New drop shipping rules

[richard1rst]

Sellers who drop ship through a RETAILER will find their listings dropped down in search results. (But not if you drop ship through a WHOLESALER).

So I am guessing that sellers who drop ship through Amazon will be amongst those lowered?

[pburn]

The other day, I ordered an item from an Amazon marketplace seller. It arrived from Sam's Club. So I guess there's a lot of it going around, and no site is (probably) immune.

[equid0x]

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@upgradedendmills wrote:

As a seller, I guess this could be considered a good thing.  But, if a seller can source items I want or need through a different venue and still make a profit by selling them to me and it saves me money or time searching myself, more power to them!  I feel that is a seller has a subscription to Prime or some other service that it is a cyber inventory for them and they have every right to sell any portion of that inventory for whatever markup they can get.

     In the last year or so two or three times I have sold an item that was either misplaced or out of stock due to a mistake on my part while listing where I put in a multiple quantity and only had one in stock that had already been sold. When I discovered my mistake I contacted my buyer, explained the problem, and with their approval, purchase a like item from another seller and had it shipped directly to my buyer as a replacement. This eliminated any lag time in getting my customer the time sensitive item they needed, generated extra revenue for eBay, and got me off the hook in a fashion. Doing it this way normally ends up costing me a few bucks, but keeps a happy buyer and saves them and me the trouble of refunding or a delay in shipping.  I don't know if this would be considered "drop shipping" by eBay and don't really care. I would like to retain the option to do it.

     Late in the evening of the Saturday the day before Easter I purchased a product on eBay. It was delivered in a "Prime" box to my porch on Easter Sunday at around 3 P.M.  Absolutely amazing!!!!! I don't know or care if this would be considered "drop shipping".  eBay got their final vale fees, I got my item faster than I could imagine, and hopefully the seller made a profit. I was so impressed with this that I immediately put in another order for more. Same results on the 2nd order. Win, Win, Win...………………………!!!

     I would hope eBay would encourage this type of sale instead of lowering a seller in the search results. Any thing less than that is restraint of trade as far as I am concerned. The seller I purchased from provided a product I wanted at a decent price and superior service. They have invested their own time and money in making that possible and there is no legitimate reason to put roadblocks up for them. Please feel free to tell me why I should feel differently about this.

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I've made this mistake before. I picked up the item from a local store and even got them to price match a much lower online price from another major retailer. I lost very little money on this transaction, but I gained good favor with the customer and didn't cause any problems from the eBay side. Obviously, you don't want to be doing this all the time. 

When I had a B&M, we regularly had competitors coming in when they needed to fill an order in a pinch, or when they had too much work coming in. Also, on occasion we had them bring something in for repair when their own techs had really screwed it up and couldn't figure out how to fix it(!). We would sell them stock for 10% over our cost when they were in a pinch and they would return the favor when we were in need. 

[equid0x]

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@mam98031 wrote:

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@richard1rst wrote:

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@mam98031 wrote:

These are NOT new drop shipping rules.  They are the same ones we have had to deal with for years.  Ebay is just now stepping up their game to try and enforce the rules on this.

Fair enough. The rules have existed, the NEW part keys in on their statement that they are going to start enforcing it.

But, also fair enough, how are they going to know which is which (unless someone complains)?

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That isn't what they said.  They said they are going to start to lower them in the search returns for sellers that are deemed to be breaching this rule.  

You are assuming this is their first attempt to get these sellers in line.

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I'm not sure what the issue really is, though? Buyer makes an order. Seller filled it within the constraints of eBay policy. I just don't see what the problem actually is here? They're not doing anything illegal. They are making far less profit on their sales, though. 

Even when I had a B&M, we had called-in orders to ship elsewhere and we also were selling online(and this was a LONG time ago like 2003) and we would drop ship the item directly from the distributor with our name on it. It resulted in a better experience for the customer all around. Less shipments, cheaper shipping costs, faster lead times and shipping times, and less returns for shipping damage. Whats more, it was all automated and we had to do very little work to keep it going. We could also sell customers in the store items that we didn't have in stock and just have it shipped to their house. 

[equid0x]

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@mam98031 wrote:

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@upgradedendmills wrote:

As a seller, I guess this could be considered a good thing.  But, if a seller can source items I want or need through a different venue and still make a profit by selling them to me and it saves me money or time searching myself, more power to them!  I feel that is a seller has a subscription to Prime or some other service that it is a cyber inventory for them and they have every right to sell any portion of that inventory for whatever markup they can get.

     In the last year or so two or three times I have sold an item that was either misplaced or out of stock due to a mistake on my part while listing where I put in a multiple quantity and only had one in stock that had already been sold. When I discovered my mistake I contacted my buyer, explained the problem, and with their approval, purchase a like item from another seller and had it shipped directly to my buyer as a replacement. This eliminated any lag time in getting my customer the time sensitive item they needed, generated extra revenue for eBay, and got me off the hook in a fashion. Doing it this way normally ends up costing me a few bucks, but keeps a happy buyer and saves them and me the trouble of refunding or a delay in shipping.  I don't know if this would be considered "drop shipping" by eBay and don't really care. I would like to retain the option to do it.

     Late in the evening of the Saturday the day before Easter I purchased a product on eBay. It was delivered in a "Prime" box to my porch on Easter Sunday at around 3 P.M.  Absolutely amazing!!!!! I don't know or care if this would be considered "drop shipping".  eBay got their final vale fees, I got my item faster than I could imagine, and hopefully the seller made a profit. I was so impressed with this that I immediately put in another order for more. Same results on the 2nd order. Win, Win, Win...………………………!!!

     I would hope eBay would encourage this type of sale instead of lowering a seller in the search results. Any thing less than that is restraint of trade as far as I am concerned. The seller I purchased from provided a product I wanted at a decent price and superior service. They have invested their own time and money in making that possible and there is no legitimate reason to put roadblocks up for them. Please feel free to tell me why I should feel differently about this.

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I am a drop shipper of some of the items I sell.  I do it within the rules of Ebay.

For sellers that are breaching the rules of drop shipping, it poses a clear and significant problem as to buyer confidence in the Ebay.  By not doing this in the right way, there are increased chances of disappointing and/or upsetting buyers.  It happens far too often.  When you aren't doing it the right way things can be more frequently out of stock, damaged, delayed in shipping etc.  All things that buyers do not like.  

And that is an excellent reason to start to step hard on these practices.  It erodes buyer confidence in the site.  So this policy change should help us all.  Both buyers and sellers.

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As a seller on multiple venues, I can say that it is a royal PITA to keep stock levels synced between those venues without automation. 

Sometimes I unequally split stock between venues so the numbers are not always equal. 

I'm not saying this is they buyer's problem but it is something a seller has to deal with. It sounds easy but once you are selling many items a day, it gets to be very confusing, especially when there are multiple similar but distinct items being sold. 

[equid0x]

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@sapphireseal wrote:

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@luckythewinner wrote:

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@upgradedendmills wrote:

 if a seller can source items I want or need through a different venue and still make a profit by selling them to me and it saves me money or time searching myself, more power to them! 

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The only thing that matters to eBay is how many buyers voice their displeasure to eBay when they find out they are overpaying. Unhappy buyers will leave the site.

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Yeah, it's a quick way to drive buyers to Amazon.   If the buyer figures it out, they will be ticked off and next time will go to Amazon themselves.  If the buyer DOESN'T figure out the seller was dropshipping . . . there's still a big chance they will see the item for cheaper on Amazon later and think, "Oh!  Next time I'll look there first, it's 15% cheaper!"

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I've bought things myself here that got delivered to me from Amazon. It did give me pause at first, but I got the item I wanted, when I was supposed to get it, at a price I agreed to. I don't really have any complaints. 

That said, the next time I need the same thing, I'll probably go to Amazon to buy it since I know its cheaper there.

There are a lot of sellers on the board here demonizing these people, but I don't really see that they're doing anything wrong. To me, its just another form of competition with a competing business model. eBay policy aside, there's nothing stopping anyone here from using the same ideas to expand their own businesses. 

I just don't think this is going away and frankly, that's probably why eBay hasn't really done anything about it. I don't want to say "the writing is on the wall" that's probably taking it too far but the fact of the matter is this is really a competing business model and we're going to have to adjust our businesses to deal with it. 

Even if we somehow manage to clear them all out of eBay, they'll just be doing the same thing elsewhere or on their own sites. Sometimes the enemy you know is better than the enemy you don't. 

I might suggest eBay collect as much data about these sellers as possible and then devise business strategies to compete with them which probably includes reducing, not increasing, seller sales costs so that they are able to offer more competitive price points. 

eBay's fee structure has priced out most items over say $300 or so. I know there are sellers who sell here over that amount but IMHO there is much better money to be made elsewhere for those type of items. 

[equid0x]

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@upgradedendmills wrote:

Call me stupid, crazy, or old fashioned if needed, but...………  The item I recently purchased and was referring to is fairly hard to find and I had purchased it from this eBay seller in the past. They were out of stock for my reorder, but went to the trouble to restock from their source and fill my order. My total was around $50 for this and a 15% savings would have meant going to a different site and dealing with a new system and seller for $7.50.  I am very pleased with the seller, price, and service. I have an Amazon account, but wouldn't consider going there for this item if I need to reorder. Price does not reflect the total picture.  There are two grocery chains near me. One is Wally world where I get a 10% discount and the other is a local chain.  The quality and service at the local chain are heads above Walmart and I shop there most of the time knowing it will cost me a few bucks.

     As long as I sell on eBay, I will do my buying here also, as much as is possible.

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I agree with this. Cost is not everything. I grocery shop at a market that does not use self checkouts and has employees that are actually sociable and knowledgeable about the store and its products. When I have had a problem, which is only once, they promptly and courteously addressed the situation. The cost is slightly higher but I think the level of service and cleanliness of the store is much higher then elsewhere in my area and I am willing to pay more for that. 

[yuzuha]

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@equid0x wrote:

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There are a lot of sellers on the board here demonizing these people, but I don't really see that they're doing anything wrong. To me, its just another form of competition with a competing business model. eBay policy aside, there's nothing stopping anyone here from using the same ideas to expand their own businesses. 

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The main problem is that the sellers who do this have literally no control over their inventory because they don't HAVE any inventory.  They're banking on the other site having the item they've listed in stock when they need to buy one, but what happens if the other site sells out?  What happens if they can't find it on any other site, or the site that does have it in stock has it for a higher price than the site they were originally going to use, meaning they'll end up losing money on the sale?  It's a recipe for cancelled sales and unhappy buyers.

A traditional dropshipper has a working relationship with their supplier, and said supplier keeps them up to date on inventory levels, prices, etc.  There should be no unexpected surprises regarding inventory or prices in traditional dropshipping, or if there are, they should be very, very rare.

I have no problems with traditional dropshippers.  I DO have problems with dropshippers who are basically playing Russian Roulette with their sales.

[equid0x]

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@yuzuha wrote:

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@equid0x wrote:

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There are a lot of sellers on the board here demonizing these people, but I don't really see that they're doing anything wrong. To me, its just another form of competition with a competing business model. eBay policy aside, there's nothing stopping anyone here from using the same ideas to expand their own businesses. 

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The main problem is that the sellers who do this have literally no control over their inventory because they don't HAVE any inventory.  They're banking on the other site having the item they've listed in stock when they need to buy one, but what happens if the other site sells out?  What happens if they can't find it on any other site, or the site that does have it in stock has it for a higher price than the site they were originally going to use, meaning they'll end up losing money on the sale?  It's a recipe for cancelled sales and unhappy buyers.

A traditional dropshipper has a working relationship with their supplier, and said supplier keeps them up to date on inventory levels, prices, etc.  There should be no unexpected surprises regarding inventory or prices in traditional dropshipping, or if there are, they should be very, very rare.

I have no problems with traditional dropshippers.  I DO have problems with dropshippers who are basically playing Russian Roulette with their sales.

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I'm still kinda on the fence with this. I see what you're saying but the reality of the world is that all shops run out of products some times. 

The person may be running their business poorly, but there is not necessarily anything that can legally done about that. Ultimately, the customer has to make the decision whether or not to purchase from a particular vendor again or at all in the first place. 

There are definitely B&Ms around town that I do not patronize because I don't feel that my purchase was adequately handled, or that just look like a dump, or that have a bad reputation, yet they are still in business and clearly, some people are happy enough to buy from them. The market decides how the public perceives and deals with these places. 

In most of the cases I have read about here there aren't actually any complaints with the product or its seller other than that they got a package with an Amazon logo on it. 

[upgradedendmills]

I will be reordering the item I purchased from an eBay drop shipper in the next couple of weeks and will not go to Amazon to save a few bucks.  I think they have actually purchased their inventory from Amazon and are stocking it for me, but it really doesn't make any difference. Great price, super service, I am a happy buyer. All above board and eBay collected their fees, what's the problem.

[Anonymous]

I  Just purchased and Ironing board Cover for 8.00 free Shipping ON Ebay, It Arrived By UPS 1 day air  By Amazon.

 Not sure how they do it, I do not like shopping on Amazon, No Wonder I cant get very many sales, I do not drop ship from Amazon,

[upgradedendmills]

I think that eBay has a lot more pressing problems than where any individual seller sources their inventory. In this case, they should move my seller up in the search engines because of the outstanding transaction and experience I had with them.  Could the root problem be that someone bought something at Amazon and made money with it? If bad experience with drop shipping for buyer's is a concern,  they should look into some of larger booksellers they have that do not physically carry an inventory and 3 out of 5 times will message after you purchase a specific book and want to make a substitution because it is "out of stock". As long as a seller is providing the product they listed in a timely manner, leave them alone!!!! As sellers, we all pay fees to have our items listed on eBay and they should provide that service alone and stop jerking around with free trade.  

[myboardid]

Every seller who lists any medium to larger quantity of items that are not vintage or OOAK makes a mistake eventually and sells something they don't have.  I see no issue with buying the item somewhere else and having it sent directly to your buyer. (Price is irrelevant)  I've never used Amazon for this problem because they don't sell what I sell, but I have bought items from my competitors for this reason. 

At this point it will now take longer to get that item to my buyer since I will have it sent to me, then I will ship to the buyer. It will cost me double shipping money.  Lose, lose for both the buyer and myself.  Not a good move on eBay's part, serves no valid purpose. 

[mam98031]

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@myboardid wrote:

Every seller who lists any medium to larger quantity of items that are not vintage or OOAK makes a mistake eventually and sells something they don't have.  I see no issue with buying the item somewhere else and having it sent directly to your buyer. (Price is irrelevant)  I've never used Amazon for this problem because they don't sell what I sell, but I have bought items from my competitors for this reason. 

At this point it will now take longer to get that item to my buyer since I will have it sent to me, then I will ship to the buyer. It will cost me double shipping money.  Lose, lose for both the buyer and myself.  Not a good move on eBay's part, serves no valid purpose. 

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You may not see a problem, but it is against the Ebay drop shipping rule.

[robot-hands]

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@mam98031 wrote:

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So this policy change should help us all.  Both buyers and sellers.

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Should.

...but when has any policy chance actually done sellers any good?

When was the last time that happened?

Last one I can think of is the 20% re-stocking fee...couple years ago.

ebay isn't in the habit of making things better.

Can't wait until they tell us a bot makes those decisions and you would never know that you got mistakenly tagged.

[18704d]

"The main problem is that the sellers who do this have literally no control over their inventory because they don't HAVE any inventory.

...

A traditional dropshipper has a working relationship with their supplier, and said supplier keeps them up to date on inventory levels, prices, etc. There should be no unexpected surprises"

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Exactly!

And not all eBay dropshippers are using retail stores.

About 4 months ago, another eBay seller tried to force Me to drop ship to their customer.   And to do so, I'd have to step outside of Item Not Received protections.

On my selling account, I listed some new electrical parts.

I made the sale, got paid, about $100.00 to an eBayer in Indiana.

They immediately messaged me and told me to 'blind ship' this item to their customer in a different State.  They made it clear I was Not to put any packing slip in the package showing that I was an eBayer.

I looked at their eBay account.  It pointed to their Indiana brick and mortar.  That Indiana store was called "(Something) Electrical Fulfillment Center.

On the bottom of their store website was a link on how to sign on with them as a fulfillment supplier.

I had Not signed up with them.

I messaged them that I was forced by Paypal terms to ship to the address on the PP payment (their Indiana address).

They messaged me back with confusion.

What?  All their other eBay sellers had done this. 

Was this a new Paypal requirement?

I decided not to inform them about proper Item Not Received terms,

fearing it (may) tempt them into filing false INR's on their prior sellers  ... which could give them tons of 'free' purchases ... by harming eBay sellers who, like myself, sold to them.

I told them I was shipping to them, in Indiana.

They said to hurry because contractors elsewhere were waiting for these parts.

I had the order in the mail within two hours, two days later tracking showed it received, and I've never heard from them again.

Lynn