A member of VERO claims to have copyright trademark on Mattel & Barbie? HOW?

[laughingravy21]

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@emerald40 wrote:

Following the pattern? - Would this result in an exact copy of the dress right down to the buttons, zippers, and other embellishments.

And if this was a pattern, why the need to refer to the stock number of the original Mattel product shown in the catalog?

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I don't sew, so I don't know.  I'm just talking in general, legally.  You're allowed to sell the finished product from patterns; allowed to copy an original dress (minus branding); and any licensing agreements with mattel would not change the fact that patterns cannot be copyrighted.

[lbro_46]

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@laughingravy21 wrote:

"Licensed" would only be an agreement between the pattern company and Mattel.  The actual pattern would still be ineligible for copyright, and they can't control end use.  You're allowed to use patterns to make as many as you want, and sell to your hearts content.  

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So would it be okay for the Op to create a pattern to copy this design?

https://barbie.mattel.com/shop/en-us/ba/christian-louboutin-barbie-dolls/anemone-barbie-by-christian...

[laughingravy21]

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@lbro_46 wrote:

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@laughingravy21 wrote:

"Licensed" would only be an agreement between the pattern company and Mattel.  The actual pattern would still be ineligible for copyright, and they can't control end use.  You're allowed to use patterns to make as many as you want, and sell to your hearts content.  

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So would it be okay for the Op to create a pattern to copy this design?

https://barbie.mattel.com/shop/en-us/ba/christian-louboutin-barbie-dolls/anemone-barbie-by-christian...

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IMHO, yes.  Louboutin holds no registered copyrights for a doll pattern.  He has several books, and if one of them should contain a pattern then it would be illegal to make scans of pages out of the book and sell them.  However it would not be illegal to make a dress, or multiples, out of a pattern in said book.

[emerald40]

Can you copyright a dress pattern?

If not, can you prevent someone from making a pattern from your design?

[laughingravy21]

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@emerald40 wrote:

Can you copyright a dress pattern?

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No

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@emerald40 wrote:

If not, can you prevent someone from making a pattern from your design?

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No.  But you can protect specific branding and/or unique trademarked or patented features.

[dolldesigns4u]

I"ve been an ebay member selling Barbie clothes for 16 years.  i have not violated any ebay listing policies.  I did not make an exact copy of the Mattel dress.  My design is similar, but not identical.  Hence it is my own custom design.  

   Ebay Vero just messaged me saying they have reinstated one of my auctions.  Then another message followed, stating they took this auction down again.  Apparently Ebay Vero doesn't know what they are doing.  They stated the font I used in my auctions is copyrighted by my competitor, so it is the font that is the issue.  Oh well, I've already started moving my auctions over to ETSY.  This is way too much trouble for me.

[dolldesigns4u]

Again, i did not make an exact copy of this dress, It would be impossible, as the exact fabric is from the 1960's and is no longer available.  I use fabric and print similar to the original Mattel dress.  The zipper is not original, and I put the in my auction listing.  The style of the bodice is not the same as the original dress.  The organza I use is not the same exact color and type that Mattel used in the 1960's.  

[ersatz_sobriquet]

OP, I don't believe Mattel gave this other seller vero rights. I think the other seller copied your design, then filed for her own vero based on that design as her personally as a designer, nothing to do with Mattel. She then filed that her items were copyrighted and you were the one copying her. Ebay sided with her because she bought and paid into vero, you didn't. 

Your job at this point is to prove that your design came first. I don't know if even that will make a difference because she copyrighted her design and you did not. It may very well be one of those not who designed the lightbulb first--but who copyrighted it first. Since you didn't protect your design with a copyright, she won. Sad but it looks like it is true. 

[dolldesigns4u]

We are not copying Mattel's 1960's designs.  The fabric is no longer available,  the original colors are no longer available, nor are the zippers and or buttons.  The dresses I make are similar, but not exact copies of the 1960 Mattel dress.  My dress skirts are much fuller than the original one, and my bodice is a different design than the original one.  

[dolldesigns4u]

One of the Vero complaints from my competitor, was that the font i used in a few of my pictures was copyrighted by her via Vero.   So I'm trying to use a different font.  But really, this is way too much trouble for me.  when they delete an auction, I have to go through hundreds of pictures on my camera to find them, readjust and edit the photos again, and rewrite my description.  It's just not worth it to me. My competitor has won.  I looking into other venues now.

[emerald40]

You can copyright a font?

Isn't that in the public domain?

[laughingravy21]

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@emerald40 wrote:

You can copyright a font?

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Typefaces, no... Fonts, yes, because they're considered computer software.

I seriously doubt if the other seller has any copyrights on anything.  Maybe I'll look her up again.

[sharingtheland]

Ebay Vero just messaged me saying they have reinstated one of my auctions.  Then another message followed, stating they took this auction down again.  Apparently Ebay Vero doesn't know what they are doing.

Yes, this happens consistently.  I have received-snailmail-on-ebay-letterhead apologies for incorrect VeRO takedowns, with statements that I may relist the item(s).

Except, they get taken down again because no one tells the bots it's okay for me to relist.

I'm sorry this has happened to you, OP, and I don't see any way you can list those here again without changing all photos and titles and specifics.  In other words, create listings that no bot will recognize.

[theposhmermaids]

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@lbro_46 wrote:

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@laughingravy21 wrote:

"Licensed" would only be an agreement between the pattern company and Mattel.  The actual pattern would still be ineligible for copyright, and they can't control end use.  You're allowed to use patterns to make as many as you want, and sell to your hearts content.  

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So would it be okay for the Op to create a pattern to copy this design?

https://barbie.mattel.com/shop/en-us/ba/christian-louboutin-barbie-dolls/anemone-barbie-by-christian...

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Not necessiarily true.  I sell vintage patterns on another site.  Most patterns are copywrited.  Once they fall out of copywrite---about 50 years---they are free game unles re-copywrited.

If you look on craft patterns, many are copywrited and give a disclaimer that they are for personal use only.  Some state that they may be used for the purpose of selling a certain number at craft fairs, but are restricted for mass production.

[livadia]

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@dolldesigns4u wrote:

One of the Vero complaints from my competitor, was that the font i used in a few of my pictures was copyrighted by her via Vero.   So I'm trying to use a different font.  But really, this is way too much trouble for me.  when they delete an auction, I have to go through hundreds of pictures on my camera to find them, readjust and edit the photos again, and rewrite my description.  It's just not worth it to me. My competitor has won.  I looking into other venues now.

@dolldesigns4u

You could easily save yourself a lot of hassle in terms of time and effort if you'd just leave the text off your photos in the first place.   I am surprised that eBay hasn't taken down your listings because of it irrespective of any competitor's VERO complaints as you are not supposed to have text in your photos.   It's also hurting you when it comes to being seen in a Google (shopping) search as they require photos to be "unobstructed."

Also, you may find your selling career at the other "E" site short-lived if you insist on posting the same type of photos there as they also don't allow text overlays and are much more aggressive.  Not uncommon for them to shut down your whole shop for violations so you might want to re-think your usual plan.

Or, just clean up your listings here on eBay.  Get rid of the text in your photos.  Take out the name-shaming verbiage in your descriptions.   You have a long history of successful selling here on eBay.  If it were me, I wouldn't just throw it away NOR would I give another seller the satisfaction of having chased me off.   

The changes you need to make are simple ones.  Start with the listings you have active now so they don't get taken down and affecting your income potential.   Then, clean up the other ones that aren't currently active and make sure as you add new designs/listings those also are squeaky clean and sally on.

P.S.  You say above: "one of the complaints was that the font i used in a few of my pictures was copyrighted by her via Vero."   So what were the others?  You need to make sure those problems are corrected. too.

Good Luck.