eBay

circus_camel · ‎01-26-2021

I sold my Google Pixel 4a phone on E-bay using buy it now option. It was in like new condition. Buyer requested a return quickly after receiving the package by lying about its speakers being defective. I sent the USPS return label. A few days later I received a package by UPS, which was sent by Amazon 3rd party seller. I had not placed the Amazon order. There was no indication that it was sent by the buyer as the address was of some Pharma company. There was no indication that it was Ebay return. The package contained some cheap $3 markers.

After a few days the buyer opened and escalated a case with Ebay giving the same tracking number that was on Amazon shipment box. The Ebay system closed the case in a few min stating buyer provided return tracking and the item was delivered. I was never contacted by Ebay to check. I also chatted with Amazon who confirmed their 3rd party shipped the package to me and it was their tracking number. They told me to donate or keep the markers. The packing slip in the package matches the UPS shipping email, which has the same tracking number that Buyer provided to Ebay.

I tried for almost full day trying to appeal with Ebay, and send documents . First it was almost impossible to reach someone and finally when I did, the person submitted a poorly written appeals case. By ignoring all that I said, he said that I received the package in Amazon box. When I told him that this was not the full story, he said I can provide more info to appeals. Appeals emailed me after about ten hours stating they were closing the case as buyer provided return tracking that shows I got the item back. There was no way to send any documents as proof that buyer used Amazon tracking number. Appeals did not even ask me for documents with which I can clearly prove that the buyer had cheated.

The link on Seller Dashboard for "Closed without seller resolution" is also not showing the case. How can submit my evidence to appeals department? When I call or chat, first all day it keeps telling me live help not available and then shows an email window with which no files can be attached.

I had shipped the package to 8 McCullough Dr. U125558, New Castle DE 19726-9000. I saw on forums that others have also been cheated by asking to ship items to this address. I have reported the buyer, but need Ebay to act responsibly.

Now I am out of my phone and the buyer has full refund.

Very frustrating! I also contacted Paypal, but they asked me to contact Ebay.

It almost feels that Ebay was complicit in cheating the seller by easily enabling the buyer to get refund, keep the item, not seeing sellers proof and making it very hard for seller to reach them.

Could someone recommend what I could do?

kevinmanley2011 · ‎01-26-2021

Ebay does not care about the sellers not even in the least. They have plenty of sellers and are only concerned about the buyers and the profit they can make. It is like that now and has been like that since I started a long time ago. I sold a 1,800 dollar Boss 302 distributor to a guy on ebay. He claimed it was restamped and not original, I had proof that I bought it on ebay in original condition with 50 years of grime on it and it had the exact same stampings when I sold it as when I bought it and I still had the original ebay ad I bought it from and showed it to them. The only thing I did was rebuild and restore it. It didnt manner at all, 100% of the time they are going to side with the buyer. So the guy sent it back to my shop and not my home which was the address I had sent it from. One of my guys signed for the package but it wasnt the distributor just like the guy above it was a scam. I also tried unsuccessfully to get this taken care of but zero help or maybe even less then that I was just a nuisance to them. My ebay fees are close to 2K per month, not a huge account but big enough you would think they care but that is not the case. I will still use them because most of the items I sell I have no use for and are just left over from my restoration shop but some parts like this distributor are important to me. If they had a competitor that came out that was fair and helpful I would jump ship in one minute. They are making a killing on this site. They supply nothing, they have no experienced people helping us out and now with this **bleep** extra 2.9% to dump our money in our bank account they make 13% for supplying nothing other then a place for us to type something in. Im praying everyday someone honest and helpful will come along so we can all jump ship.

ittybitnot · ‎01-26-2021

I also know that it's frustrating I can't provide more concrete details on what went down

Nobody is asking you to provide any details. We all know already. To those of us who have witnessed this scam over and over, it is quite plain. It is so obvious that even Ray Charles could see what is going on and he was blind and now dead. Customer service has already failed this seller and directing them back to CS seems rather condescending at the very least.

Sellers in this predicament need assistance from a CS that has the ability to think, and act, and see beyond the fact that a delivery confirmation number utilized is NOT for an ebay return.

If these sorts of reshipper/fraudulent return scenarios are now considered "part of doing business" on this site just like regular old faulty returns, just say so. If ebay staff here can no longer examine our accounts like before and provide any assistance, just say so once and for all. It will save everyone a lot of time and energy simply to tell the next victim of this there is no hope once their appeal is denied.

buyselljack2016 · ‎01-26-2021

@bonjourami wrote:
That address is a freight forwarder service, since the phone was forwarded, you shouldnt be responsible for a snad complaint..call Ebay and let them know this.

????? elucidate

queensstandard · ‎01-26-2021

This is a huge issue. I personally had to cancel 4 freight forwarders in the last 6 days. I know that a contact center is a cost center and the cost per contact is a metric that every large operation zeros in on. Maye just for that sake, you can carry this one to someone?

Thanks

gatts1 · ‎01-26-2021

Why Delaware? Is there a larger concentration of scammers there?

ittybitnot · ‎01-26-2021

Why Delaware? Is there a larger concentration of scammers there?

@gatts1

No. The address supplied in the OP (original post) is that of a reshipper. It allows international buyers to provide a US shipping address so that they may purchase items from sellers that do not ship internationally, and only allow bids/buys from US buyers.

This particular reshipper (in Delaware) caters to clientele in Russia and eastern Europe, while the ones you may see mentioned here from the Miami area tend to service locations in central and south America and the Caribbean countries. There are some on the west coast that provide reshipping to China and the Pacific rim.

Though reshipper services have not been particularly problematic in the past, the one mentioned here has. It is the favored destination address for the "text me" and phony "change the shipping address" scammers. It is also becoming quite famous for the scam the seller is experiencing here. While the other scammers don't really pay, this type does put up the front money only to file a SNAD complaint after the fact. Instead of returning the item they just have a cheap trinket delivered to the seller and use THAT tracking number to satisfy their need to show proof of a return. There have been some cases where that "cheap trinket" arrives at the seller's address even before the buyer files the claim. eBay does not require the buyer use the return label provided by the seller.

It used to be that the use of a freight forwarder would void any buyer protection, but that is no longer the case. Buyers can file not as described cases for which the seller must respond just like any other. The difference is that the seller has only to provide return shipping from the forwarder address, not the international location.
So the phone is now in "somehereistan". Buyer doesn't want to return it, so the play this scam instead.

Sellers in the recent past have received monetary redress from eBay for this scam. Perhaps eBay is just done losing money on this and makes it the seller's problem. We don't know.

vintagecraze50 · ‎01-26-2021

I certainly hope that SOMEONE at Ebay will look into this for this seller. However. I warn people on here all the time that selling these expensive phones here is a VERY risky situation. Something I hope Ebay will address in the future by doing some kind of Authenticate service for. It happens way to often here on the boards to be just a coincidence.

vintagecraze50 · ‎01-26-2021

All a scammer needs for these things is a tracking number saying their return is delivered. That’s kinda it folks.

gatts1 · ‎01-26-2021

Since eBay CS is unable to provide a satisfactory resolution as usual nowadays, it's time to go to the police & small claims for closure. Ask to file a police report in both your own city and at the dept. of the buyer. File a complaint electronically at small claims court in your buyer's district. They should take up the case since it's so obvious, but it will take a while.

A silver lining to corona is you probably won't have to represent yourself in-person if it goes to trial. Still, be prepared to represent yourself personally or hire an attorney.

If you're willing to put in the time & work, you'll get your money back one way or another. It's a very slow and time-consuming process. Regardless, you'll make the buyer sweat and waste time. I'm a strong believer that scammers need to know that there are consequences to ripping off sellers so brazenly.

On another note, it's depressing to see how much eBay CS has declined in the 10 years since I had a similar (though less audacious) situation from a buyer with an iPhone. The appeals agent was articulate, well-spoken, American, and could clearly see fraud. He reversed the refund on the spot.

gatts1 · ‎01-26-2021

Wow. Thank you for that detailed explanation. What a depressing predicament. I've dealt with 3rd-party reshippers frequently selling collectable camera equipment and wargames to Japanese and never had any problem, positive feedback received and all.

If the buyer really is from whereveristan, that narrows the OP's legal avenues. But perhaps he could sue the distributor? If they start getting heat legally, they might be less inclined to accommodate fly-by-night buyers.

In the meantime, I'll be pinning up that address at my fulfillment workstation to be sure I avoid any business with them. Thanks again.

nidsel · ‎01-26-2021

1) when you contact eBay CS Reps, make sure to keep your message as short as possible--the longer you write(or talk), the more they get confused. "I sold a Google Pixel 4a phone but buyer returned a pack of markers" -- 1 sentence works better than a long story.

2) file Mail Fraud case against both the buyer (if he lives in USA) & eBay (eBay is an accessory to a crime)

3) can your stolen phone be tracked & retrieved via Google support?

alcoforever · ‎01-26-2021

@gatts1 wrote:
Why Delaware? Is there a larger concentration of scammers there?

Delaware is a no sales tax state. Ideal location for a forwarder.

techvaluesatoz · ‎01-26-2021

I am going to recommend a remedy to not only resolve this particular situation, but to prevent regular recurrence of many of the problem transactions that plague ebay daily by the thousands: Make it ebay policy and culture that every employee, executive, board member, admin assistant, CSR operate an ongoing ebay selling account, selling in at least 5 different categories at least 10 items per month. Yes, this policy applies to Mr. Lannone, too. Ensure that each of these sellers do their own packaging, shipping, and communications. Require that they use only same access to customer service as available to all other sellers - no special access to escalation, no private access to assistance, same 112 minute wait time for call back. Basically, require that they use and submit to the same buyer fraud, damaged shipments, erroneous claims of defects, and senseless policies and incompetence inflicted by ebay on all sellers. Require that ebay leadership and employees experience ebay services.

I'm not betting on my idea's embrace and implementation, and I've offered this suggestion in response to previous ebay requests for input, but don't you agree policies would change if it were adopted? What do you think, Jamie?

alcoforever · ‎01-26-2021

@techvaluesatoz wrote:
I am going to recommend a remedy to not only resolve this particular situation, but to prevent regular recurrence of many of the problem transactions that plague ebay daily by the thousands: Make it ebay policy and culture that every employee, executive, board member, admin assistant, CSR operate an ongoing ebay selling account, selling in at least 5 different categories at least 10 items per month. Yes, this policy applies to Mr. Lannone, too. Ensure that each of these sellers do their own packaging, shipping, and communications. Require that they use only same access to customer service as available to all other sellers - no special access to escalation, no private access to assistance, same 112 minute wait time for call back. Basically, require that they use and submit to the same buyer fraud, damaged shipments, erroneous claims of defects, and senseless policies and incompetence inflicted by ebay on all sellers. Require that ebay leadership and employees experience ebay services.

I'm not betting on my idea's embrace and implementation, and I've offered this suggestion in response to previous ebay requests for input, but don't you agree policies would change if it were adopted? What do you think, Jamie?

But Griff sells on ebay. Non-controversial stuff though. Hawaiian shirts and aftershave stuff, last I looked.

moondogblues · ‎01-26-2021

"Why Delaware? Is there a larger concentration of scammers there?"

Actually, that might be the case. I have read that in Delaware you can create an LLC very easily, the laws are lax, etc. I would have to research more but (not to get too political) Delaware is where the computer shop is/was that supposedly had the Hunter Biden computer dropped off. There's more to that story. But that's all I remember for now.

But the triangulation scam could happen anywhere, really.