eBay

cellit · ‎03-26-2019

3/15 - 0 feedback buyer claimed on paypal dispute that I sent him empty box with 800$ item missing.

3/15 - I reply to dispute ( neither side can really prove the box was empty) stating the buyer is fraudulent and the package was delivered and signed for.

3/15 - buyer raises claim to paypal support.

3/21 - buyer is refunded in full (809$) , paypal emails me saying he submitted sufficient evidence to prove he received nothing (uhhh how do you prove that? that's another story though) and 809$ is taken from my account.

3/23 - I call up paypal, me and the rep file an appeal stating "if the box was empty why did the global shipping program reship a box full of air to another country".

3/24 - claim is denied no reason given.

3/25 - I call up paypal reps again, and the rep puts in request for me to get a courtesy credit

3/26 - paypal refunds me out of pocket (even though they believe I'm wrong)

sellers - this is the scenario that might play out if you are also scammed.

"$809.95 USD;PayPal Posting Date:Mar 26, 2019;Payment from paypal;As a one-time goodwill gesture, we have issued a credit to your account. Thank you for using PayPal."

- one time huh, there goes my safety net for the next fraudulent buyer

southern*sweet*tea · ‎03-26-2019

@sharingtheland wrote:
@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?
Your argument would have legs if this wasn't a GSP transaction.

Yep.

If a box arrives at the GSP and it is EMPTY, it's not going to be sent on to the buyer. It's going to be REJECTED.

There are only two scenarios here:

Either the GSP themselves sent on an empty package (accidentally or someone had sticky fingers)

OR

The buyer is lying.

The easier you are to offend the easier you are to control.

We seem to be getting closer and closer to a situation where nobody is responsible for what they did but we are all responsible for what somebody else did. - Thomas Sowell

southern*sweet*tea · ‎03-26-2019

@southern*sweet*tea wrote:
@sharingtheland wrote:
@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?
Your argument would have legs if this wasn't a GSP transaction.
Yep.

If a box arrives at the GSP and it is EMPTY, it's not going to be sent on to the buyer. It's going to be REJECTED.

There are only two scenarios here:
Either the GSP themselves sent on an empty package (accidentally or someone had sticky fingers)
OR
The buyer is lying.

Actually, three scenarios, number three being theft in transit after the package left GSP. GSP should still handle that, since the seller is only required to get the item to the GSP.

The easier you are to offend the easier you are to control.

We seem to be getting closer and closer to a situation where nobody is responsible for what they did but we are all responsible for what somebody else did. - Thomas Sowell

mstcwrld7 · ‎03-26-2019

One post in this thread is refreshing in its rarity -- the concept that if PP did not treat you, the seller, fairly, you could withdraw your business and they'd lose a lot more money.
I never seem to hear this attitude attributed to ebay.

pauls-parts · ‎03-26-2019

@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?

I wish there was a way to give you a thumbs down on this. I would give you 10.

FedEx measures, weighs and records all packages that they ship. I know that if they wanted to check that the weight of the box would have been more than the weight of an empty box.

It is very smart to voice or print your experience (your so called jury trial.) on these boards. It is how a lot of us learn. Especially who the bad buyers are.

Sellers do not always state that buyers are lying.

They are simply bringing their experience on these boards to share with others.

You are very wrong in your assumptions.

kim_y_buran · ‎03-26-2019

Congrats on getting your money back.

castlemagicmemories · ‎03-26-2019

@mynewfindstore wrote:
Is there a way to block the "0" feedback buyer? Or can you cancel the order if you see a 0 feedback buyer bought an expensive item? It's been a long time since I looked at the account settings!

We are getting ready to list some expensive items so I was concerned!

I'm sorry but there is no way to block a zero feedback buyer. No, you cannot cancel the order if you see a zero feedback buyer bought an expensive item.

castlemagicmemories · ‎03-26-2019

@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?

I can only relate an experience I had relative to your question. I bought a very expensive, extremely limited edition piece that had undisclosed damage that was hard to discern in pictures if you did not know it was there. It came with even more damage as it was packed improperly. I filed a not as described, received a label and returned it, and the seller claimed it was not his item, when it absolutely was. This item was such a limited edition piece, the odds that someone would even have another to substitute were in the realm of practically impossible, yet the seller claimed this.

gramophone-georg · ‎03-26-2019

@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?

This was a GSP sale and GSP would not forward an empty box. This is what makes this case different.

EDIT: I can see I was late to this party.

Chaos is NOT an "industry standard".

mam98031 · ‎03-26-2019

They wouldn't have refunded you if they thought you were wrong. What they tell you and what the truth may be are not always the same. Actions, the actions matter. I'm glad you got your refund.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

myjunqueyourtreasure · ‎03-27-2019

Even though the OP was made whole, it's still very disturbing that the GSP does not in fact "protect sellers" when a claim is filed through PP.

Doesn't exactly make me feel all warm & fuzzy and rushing to change my listings to GSP for international shipments.

Reality is the leading cause of stress.

myangelandmyprincess · ‎03-27-2019

@8uiboti_0 wrote:
So a buyer claims to have received an empty box...

What if ...
The seller packed the item, sealed the box, then accidentally grabbed the empty box right beside it...
We're talking an iphone, it's not terribly heavy, wouldn't be that hard...
And slip the label on and ship it off...
What if the seller did in fact ship an empty box?

Further...
Sellers always state the buyer is lying...
But what if a seller lies?
How do we really know who is telling the truth?
How would Paypal or ebay be able to make that distinction?

And is it really so smart to play jury trials on this discussion board?

The difference here is this was a gsp item. Trinton even said the gsp would not have forwarded an empty box and since it was forwarded it must have been there when forwarded which then makes gsp responsbile but gsp wasn't held responsible

“Birth certificates show that you were born. Death certificates show that you died. Photographs show that you have lived.” -Unknown

hioctane62 · ‎03-27-2019

There are only two scenarios here:
Either the GSP themselves sent on an empty package (accidentally or someone had sticky fingers)
OR
The buyer is lying.

A buyer lying to scam a free iPhone? Never heard of that one before.

You have to wonder about some posters who try to put it on the seller every time. Both ebay and Paypal become more corrupt by the day. (As do most publicly traded corps.)

southern*sweet*tea · ‎03-27-2019

@hioctane62 wrote:
There are only two scenarios here:
Either the GSP themselves sent on an empty package (accidentally or someone had sticky fingers)
OR
The buyer is lying.

A buyer lying to scam a free iPhone? Never heard of that one before.

You have to wonder about some posters who try to put it on the seller every time. Both ebay and Paypal become more corrupt by the day. (As do most publicly traded corps.)

Not really, because there are a metric boatload of bad sellers here, just like there are a metric boatload of bad buyers. The bad sellers are the ones that attract AND KEEP the bad buyers for the rest of us to deal with, but that's another story for another day.

I agree 100% about publicly traded corporations...don't even get me started on the scam that is the stock market lol

The easier you are to offend the easier you are to control.

We seem to be getting closer and closer to a situation where nobody is responsible for what they did but we are all responsible for what somebody else did. - Thomas Sowell

hioctane62 · ‎03-27-2019

Some of them I believe are not sellers at all.

gracieallen01 · ‎03-27-2019

Glad it worked out for you!

(as a one-time 'good-will gesture', yeah, right. no company, in it for the money, does it as a 'gesture of any kind', if they are in the right. )

Not saying 'NO' doesn't mean 'YES'.

The foolishness of one's actions or words is determined by the number of witnesses.

Perhaps if Brains were described as an APP, many people would use them more often.

Respect, like money, is only of 'worth' when it is earned - with all due respect, it can not be ordained, legislated or coerced. Anonymous