eBay

shopkiger2 · ‎09-01-2019

A buyer contacted me about receiving an empty package and opened a case for a refund. The buyer sent photos which showed the item was ripped open and was empty. I contacted ebay about it and they closed the case in my favor since tracking confirmed that the item was delivered.

Now the buyer has opened a return request claiming the item is "defective or not working". Now what happens since ebay did close the case in my favor?

mam98031 · ‎09-04-2019

@equid0x wrote:
@fern*wood wrote:
I believe ebay allows for two different cases to be opened under certain circumstances. For instance, if I filed a INR case because it was 2 weeks late, and then received the item, but discovered it was not as described. This sounds like what the buyer did. It could be legitimate, so ebay has to have a process for this occurance.

As with most protections, though, there is always the possibility for abuse.
eBay doesn't give a **bleep** which case was opened. They will let the customer open 6 cases if the customer feels its necessary.

@equid0x

Are you trying to trick us?!?!? In your post [#115] right before this one you stated "By the rules... buyer should not be able to open a second case." [which is accurate, but not the point]

Then in the above post you stated "They will let the customer open 6 cases if the customer feels its necessary."

??????????????????

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

shopkiger2 · ‎09-05-2019

When she first messaged me, before there was a INR case or SNAD case, my intention was to get more information from the buyer like where she found the package (front door, porch, mailbox) and what damage there was to the package when she received it. She first accused me of not sealing the mailer but it was unsealed and torn open in the photo. I didn't understand what the point was in tearing it if it was unsealed. I thought maybe she could clarify. I was then going to contact USPS and possibly her post office. I mentioned in another post that my husband had located a missing item that he sold by contacting USPS. I thought it would be nice if the item could be found.
It may have been only $30 but I thought if the buyer no longer wanted it (if it was found) I would have had it sent back to me. I tried to offer her another item that I have similar to the one she ordered or just send the refund. After all, I wanted to avoid the negative feedback.
There was no response from her but yet she did open a INR case.
Since I couldn't get anymore contact from her I called ebay with a few questions about how sellers should handle situations where a buyer receives an empty package. I was informed the INR case had already been closed.
But then a SNAD case was open. Still no contact from the buyer so I called ebay again. I was told that if a buyer receives a package with missing/stolen contents it is up to them to contact USPS, their local post office or the police if they wish (which I agree would be nonsense for a $30 item) then to contact ebay. Ebay then will issue a courtesy refund if they believe the buyer is being truthful. That seemed reasonable to me since neither the buyer or seller is at fault if an item is stolen/lost during delivery. I again tried to contact the buyer to let her know this. I have yet to get a response from her. I called ebay back everyday to make sure this is still how the situation is being handled and all 3 CSR's I spoke with gave me the same information. They have told me to give the buyer til the 7th. At that point they will make a decision if they believe the buyer or not based on what information they already have.
My personal opinion is that the buyers decision to not respond has been ridiculous. She asked me to work with her to make it right and that's what I tried to do. If she would have responded with the information I asked for in order to contact USPS and the post office and let me know if she wanted another item or a refund this would have been solved by now. There wouldn't have been a need to contact ebay or the need to open an INR case or a SNAD case.
Now I will wait and call on the 7th like the CSR's told me to do.
I did my part to try to work with the buyer and to work with ebay. I've done as I've been instructed.
If the case is handled as ebay has promised, great. If it's not then it's not.

this*old*attic · ‎09-05-2019

You said:

”She asked me to work with her to make it right and that's what I tried to do. If she would have responded with the information I asked for in order to contact USPS and the post office and let me know if she wanted another item or a refund this would have been solved by now. There wouldn't have been a need to contact ebay or the need to open an INR case or a SNAD case.
Now I will wait and call on the 7th like the CSR's told me to do.
I did my part to try to work with the buyer and to work with ebay. I've done as I've been instructed.”

1. She DID let you know she wanted a refund - by filing 2 different cases, both of which you’ve fought vigorously.

2. The CS advice you relate concerns all of us, on both sides of the debate. It’s contrary to what we know, and we’ve seen it go badly before.

myangelandmyprincess · ‎09-05-2019

@this*old*attic wrote:
Buyers don’t get courtesy refunds - sellers do.

Buyers have the MPG.

While I do believe both parties have a chance of coming through this in one piece, there is not one thing said about CS that makes any sense.

The description is completely contrary to all the policies and would violate the buyer’s privacy, not to mention we hear scads of stories where CS is wrong and actions they take are later reversed and put back against the seller.

Given how doubtful or dismayed posts have literally been skipped over and board extremists high-fived, one must question whether CS is being understood correctly.

I just hope the situation works out for the best.

My fiancée got one as a buyer. I fought hard to get it too. I had told him not to worry he wouldn’t lose the buyer protection case. Seller admitted he didn’t send everything in the listing because it didn’t sell for enough money. He insisted he wouldn’t pay for return shipping though. The case was closed in the sellers favor I was beyond shocked. So I handled the appeal. They kept telling me i couldn’t appeal until I finally got a supervisor. He said from the looks of it the seller had kept calling in until a representative closed the case in his favor. They gave a partial courtesy refund of a couple hundred dollars which still didn’t cover the value of the missing items but it was better than nothing It was also upsetting the seller didn’t pay and feedback couldn’t be left

“Birth certificates show that you were born. Death certificates show that you died. Photographs show that you have lived.” -Unknown

equid0x · ‎09-05-2019

@mam98031 wrote:
@equid0x wrote:
@fern*wood wrote:
I believe ebay allows for two different cases to be opened under certain circumstances. For instance, if I filed a INR case because it was 2 weeks late, and then received the item, but discovered it was not as described. This sounds like what the buyer did. It could be legitimate, so ebay has to have a process for this occurance.

As with most protections, though, there is always the possibility for abuse.
eBay doesn't give a **bleep** which case was opened. They will let the customer open 6 cases if the customer feels its necessary.

@equid0x

Are you trying to trick us?!?!? In your post [#115] right before this one you stated "By the rules... buyer should not be able to open a second case." [which is accurate, but not the point]

Then in the above post you stated "They will let the customer open 6 cases if the customer feels its necessary."

??????????????????

Nobody's tricking you. EBay doesn't follow it's own published policies and hasn't been for some time now.

shopkiger · ‎09-05-2019

1. I responded to my buyer within minutes after she first messaged me about receiving an empty package. I told her I would call USPS and attempt to locate the item (she didn't respond with the info I needed to do so). I asked if she wanted the item (if found) or wanted me to ship similar item or refund (if not found). Even if she no longer wanted it. I would have gladly taken it back (it cost me $79).
No response. Buyer chose not to work with me.
After she chose to open a first and second case instead of respond to me, I did contact ebay to ask (for this case and future reference) how sellers and buyers are expected to handle empty package situations. I was surprised and pleased that ebay wanted to work with both buyer and seller and offer a courtesy refund. I again contacted the buyer to let her know this. No response.
There was no fighting the case. Especially vigorously.

2. The customer service advice that I relate is the exact advice that I received from 3 different CSR's when I asked how they handle emtpy package claims. This has even been confirmed in this thread. Not sure what page. I have never had a problem with ebay CS in 10, almost 11 years as a seller. I am trusting them with this case as I always have in the past. If it backfires, then I'll deal with it and learn from it. That's just how it goes.

this*old*attic · ‎09-05-2019

Ok. Run with that.

FYI, opening a case is an official request for refund.

Are you saying you’ve spent hours and hours over days and days on duplicate threads, because you preferred to keep it casual, off the books? Otherwise you’d have just refunded?

Uh huh.

spreadlovelikefire · ‎09-05-2019

I actually had this happen to me recently. My husband walked in from the mail box and handed me an empty padded envelope that was torn on the top and missing its contents. I ran outside and had the postal service rescan it as damaged as it was my only saving grace. I then opened "item arrived damaged" and uploaded the photos of tracking showing the package damage. The seller would have had to either have insurance or shipped it priority to be covered in such a case. If the postal service did not scan it in as visible damage or missing item then I'm not sure what can be done. If you used priority I would file a damaged item or missing item claim on USPS.

this*old*attic · ‎09-05-2019

That's what I'm worried about - enough calls to CS that OP has temporarily/erroneously won.

Or buyer will turn out to be a crook on Ebay's radar; it could happen.

But CS needs training, either way. Some of what's been relayed violates the buyer's privacy (or is misquoted).

shopkiger · ‎09-05-2019

FYI? Did you really think I don't know that?
I think you should probably be asking yourself why you have spent hours and hours on my duplicate threads. From your very first response you have had such a negative attitude. Even at times saying the exact same thing that I did and contradicting yourself. I wouldn't have spent hours and hours here if I wouldn't have foolishly defended myself over and over again against somebody on the other end of a computer screen. I'm ashamed that I did for as long as I have.
I got an answer to my question days ago. I have to end it.

For those who asked me to post an update after this is solved, I will do so on or after the 7th.

beardedbovine · ‎09-05-2019

@shopkiger wrote:
I wouldn't have spent hours and hours here if I wouldn't have foolishly defended myself over and over again against somebody on the other end of a computer screen. I'm ashamed that I did for as long as I have.
I got an answer to my question days ago. I have to end it.

Knowing when to stop contributing to the back-and-forth will save your sanity... especially on this forum.

I agree with someone upthread who said they think the buyer may have opened too many claims which is why eBay is giving this a closer look instead of leaving it to the bots. I find your case interesting and I look forward to hearing the outcome.

shopkiger · ‎09-05-2019

It'll be nice to know for future reference. I'm surprised I've made it 10 years without a buyer receiving an empty package. I thought I had seen it all.

this*old*attic · ‎09-05-2019

It isn’t credible. You’ve repeatedly said that you offered a refund but the buyer didn’t cooperate.

Why, then, did you call EBay every day with questions when they filed formally?

It just doesn’t track.

beardedbovine · ‎09-05-2019

@shopkiger wrote:
It'll be nice to know for future reference. I'm surprised I've made it 10 years without a buyer receiving an empty package. I thought I had seen it all.

Even if this one works out in your favor it doesn't mean the next one will. A buyer can file a not as described claim when they receive an empty package and past precedent shows the seller is responsible for refunding.

If your case goes another way... as your CS calls and Brian from eBay have indicated there are times cases are reviewed more closely... I think that speaks more to your buyer's track record than it does to eBay process on most not as described claims for empty packages. Either way it will be good to know how it works out.