot of items listed. Honest seller.

 NO SELLER PROTECTION

[anjofak]

Should probably file a report with the (postal inspectors) since it is a mail fraud and theft by those that took part in doing you wrong..

[stephenmorgan]

File a Mail Fraud Report with USPS.

If it is a one time situation likely nothing will happen.

If it is a continuing situation with the buyer ripping off people then something may happen.

I have filed three Mail Fraud Reports.  One caused a person to go to jail for a few years.  It did not happen because I alone made a report.  It happened because it was a continuing behavior and many people reported the person.  I did not get my money back, it was gone.

[this*old*attic]

@machofalltrades 

It’s not negatives you have to worry about.

It’s the demerits and drop in seller performance (lower search position and higher FVF) you’d need to worry about.

Doesn’t matter if they’re your items - it’s EBay’s site.

And didn’t YOU start at zero?

[dbfolks166mt]

10. Lost Jacket Lost money.

Sorry this happened but it's a sellers life on eBay. With regard to the loss what you actually lost was how ever much you paid or had invested in the jacket + shipping cost + Fees. You didn't actually loose both the jacket and the money. While not a big help it is a tax write off. 

[katzrul15]

---

@young-1129 wrote:

I am going to write short so everyone can read without killing time.

1. Sold Brand New Billionaire Boys Club Jacket $504 (w Shipping) Brand New with tag in garment bag.

2. Buyer open received wrong item 3 WEEKS AFTER item delivered.

3. Spoke to eBay bunch of times before buyer open up return.

4. eBay gave buyer 3 WEEKS to send back.

5. Return came last day of return will be closing if did not send back.

6. Some used cheap Steelers jacket cam back to me.

7. Gave full refund to buyer.

8. Told me to prove that I did not send what he claimed that I sent.

9. Sent prove but said I took longer than what I have so no seller protection for me. Gave me less than a week.

10. Lost Jacket Lost money.

11. I am not a liar and still have lot of items listed. Honest seller.

 NO SELLER PROTECTION

---

@young-1129 

Confused about #9.    Why would it take you more than a week to prove what you sold to the Buyer?  Can you share a little more on this one area. 

Thinking if this part of the claim was not resolved, your appeal will be a moot point.  What exactly did you send them and why did it take so long to do so?  

[dbfolks166mt]

     I too found that part of the statement to be a bit odd since OP claims they provided a full refund to the buyer. Something is missing out of this chain of events. 

[rosachs]

---

@stephenmorgan wrote:

File a Mail Fraud Report with USPS.

If it is a one time situation likely nothing will happen.

If it is a continuing situation with the buyer ripping off people then something may happen.

I have filed three Mail Fraud Reports.  One caused a person to go to jail for a few years.  It did not happen because I alone made a report.  It happened because it was a continuing behavior and many people reported the person.  I did not get my money back, it was gone.

---

Exactly -- problems reported can be tracked, accumulated, and patterns noted.  It's only when reports start flowing in about one buyer, one address over and over and over again that these things can be 'officially' looked in to.  Be sure to include any identifying marks - if the product is still in the scammer's possession, being able to clearly identify it strengthens the overall case greatly.  You'd be surprised how many scammers get caught because they just didn't want to part with 'a few things'.... and those things matched up with reports and only strengthened the case(s) against the scammer.

If it's not reported, it didn't happen and no body will or would look into it at all.

When the reports start to pile up and a pattern emerges, now there is something definite to be looked into - and it's very hard for a scammer to get law enforcement to believe "those people are all just out to get me!".  🙂

-Bob.

[rosachs]

---

@dbfolks166mt wrote:

     I too found that part of the statement to be a bit odd since OP claims they provided a full refund to the buyer. Something is missing out of this chain of events. 

---

Refunding payment before reporting buyer weakens your claim on eBay.  It allows eBay to say that you 'voluntarily' refunded the buyer, therefor it's no longer eBay's mess to clear up.  And yes, response times for buyers are significantly longer than for sellers.  Buyers get weeks to send something back (and they only have to postmark by the date, not actually deliver) and then the seller gets 2-3 days to refund or get dinged.  Personally, I think eBay's threat of a defect, and the impact it has on your account, overrides the "voluntary" nature of any refund given....

Some of this is done to ensure eBay sellers stay on the right side of Federal regulations, which state that the buyer is always right.  That's why sellers buy shipping insurance - if the item is damaged/lost in transit, the Feds require the seller to make the buyer whole.  Buying insurance can take a lot of the sting out of that.

-Bob.

[mandisattictoyz]

I just do t understand what is so hard to do it within 48 hours.  Why wait less than a week when 24-48 hours should suffice. This is the standard across all selling platforms so no sympathy from anyone

[erkosuniverse]

Perfect answer rugerskick,

This has got to stop happening to sellers,there is more situations like this posted in the last few days here in the selling forum,and you would be surprised at how many responses feel it is okay for the seller to lose their payment and money,they just shrug it off as "well,thats how it goes"

This is why there is so much of it happening not enough sellers are standing up for their rights

As you state go through law enforcement channels; yes definitely

I contacted the better business bureau and department of consumer affairs and and two local magistrates about these types of matters and they all agree it is not legal or justifiable

A seller cannot just lose their item and payment all at the same time by a faulty return/refund/inad policy or whatever

In short will WAL-MART tell a buyer "KEEP YOUR MERCHANDISE AND HERE IS YOUR MONEY BACK"

No that is not going to happen

The sellers must be returned either their item or money,seller cannot lose both under law

By legal law explained marketplace in extreme case should refund seller their money and deal with the buyer,since there are three parties involved (e-bay/buyer/seller)

Seller cannot under law lose (both) merchandise and payment combined,no judge/no court will agree

The way these return policies are handled/set up are not recognized officially in a court law

Thank you for offering positive awareness and goodness in these matters of scammers and e-bay creating much grief and fraud to sellers here

I wish you and all sellers reading this much better in the future and i hope someday these problems will be handled better by this marketplace,but i do not see that happening,unfortunately

[erkosuniverse]

1.ebay can see sellers item in listing (even after sold you can click on "see original listing")

2.buyer can send pic of item received to seller in message box (however this buyer was deceitful)

3. seller can create a temporary listing with item received from buyer so ebay can see what was sent back

This is how the proof comparison can be enforced

unfortunately ebay will not use these measure at their fingertips for a proper resolution and expose the scammer and restore faith to the seller

think about it,have you ever sent extra pictures of your item directly to a buyer that requested this? Maybe not but many have,I know so,I have asked sellers to send me additional pictures of item and have received in my message box

There is no reason for this to happen it can be verified

[this*old*attic]

@erkosuniverse 

Let me laugh

Most of those can be faked

Original listing? LOL. I think I’ll list a mink coat but send a moth eaten army blanket.

And it happens at every step.

Buyer can lie about what they received.

Seller has a second chance to lie about what they get back.

This is at the heart of EBay’s buyer centric policies. There’s no PROOF of anything. 

And buyers are more important than sellers. We can business expense out any losses, buyers just leave and bad mouth to their friends.

[erkosuniverse]

Your thoughts and views are the number one contributing factor to the downfall of sellers here

Look in the mirror and repeat your post to yourself

Nothing more said

[partygal7712]

I have been played that way as well and the buyer was protected. I had sold an item from comic com and he said I sent him something off a Target shelf then sent me the cheap version and kept the expensive one. It's not fair. I have also been cheated by a seller who sent an empty box and because they proved they sent something I lost that case too! It sucks but unfortunately I think it's the risk of doing business online!

[vannvo_0]

The buyer all they need to do is send back an empty envelope, and you have to refund.
So why send back a junk jacket?

So what I am wondering about, is just how much "conversation" went on between when the buyer first asked you to return the jacket, and the actual refund?  Did you try and talk the buyer out of it, did you argue with the buyer?  Did you tell the buyer how great a product this jacket was?  Any of that or more, if you did anything except tell the buyer to "please, return for a full refund", accept the return and issue the refund...

If a seller does not 100% comply with a buyer's request for a return / refund, this thread is usually what comes out as the end result.

From a buyer's perspective, we call this an uncooperative seller.

If that buyer felt you were being uncooperative, that is most likely why you were sent back a junk jacket.

Because I can tell you it has been many years since I have experienced this sort of maliciousness.

There is nothing you can do, for $500, the buyer likely lives all sorts of hundreds or even thousands of miles away... So ... It is always in our best interest to fully cooperate with all buyer requests, no matter how ridiculous.

Just my .02