eBay

oo8sunding · ‎08-26-2018

I sold my USED camera, that was working at the time of sale.

I tested it, posted photos taken prior to listing. No any problems.

As per buyer, it was working while in his possession, and after 2 weeks it stopped (who knows if it's true)/

And since it happen less than 30days since purchase date, a policy forced on by eBay on sellers, I had to accept a return. (Hey, eBay I am NOT Walmart, I can't take that kind of losses).

There is an old legal precedent when it comes to used items of:

"BUYER BEWARE".

Class action anyone???

m60driver · ‎08-26-2018

@alturi_67 wrote:
@slati_2013 wrote:
Ebay's site. Ebay's rules. Legal? Does not matter.
keep in mind that eBay is a worldwide site. They also have the best lawyers to take care of any issues.

With eBay sellers being able to sell internationally specifically to the UK they have emulated return policy similar to what the UK has. It will only get worse as more countries create strong consumer protection laws

Here in the US there are no legal rules regarding returns which is why Ebay, Amazon, Walmart, , etc, can and do make their own rules. And third parties, such as credit card companies, have long had the ability to overrride a store's in-house retrun policies. I was having these same arguments with Merchant Services (credit cards) decades before the Internet arrived. I doubt there is any legal ruling in the land of POMs, or any other country as well, specific to retail returns. No need for lawyers, good or bad, returns are just not a legal matter, they are a service, a courtesy, extended to customers.

alturi_67 · ‎08-26-2018

@m60driver wrote:
@alturi_67 wrote:
@slati_2013 wrote:
Ebay's site. Ebay's rules. Legal? Does not matter.
keep in mind that eBay is a worldwide site. They also have the best lawyers to take care of any issues.

With eBay sellers being able to sell internationally specifically to the UK they have emulated return policy similar to what the UK has. It will only get worse as more countries create strong consumer protection laws

Here in the US there are no legal rules regarding returns which is why Ebay, Amazon, Walmart, , etc, can and do make their own rules. And third parties, such as credit card companies, have long had the ability to overrride a store's in-house retrun policies. I was having these same arguments with Merchant Services (credit cards) decades before the Internet arrived. I doubt there is any legal ruling in the land of POMs, or any other country as well, specific to retail returns. No need for lawyers, good or bad, returns are just not a legal matter, they are a service, a courtesy, extended to customers.

Keep your pretty head in the sand. Sellers who keep up with change appreciate your customers

ed8108 · ‎08-26-2018

@oo8sunding wrote:

I had to accept a return. I can't take that kind of losses).

Perhaps being a seller on eBay may not be a very good fit .

magicjohnsonsvariety · ‎08-26-2018

@alturi_67 wrote:
@oo8sunding wrote:
What about protection for sellers?
When you accept returns, you accept them for any and all reasons.

Buyers are sick of sellers who offer returns but really only want the benefit of being placed higher in the best match search.

Well said.....

Lately I've been seeing a lot of sellers complaining about 30 day returns only to see that they offer 30 day returns.

OP...No one is forcing you to have 30 day returns...you can also choose 60 or none.

ted_200 · ‎08-26-2018

I would expect whatever the entity who sold it to me said about warranty would be honored. Did the seller offer any Warranty?

Otherwise, I'd expect it to be working (if it was advertised as working) at the point of sale. For a private person to person sale, once I've verified that and paid, I own it.

But that's not how it works here. Hopefully OP gets the camera back, and even better if the buyer is lying and it works fine and is undamaged.

If you bought a used camera and it quit working in two weeks...

Well, aside from the above, WHY did it quit working? Battery went dead? Buyer dropped it on the concrete? NIB retail selling says someone has to make good on a defective item. This isn't NIB, and there is nothing to suggest (yet) the item was defective or there was an undisclosed issue (item is not as described).

The Floggings Will Continue Until Morale Improves.

ted_200 · ‎08-26-2018

When you accept returns, you accept them for any and all reasons.

OP...No one is forcing you to have 30 day returns...you can also choose 60 or none.

That is idiotic (the policy, not your statement). There is no reason for it, and it is NOT how the rest of the world, not even the ecommerce world, works.

Taking returns for ANY reason (from remorse up to buyer dropped camera on concrete) for a long period of time (30, 60, 180... whatever... days) is far too lenient for most lines of merchandise, particularly "Free" Returns. But "No Returns" is too restrictive and buyer unfriendly and inappropriate as well.

Most sellers would like to have a REASONABLE Return Policy, but eBay won't allow it. And in truth, even if you go with "No Returns", you're still stuck with eBay's unreasonable Return Policy anyhow.

The Floggings Will Continue Until Morale Improves.

kensgiftshop · ‎08-26-2018

@oo8sunding wrote:

And since it happen less than 30days since purchase date, a policy forced on by eBay on sellers, I had to accept a return. (Hey, eBay I am NOT Walmart, I can't take that kind of losses).

You offer 30 day returns, so buyer can return an item for any reason.

If you don't want to take returns, offer a no return policy for remorse returns, but it wouldn't help with INAD claims.

Have a great day.

femmefan1946 · ‎08-26-2018

There is no forced return.

There is a forced REFUND.

If a buyer complains about an item you have choices.

You can refuse the return and refund the payment.
You can tell the buyer to return the item, paying for it himself, and refund the payment.
You can send return shipping, and on receipt of the unwanted item, refund the payment.

The first is practical when the item is definitely broken and many glass or china sellers will settle for a picture of the shards and the damaged parcel. It is also practical when the buyer is in a country where the seller cannot buy a return shipping label.

The second remains the standard for Buyer Remorse refunds.

The third is the standard for Not As Described disputes.

The seller can ALWAYS demand a return before refunding.

She may have to pay for the return but she can demand it.

And it's been that way since around the arrival of BidPay and the later Paypal circa 2003.

Free Returns is a marketing ploy to encourage confidence in buyers.

It changes nothing in eBay policy for sellers.

How many Disputes have you had in the past year? Since you started selling?

For most sellers it is well under one percent*. If your Dispute rate is higher than that, it's time to revisit your business plan.

Part of that rethink should be consideration of Cookie Jar Insurance-- self insurance against the very occasional problem so you can solve it without eBay involvement.

*Some categories are worse than others. If young men are the demographic Disputes will be more common.

luckythewinner · ‎08-26-2018

Forced 30 day return policy, IS it legal

When you agree to abide by eBay's terms, yes it is legal for eBay to hold you to the terms you agreed to.

There is an old legal precedent when it comes to used items of: "BUYER BEWARE"

Buyer beware (caveat emptor) says that a seller is not liable for defects unless the seller implies there are no defects. Both of the cameras you sold were listed as Used, the description for which includes the phrase "fully operational and functions as intended". By choosing "used", you impled there were no defects - so "buyer beware" does not apply.

watchingbands · ‎08-27-2018

@ted_200 wrote:
@oo8sunding wrote:
What about protection for sellers?
There really isn't any.

I assume you didn't get the camera back yet?

I asked a ebay rep a few days ago
"hey, so, umm, can you name some ebay seller protections that are actually left these days?"

His reponse was
"(laughing), that's not fair, you caught me off gaurd".
We were having a good conversation, so he was really honest with me. After an hour of talking, we did come up with a couple seller protections. Delivery confirmation. But then again, buyer can just open a SNAD case afterwards anyways. But no defect or feedback. If a buyer claims an empty box, ebay can credit you the full amount of the sale. Tho that's more of a courtesy, rather than a policy. There are really only maybe a couple POLICY seller protections left. Anything else, is just a fluke of catching a rep on a good or bad day.

nobody*s_perfect · ‎08-27-2018

@watchingbands wrote:
... We were having a good conversation, so he was really honest with me. After an hour of talking, we did come up with a couple seller protections. ....

Seriously, you tied up a customer service rep for that?

stepmea10 · ‎08-27-2018

@nobody*s_perfect wrote:
@watchingbands wrote:
... We were having a good conversation, so he was really honest with me. After an hour of talking, we did come up with a couple seller protections. ....
Seriously, you tied up a customer service rep for that?

Some folks get lonely and any human contact is welcome.

carlmarxx · ‎08-27-2018

@luckythewinner wrote:
Forced 30 day return policy, IS it legal

When you agree to abide by eBay's terms, yes it is legal for eBay to hold you to the terms you agreed to.

There is an old legal precedent when it comes to used items of: "BUYER BEWARE"

Buyer beware (caveat emptor) says that a seller is not liable for defects unless the seller implies there are no defects. Both of the cameras you sold were listed as Used, the description for which includes the phrase "fully operational and functions as intended". By choosing "used", you impled there were no defects - so "buyer beware" does not apply.

So how would You have listed OP's Used Cameras that still are in working condition that only defect is handling wear use of taking pictures only ?

carlmarxx · ‎08-27-2018

@luckythewinner wrote:
Forced 30 day return policy, IS it legal

When you agree to abide by eBay's terms, yes it is legal for eBay to hold you to the terms you agreed to.

There is an old legal precedent when it comes to used items of: "BUYER BEWARE"

Buyer beware (caveat emptor) says that a seller is not liable for defects unless the seller implies there are no defects. Both of the cameras you sold were listed as Used, the description for which includes the phrase "fully operational and functions as intended". By choosing "used", you impled there were no defects - so "buyer beware" does not apply.

So how would You have listed OP's Used Cameras that still are in working condition that only defect is handling wear use of taking pictures only . Since you have never done any selling here?

monster-deals · ‎08-27-2018

@castlemagicmemories wrote:
@oo8sunding wrote:
What about protection for sellers?
Sellers are protected against INR claims if tracking shows delivery.

Sellers are protected by providing the most accurate and complete descriptions and listings.

If you bought a used camera and it quit working in two weeks, would you just walk away? Or would you expect your money back? If online, you have the case option. If you bought it at a flea or other local option, then you may be stuck with it.

No but I know that if I dropped it and broke it I can still return it on ebay and nothing will happen to me.