Clarification on New seller protections

[brettyg599]

@Anonymous 

Sorry for continually asking you questions, but I just read the new seller protections as of October 1st and I wanted clarity based on your answers from my previous posts about ITEM NOT AS DESCRIBED,  Here it is copy and pasted:

You’ll receive a credit for returns shipping cost when
the buyer falsely says the item is not as described.
• Report the buyer when you issue the refund
through the eBay returns flow
• You will receive a credit on your invoice for the
amount of the return shipping cost up to $6
• We will automatically remove any feedback,
defects, and open cases in service metrics

You specifically told me in the other thread that there is no way for CS or ebay to determine this once a "item not as described" is open because anything the buyer said is "In addition" to them stating it is not as described.

If this is still the stance from ebay as of October 1st, how does this statement have any meaning?  How can it be determined the buyer "falsely says the item is not as described" if they are not required to state why it is not as described.  

Does this statement mean that if I report it ebay takes my word for it as top rated that the buyer falsely claimed it and I receive my return shipping credit, or is their a review process when I claim it?  If there is a review process how do they gather information, or where would they get information to determine if it was falsely claimed if you have stated the buyer is never required to give that information?

Conflicting information from you and what this new seller protection says, hope you can clarify it for me.  Thanks!

[albany_sellers]

I don't expect much protection. This whole business about "we know the buyer lied to get free return shipping so we will graciously credit you $6 at the most on return shipping back" is deplorable.

Essentially eBay is saying that even if they know you are not in the wrong, and they know the buyer is lying, well enjoy taking a loss on the shipping costs. Have fun with the $60 shipping item that is a remorse return disguised an as INAD, I am sure you will feel much better knowing you only lost $54 instead of $60.

What eBay needs to do is clean up the site, start kicking abusive buyers off and then pay the cost of doing business when they fail to keep a seller safe, instead of just acting like "lol oh well it could have been slightly worse"

As far as the 50% refund for buyers who return damaged or used items, in many cases that would be suitable, but there are also the cases where a buyer returns something so destroyed that the value is zero. Sure is nice only getting screwed half as much on those cases......

This is all assuming that the buyer does not flip out about only getting half their money back. I am in the middle of one of those cases now and expect eBay to step in and tell me that I have to return the other 50% of the money. That little section talking about "Waiting for buyer to confirm refund received" part has me thinking that this so called protection is not really as advertised.

[pburn]

While you are certainly most welcome to start as many threads as you would like, and tag eBay employees in each of them, these might be great questions for the Weekly Chat with eBay Staff, where various staff members are at the disposal of any member's questions for an hour. It is held on Wednesdays at 1:00 p.m. Pacific Time.

[cashvaluerecovery2011]

Supposedly ebay will trust the top rated sellers word and refund whatever pittance of shipping they feel like. This does NOT mean they will rule in your favor and give your money back if someone returns you a rock.

[mam98031]

---

@cashvaluerecovery2011 wrote:
Supposedly ebay will trust the top rated sellers word and refund whatever pittance of shipping they feel like. This does NOT mean they will rule in your favor and give your money back if someone returns you a rock.

---

It is stated in the Policy to be $6.

[e-lek-tron-ics]

Even worse is when a buyer doesn't lie. You're out the original shipping fee and the return shipping fee if you offer "free" returns. You don't get the $6.00. You get nothing. You just lost money. On average around $8.00 for a buyer that "changed their mind".

[mam98031]

---

@e-lek-tron-ics wrote:
Even worse is when a buyer doesn't lie. You're out the original shipping fee and the return shipping fee if you offer "free" returns. You don't get the $6.00. You get nothing. You just lost money. On average around $8.00 for a buyer that "changed their mind".

---

@e-lek-tron-ics 

You are TRS with at least a 30 day return policy, therefore you qualify for the new Seller Protections October 1st.  So you do qualify for the $6 refund in certain cases.  If you don't know the rules for this update, just ask.

[chasearooauctions]

Thanks. I do know the rules. In the example I mentioned, you do not get $6.00

[Anonymous]

---

@brettyg599 wrote:

@Anonymous 

Sorry for continually asking you questions, but I just read the new seller protections as of October 1st and I wanted clarity based on your answers from my previous posts about ITEM NOT AS DESCRIBED,  Here it is copy and pasted:

You’ll receive a credit for returns shipping cost when
the buyer falsely says the item is not as described.
• Report the buyer when you issue the refund
through the eBay returns flow
• You will receive a credit on your invoice for the
amount of the return shipping cost up to $6
• We will automatically remove any feedback,
defects, and open cases in service metrics

You specifically told me in the other thread that there is no way for CS or ebay to determine this once a "item not as described" is open because anything the buyer said is "In addition" to them stating it is not as described.

If this is still the stance from ebay as of October 1st, how does this statement have any meaning?  How can it be determined the buyer "falsely says the item is not as described" if they are not required to state why it is not as described.  

Does this statement mean that if I report it ebay takes my word for it as top rated that the buyer falsely claimed it and I receive my return shipping credit, or is their a review process when I claim it?  If there is a review process how do they gather information, or where would they get information to determine if it was falsely claimed if you have stated the buyer is never required to give that information?

Conflicting information from you and what this new seller protection says, hope you can clarify it for me.  Thanks!

---

Hi @brettyg599, these protections for Top Rated Sellers take into account their longstanding history of providing exceptional service. This history would be a factor in our investigation and support protection being applied for the transactions they report. There will always be a review process to eliminate any abuse of this protection from sellers and so we may take appropriate action on a buyer's account, but reporting the concerns to eBay is the only step a seller who is eligible for these protections would need to take and their depth of experience selling on eBay would generally be all that is needed to apply the protections you are referencing. 

Hope this clears up any perceived conflicts - the discussions we've had in the past regarding a buyer's return reason and any additional comments they make are our baseline stance, and the protections you have quoted are the additional protections available for Top Rated Sellers located in the United States who offer 30 day returns on their items listed to eBay.com.

[ryanrobyn]

We all know that Ebay throws some bones to the sellers to appease them but doesn't follow through. Don't hold your breath for success with this one.

[brettyg599]

@Anonymous 

Thanks for the update even though there isn't a lot of clarification on how the process works in your post.  Basically I should just call CS is what your suggestion is? Do CS at anchor support have the power to remove "item not as described" now when they deem them to be "falsely selected"?

Can you elaborate on the situation previous that you said the new seller protections would not protect against that we discussed. "When the buyer said "broken zipper" on a pair of pants and it was clearly stated the zipper was broken in item condition.  In this situation given that I am top rated seller would I be covered for the return?

This item did not have free returns, so it didn't have top rated even though I am.  Does this factor in?

Basically I need to know how the new buyer protection works, and how someone is included in top rated.  Is it an account qualification, or a per listing qualification?

Then please comment on if the item had free returns would I qualify for "false item not as described", do I qualify for "false item not as described" with it not having free returns.  Or do neither having free returns or not having free returns qualify me for protection?

Thanks for the help, but I think most people in this forum would love to know how the new protection actually applies, and ebay may want to update its knowledge page with some examples of when it does and doesn't apply so that sellers and ebay are on the same page. That makes a lot of sense I think.

Thanks for the help, I look forward to hearing updates and understanding if these new seller protections provide new protections for me. This is a hot topic so I am sure everyone here appreciates you conveying ebays policy on it since it isnt written anywhere.

[mam98031]

Basically I need to know how the new buyer protection works, and how someone is included in top rated.  Is it an account qualification, or a per listing qualification?

I'm sure you meant Seller protection, so I'll assume that with my answer to this portion of your post to Trinton.  The new Seller Protections that started on October 1st are for TRS ONLY with a 30 day return policy or better.

You first have to be of TRS status.  That would be the first qualifier.  Then the transactions that would be covered by these new protections would have to offer 30 day returns with buyer pays shipping or better.  As we know return policies can vary on each listing if a seller needs to do that because of what they are selling. 

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-protection-policy?id=4345

From the above link:

To be eligible for Top Rated Seller protections (starting October 1, 2019) you must:

• Be a US Top Rated Seller at the time of the protection
• Reside in the US (including US territories)
• Offer 30 day or longer returns
• Only give partial refunds to recoup the actual lost value of the item when it is returned in a different condition than the original item
• Only report buyers for opening false item not as described returns where you correctly described the item
• Not be rated 'Very High' in Service metrics

[Anonymous]

---

@brettyg599 wrote:

@Anonymous 

Thanks for the update even though there isn't a lot of clarification on how the process works in your post.  Basically I should just call CS is what your suggestion is? Do CS at anchor support have the power to remove "item not as described" now when they deem them to be "falsely selected"?

Can you elaborate on the situation previous that you said the new seller protections would not protect against that we discussed. "When the buyer said "broken zipper" on a pair of pants and it was clearly stated the zipper was broken in item condition.  In this situation given that I am top rated seller would I be covered for the return?

This item did not have free returns, so it didn't have top rated even though I am.  Does this factor in?

Basically I need to know how the new buyer protection works, and how someone is included in top rated.  Is it an account qualification, or a per listing qualification?

Then please comment on if the item had free returns would I qualify for "false item not as described", do I qualify for "false item not as described" with it not having free returns.  Or do neither having free returns or not having free returns qualify me for protection?

Thanks for the help, but I think most people in this forum would love to know how the new protection actually applies, and ebay may want to update its knowledge page with some examples of when it does and doesn't apply so that sellers and ebay are on the same page. That makes a lot of sense I think.

Thanks for the help, I look forward to hearing updates and understanding if these new seller protections provide new protections for me. This is a hot topic so I am sure everyone here appreciates you conveying ebays policy on it since it isnt written anywhere.

---

Hi @brettyg599, you wouldn't call into Customer Service about this as our phone agents would not have the ability to review issues like this. The teams who review reports do not take phone calls, so the agents on the phone would only be able to walk you through the process of reporting something on the site. You would report this to us through the return or through the Seller Help section of eBay (found by navigating to the Help & Contact link at the top of most eBay pages and selecting the "Try it now" link in the box under the search bar).

As for elaboration, I'm not sure what additional detail you may be requesting; if a seller is Top Rated and qualifies for the protections we've discussed, they can report something they consider to be a false SNAD to us for said protections. If they are not Top Rated or do not qualify for the specific protections rolled out recently, they would not be eligible for the additional protections.

Free returns are not a factor in providing protection for false SNAD claims. Free returns allow you to deduct up to 50% of the refund for an item that is returned altered or damaged by the buyer. The protections available to Top Rated Sellers requires 30-day or longer returns be offered, but these do not have to be free returns.

The details of these protections are outlined in the related help page, found here. The information that a seller needs and the steps they need to take are detailed in this help page, and specific examples for this process would likely lead to further confusion as sellers attempt to anticipate or assess what will happen after they report the buyer. To avoid this, we have made it simple and stated that if you feel a buyer has filed a false not as describe return, you should report this to us. You would be communicated with on what next steps you should take after the report is reviewed. 

[nc-daydreamer]

---

@cashvaluerecovery2011 wrote:
Supposedly ebay will trust the top rated sellers word and refund whatever pittance of shipping they feel like. This does NOT mean they will rule in your favor and give your money back if someone returns you a rock.

---

You are probably right.

However, as a regular responder on these boards, it would be nice to know what "protections" are being offered to those who are not TRS. Or is it a matter solely of rank-has-its-privileges mentality and to heck with the lower ranks?  I'd really like to know how to explain this lack of "protection" to others? How do we as responders help these individuals?

I agree with other posters, what is being offered is inadequate at best and has major loopholes, but it is better than what we had. For example - postage should be at least $20, not $6.

I'd also like to know how does the buyer get refunded as per the MBG when the seller is only 'required' to return 50% - does eBay kick in the rest to the buyer to fulfill the MBG - or is that policy going to updated? Is the buyer ever educated as to what they did wrong, or do they really/blindly lose a buck or two so they pay attention and might not make the same mistake again?

But why is not every seller included to benefit somehow? At least on the 6$ postage level?  How to tell someone trying hard or new to selling that they don't matter and/or are not deserving? Did anyone in the decision room think this through? I really am having trouble understanding the fairness here.

As the late, great Robin Williams used to say, "Reality? What a concept!"

[cashvaluerecovery2011]

I wish i could answer these questions after my 20 years here but the truth is we only lose thing as sellers. So this is a new concept that will have to be tried and tested. We supposedly had seller protections before these add ons but never saw it. I have a feeling this will be the same but im hopeful.

As for why isnt every seller afforded the same? Money.