Closing store reverting to no returns. Free returns is not worth TRS

[sparrow421]

Just want to throw my hat into this. I dealt with the constant changes to requirements for TRS but this one is just too far. Im not mad or anything just a little dissapointed. I put a lot of effort into my store, making sure i always kept 100% positive feedback, but this new policy is going to attract major scammers. All because eBay wants to be more like Amazon.

I have been thinking of dropping the store for a while now anyways and this seems like a better time than any. So to all of those who are going to try to keep TRS, good luck!

(Yes this is an alt account, i dont make forum posts with my business account)

[tunicaslot]

I don't sell any where near $1400 a month. I'm small potatos when compared to many on here. 

[tamaralea]

I was just trying to point out that it doesn't take many returns to eat up our lowly 1% savings on final value fees.

[tunicaslot]

And therein lies the problem which many sellers like retrose faced - clothing used for an event and then buyers wanting to return the items. 

There is a distinct difference between an independent web site and a store on Ebay. Independent web sites - know what they sent and can deny returns for items not returned in the condition sent. Being Ebay does not know what was sent and what was returned as they neither send the item nor receive the returns - they do overstep their bounds when deciding returns.

Being there are unscurpulous sellers everywhere - buyers should always use a credit card as they can do charge backs for protection. The majority of sellers and buyers here are honest people but I've run into a couple as have most sellers and buyers that are up to no good.

This past year, Ebay had been more seller friendly as I won a fraudulent SNAD case on Ebay - only to lose when the buyer did a chargeback - but too many chargebacks and even the CC company won't go to bat for you. Now from threads here - which we don't receive answers to when asked - it seems the tides have again changed.

The majority of those in Facebook thrift groups that sell on Ebay will not offer free returns as they get burned enough with fraudulent SNADs. This is where Ebay is killing itself - making buyer friendly policies without consulting sellers. 

Other venues give 3 days from the date of delivery for a buyer to open a return req - that's it. You can deactivate listings without telling them why. You can cancel the transaction without repercussions and yet buyers are flocking to these sites. These are not buyer friendly sites when compared to Ebay - but I see less complaints from both buyers and sellers about these sites as each takes responsibility.

[ittybitnot]

I am just posting to the end of the thread.  It seems to me that this "free returns" , actually SELLER PAID RETURNS FOR ANY REASON,  is not much different that what is going on now.  A buyer that wants to ship something back on the seller's dime simply needs to lie about  there being something wrong.  Seller pays, buyer sends back whatever they like and gets a full refund.  

With the new program, should a seller decide to sign up, the buyer no longer needs to lie.  They can use that $300 prom dress, and send back the stinky used article with stains and tears just like they do now.  They simply don't have to lie about why anymore. 

A big perk for signing up for 'seller paid returns' is that you can deduct "up to 50% of the cost" if the item returned is not in the condition sent...So what?  If the buyer doen't like it, goes to the Pal and gets refunded in full.  If the seller gets back a phone book instead of their $600 Macbook, I would suggest that it is just a matter of time before the second $300 is taken away as well.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but if I go to "no returns" I still have to take and pay for SNAD returns even if the buyer is lying (that is how it is now).  I can deny returns for "it doesn't fit, I don't like it, I thought it was bigger, etc.  I think I am going to go for that no returns thing.  Make the buyer lie if they want to play that nonsense.  

The only "carrot" they are holding over us now is "demotion in search" for not playing the ebay game.  Well, there will be plenty of us on the bottom it would seem. 

[yuzuha]

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@keziak wrote:

The problem is whether 2 returns now will morph into significantly more when customers can return for free. I sell books and what could be easier than to buy a book, read it, and return at no charge for a refund? Or buy a DVD and watch it, then return. Etc.

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Customers already can return for free-- all they have to do is claim SNAD and there's nothing you can do to fight it.  So if you don't already get many returns, I doubt that changing to free returns would do much of anything.

[garmentvarmint2004]

YMEA..

I am strictly a  Buyer---not a Seller.   But I am  so angry with Ebay management for inflicting this horrible MBG program  on  Ebay sellers.   This program  actually  ENCOURAIges  buyers to   be dishonest -- and   to steal money from  good,  honest sellers.

[ymeagainlord]

It's the way of the world these days unfortunately.

Lately Wally World has taken to either closing off the cosmetics section entirely at certain hours or in some stores have added super bright lighting & prominent blinking blue lights security cameras (which are labeled as such). I don't actually mind those as it's way easier to see the product LOL)

Obviously they've gotten fed up with being fleeced for high priced small and easily pocketed items.

Also noticed more cameras & screens positioned above self scan checkouts as well.

But eBay blunders on regardless. Free everything is an "industry standard" ya know.

[futuretomorrow]

1. The two times I opened a store, my sales declined. 

2. Free returns may work for some people, but it eventually became more of a hassle than it was worth for me.

3. The store doesn't offer the level of analytics a seller needs to make truly impactful decisions and develop new sales strategies.

Look at the last negative on my account. That listing and sale, like all the others, clearly stated I don't accept returns. The customer left me a negative after I politely responded to their concern and reinforced my policy.

If I thought it were helpful or polite I would post the original message. He wasn't asking for a return. He was demanding one. 

Last month, with all my listings still saying "no returns", guess what the majority of my messages from buyers? They wanted to return something. While these were all very polite, they didn't seem to be asking if I could bed the rules for them, it was being discussed as if it was a done deal and I offered returns.

I wonder who could be pushing these ideas in their heads constantly and forming new behaviors that end up hurting sellers?

[fern*wood]

Another thing ebay could have offered, if they wanted free returns so much, was to offer a shorter return window like seven days.   For buyers to have 30 to 60 days with an item before returning, plus having no skin in the game, is really lopsided.

[tunicaslot]

7 days may have been a bigger drawer to get sellers on board - most of my buyers contact me the day they receive the item that they need to return it because they didn't order the right size.

The 30-60 days gives too long a time - for the item to be used, abused, read, copied ect.... this is where a seller will lose money - on borrowers.

[tealt]

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@myboardid wrote:

...

The free returns thing should be a mathematical decision.  Ask yourself these questions - How many returns do you normally have in a year?  How many do you think will happen if you offer free returns? Make an honest assesment of these, don't just make up  numbers.  How much would it cost you in dollars if you pay for these returns?  Then, how much do you get as a TRS FVF discount (roughly 1% of your annual sales)?  Compare them to help make your decisions. 

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There may be another factor to consider.

Will eBay begin to punish sellers who have a certain % of returns?

A few weeks back, sellers in certain categories received emails showing their % of returns compared to the "norms" in their categories.   Perhaps eBay has been spending the resources to track return percentages on sellers for a reason?  Will something about "high" return % appear in the summer or fall seller updates?

I shall try free returns this summer (as pointed out above, a buyer already has a free return option via SNAD, whether that SNAD is genuine or not).  If my return %  increases due to this trial, I will not longer offer free returns (or receive TSR+ discounts) for fear of increasing my return % to some level eBay deems "unacceptable".

Hmmmm, reading what I just wrote, I'm beginning to feel that eBay is putting me in a cursed-if-I-do-cursed-if-I-don't situation.

[mr_lincoln]

@sparrow421  Nice post ... it is a shame that Home Office thinks they have to keep up with the McCoys to be successful ignoring what made them successful in the first place.  Its kind of like someone trying to compete with WalMart ... presently, nobody can BUT smaller companies can carve out their niches in areas WalMart does not cover or is weak in.

The other really sad thing is how they go about it, dangling carrots, threats of losing previously earned status, etc.  If I had to call it something I would call it "manage by intimidation".  Good leaders never have to use that type of management style nor are they the ones playing catch up, they are usually the ones leading the market ...

As to the TRS comments, TRS is simply based on 100 US sales and $ 1,000.00 US sales in the last 12 consecutive months.  I think what you were refering to was the TRS Plus 10% FVF discount AND the Badge being displayed on your listings .... the latter of course is one of the aforementioned carrots.  Personally, I think the TRS Plus Badge increases Buyer confidence in many cases but again, despite being earned from previous requirements it will be taken away if Sellers do not agree to new requirements.

[mr_lincoln]

@tealt

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@tealt wrote:

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@myboardid wrote:

...

The free returns thing should be a mathematical decision.  Ask yourself these questions - How many returns do you normally have in a year?  How many do you think will happen if you offer free returns? Make an honest assesment of these, don't just make up  numbers.  How much would it cost you in dollars if you pay for these returns?  Then, how much do you get as a TRS FVF discount (roughly 1% of your annual sales)?  Compare them to help make your decisions. 

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There may be another factor to consider.

Will eBay begin to punish sellers who have a certain % of returns?

A few weeks back, sellers in certain categories received emails showing their % of returns compared to the "norms" in their categories.   Perhaps eBay has been spending the resources to track return percentages on sellers for a reason?  Will something about "high" return % appear in the summer or fall seller updates?

I shall try free returns this summer (as pointed out above, a buyer already has a free return option via SNAD, whether that SNAD is genuine or not).  If my return %  increases due to this trial, I will not longer offer free returns (or receive TSR+ discounts) for fear of increasing my return % to some level eBay deems "unacceptable".

Hmmmm, reading what I just wrote, I'm beginning to feel that eBay is putting me in a cursed-if-I-do-cursed-if-I-don't situation.

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Yep, you figured it out ... there is already an eBay tool for Free Returns and Buyers use it ... sure some SNADs are really SNADs but we read about so many here that are not.  So the coming thread topic later this year will go something like this, "Buyer used Free Returns to send back an empty box, HELP!"

I applaud Home Office for a lot of things and love Selling on the venue, but I also have a few subjects and features they came up with that I simply do not agree, that are poor uncreative business decision and finally do not I agree with their methodology in implimenting them ... its is somewhat of an insult to those who have established good Seller ratings and reputations.

[echo_and_zip]

A Seller who provides clear photos, an accurate description, w/ a proven track record...

should not have to PAY for remorse returns... the BUYER should.

[echo_and_zip]

Holiday & Occasion buying will mean increased costs for Sellers.