eBay

redline_auto_llc · ‎01-20-2023

A scam that we see constantly, and I'm sure others see as well, is when buyers claim damages or defects and ask for partial refunds. Sometimes we get pictures of their old damaged item, sometimes no pictures at all, but it's always a rant and a rave about how we've screwed them and we need to make them financially whole. Our response has always been, in short, "we are very sorry, please return for a full refund at our expense by opening a return in the resolution center".

We recently had a buyer ask for a 50% refund on a $300 item because a packing peanut got inside of it. We stretch wrap all of our purchases when we use packing peanuts so I know that wasn't actually the case, but we did the usual. "I'm very sorry, we must have made a mistake in packaging. Please return the item for a full refund by opening a return in the resolution center".

Never heard back from them, but naturally they left a negative. In the past I've had decent luck getting that removed under the feedback extortion policy, given that buyers aren't supposed to be allowed to use negatives or the threat thereof to obtain something not offered in the listing, such as a partial refund. This time though that's been denied and the feedback stands. I do like that the feedback explicitly states that it's because we wouldn't offer a partial refund.

More than anything I want to work out a plan for moving forward, because we get hit with this nonsense at least once a week and if it's not removable then I'm not quite sure what we're supposed to do. If we have to cave every time someone demands half of their money back out of fear of negative feedback that's going to be a problem. So how do you guys handle these situations?

pburn · ‎01-20-2023

One option for this particular transaction might be to reply to that feedback with a calm, rational, professional, non-accusatory response like, "Offered buyer a full refund upon the return of the item. Buyer declined." Also, "admitting" you "must have made a mistake in packaging" is probably not the best way to phrase it. Something more like "sorry you were disappointed in the item."

luckythewinner · ‎01-20-2023

@redline_auto_llc wrote:
that buyers aren't supposed to be allowed to use negatives or the threat thereof to obtain something not offered in the listing, such as a partial refund.

What you wrote is not true. The feedback extortion policy does not say that leaving a negative is extortion:

What is the policy?

Buyers aren't allowed to: Threaten to use feedback or detailed seller ratings (DSRs) in an attempt to force sellers into meeting their demands.

Nowhere that I can see in that policy does it say that leaving a negative if they do not get what they ask for is feedback extortion.

bamorris · ‎01-20-2023

Your feedback ratings over the last 12 months look great. One negative in 12 months with 200 positive is half a percent.

Part of me wants to think your target demographic for your sales are more likely to pull these types of stunts. Is it always packing peanuts that are the complaint? Or is it just this one instance. I've noticed I don't see packing peanuts used much these days.

I've had issues like this too. Buyers swap the guts out of a guitar pedal and return it as defective. Or returning a damaged item and claiming it was shipping when clearly the two items are not the same.

I wouldn't admit fault to the buyer. You don't need to explain anything to them. I would just say "Sorry you are not satisfied with your purchase, please return the item for a full refund." Or if they want to negotiate a partial refund, perhaps you can negotiate a better deal with them than half refund for the sake of moving on?

Returning the item to you for "not as described" doesn't cost the buyer a dime since you pay for the return. And I don't believe they can leave negative feedback on a return item so that seems like the best course.

ittybitnot · ‎01-20-2023

If we have to cave every time someone demands half of their money back out of fear ...

@redline_auto_llc

The "rant and rave" behavior likely worked with their mommy when they were 4 years old to get their way. It is likely still effective with those sellers that do "live in fear" of the red donut review. Negative comments no longer affect your selling standard, and a shakedown for a partial refund should not influence your business decisions accordingly. When you remove the FEAR component from your personal list, the power over you to comply to these demands is removed.

"Sorry you are not happy, please return for refund" is usually the best course of action along with a carefully worded reply to their comment.

sapphire_studio · ‎01-20-2023

You could reply to the feedback with:

"Thank you for your feedback. As we discussed before you are still more than welcome to send this back (just select "Item not as Described" to make sure you do not have to pay for the Return Shipping) for a full refund. It is the policy of our store to not issue partial refunds, especially in scenarios where we know we did not make a mistake (In this case your item was fully saran wrapped to protect from the packing peanuts). While it may be more costly to pay for a return than issue a partial refund, we have to stand by this policy to reduce our exposure to scammers. Hope you understand!"

pburn · ‎01-20-2023

@sapphire_studio wrote:
You could reply to the feedback with:

"Thank you for your feedback. As we discussed before you are still more than welcome to send this back (just select "Item not as Described" to make sure you do not have to pay for the Return Shipping) for a full refund. It is the policy of our store to not issue partial refunds, especially in scenarios where we know we did not make a mistake (In this case your item was fully saran wrapped to protect from the packing peanuts). While it may be more costly to pay for a return than issue a partial refund, we have to stand by this policy to reduce our exposure to scammers. Hope you understand!"

A response to feedback is not the place to rehash the transaction. The audience for the response is not the person who left the negative--it's future buyers who are reading the seller's feedback and responses. It's not the place to explain store policies or what happened in during the packing process, or to make reference to scammers.

Additionally, according to the OP, s/he already "admitted" culpability by stating, "I'm very sorry, we must have made a mistake in packaging." It's too late to now claim "especially in scenarios where we know we did not make a mistake (In this case your item was fully saran wrapped to protect from the packing peanuts)."

Sellers should also keep in mind the buyer has "the hammer," to use a shuffleboard metaphor. The buyer can post one more response to the seller's rebuttal, and it's game over.

IOW, keep replies to negatives short, professional, non-accusatory, etc. Use it to reassure future buyers that they will be treated fairly and with respect.

bamorris · ‎01-20-2023

@pburn wrote:
IOW, keep replies to negatives short, professional, non-accusatory, etc. Use it to reassure future buyers that they will be treated fairly and with respect.

Good advice. In this case, I'd consider just ignoring it and moving on with life. I always get a little sketched out on sellers that have any rebuttal to negative feedbacks. Most customers know that there is a certain amount of transactions that will result in negative feedback regardless of how much the seller tries to make it right.

He has 200 feedbacks in 12 months with 1 negative. I'd say it isn't even worth the response. Future buyers will read it and understand it was an anomaly. Now if the seller had 10-30 negative feedbacks out of 200, it would be a different story.

200 positive feedbacks in 12 months is great! I think about 1 out of 5 buyers leave me a feedback. And that seems to be dwindling as well.

Move on with life.

sapphire_studio · ‎01-20-2023

Yeah that makes sense. Thanks 🙂

djvp53 · ‎01-20-2023

For what it's worth, my response would have been that I was sorry they were disappointed with the packaging, not that it was packed wrong. The buyer explained how he came up with the partial refund request, which on its face seems reasonable. It's also understandable given why and how quickly he needed the part that a full refund wasn't entirely satisfactory. I probably wouldn't respond to the feedback but if I did, I would probably just apologize for the buyer's disappointment, explain that you offered a full refund with a return, and leave it at that. Lots of people looking at that negative feedback will realize you didn't treat the buyer unfairly and wouldn't be dissuaded from buying from you under the same circumstances. It's just one negative out of a couple hundred. Best wishes.

973roy · ‎01-20-2023

Try the decaf. No worries. Explain in your reply that buyer wants a discount and you want buyer to be satisfied, so offered a full refund upon return, but item was never returned. I enjoy reading the feedback and laugh. What do you think?

pjcdn2005 · ‎01-20-2023

Did the buyer actually threaten to leave negative feedback if you didn't give the partial refund? I think that it is only extortion if they say if don't do xx I will xxx. If they just ask for the partial and then leave feedback, isn't considered extortion. That doesn't necessarily mean that the feedback is not removable, just that it isn't extortion.

stuff4divas · ‎01-20-2023

@redline_auto_llc this is the extortion policy link> https://www.ebay.com/help/feedback-policies/feedback-extortion-policy/feedback-extortion-policy?id=4...

12345jamesstamps · ‎01-20-2023

Although it a negative feedback it wasn't that bad. All sellers are going to get one sooner or later. It actually will help you in future packing of your items and to be more careful. I have to agreed with buyer ...I need my lights to drive my motorcycle and since mine is a classic bike I can't get my lights just anywhere. And I need to drive at night sometimes. And to have a professional to take that item apart to clean the inside will cost money. I would have offered to pay for the removal of the stuff if a bill was emailed.

bamorris · ‎01-20-2023

@12345jamesstamps wrote:
And to have a professional to take that item apart to clean the inside will cost money. I would have offered to pay for the removal of the stuff if a bill was emailed.

The lights he is selling are factory weather sealed units. There isn't a great way to take them apart to clean them. To disassemble sealed units requires heat and then the factory weather seal is broken. If a piece of foam entered the unit, it should be easy enough to remove by shaking it or a blast of compressed air. It shouldn't cost half of the units price.

Besides, it would probably be less expensive to return the item to the seller for replacement than it would be to pay someone to crack open these sealed lights.