keeping this Group Alive

[richardi415]

I haven't been active in this group in a long time.  But, I did get an email today saying this group would close due to no activity in the last 60 days.  I don't have much to say, but would like to keep the group alive.  If nothing else, looking back at a lot of the posts is still useful and interesting to me.  Thank you to all present and former group members.

--Richard--

[ragbutter]

Well now isn't that discouraging - but true. When I first started selling postcards on eBay in 1999 for my daughter ( 2000 for myself ) there were around 2,000 postcards listed. Those were the days. I have been away for a while and just returned in October. When I came back in October I made nearly $700 dollars on my first batch of listings. Imagine my optimism. Since that time not only have sales steadily declined - down to $0, but if I do manage to sell 10 postcards, at least 3 people don't pay. I have eBay set to auto file UPI claims - and they do - everytime I have auctions close. Sorry I got off the subject.

Back to what sells. Very rarely does anything seem to sell that is not super rare and in super condition. That is as it shoud be I suppose with so much competition out there. On the bright side - what a great time to buy postcards! Just don't get your hopes up that you will find something to resell. I suppose it could be possible, but I know I'm not finding any good resell lots on eBay - and I have bought a few. I have to say, I believe some of the lots I bought must have been comprised of the 99.993% that didn't sell - put into old postcard albums and featured as coming from great-grandma's attic or a local estate sale. Right now, I am just letting my listings end and am strongly considering selling postcard shipping supplies. In the meantime - what a great time to build up my personal postcard collection!

Thanks for all the good advice pulpdaddy. We appreciate you.

[4166mcdonnell]

Larry,

Thank you very much for your reply and all the interesting numbers and personal experience. It is all very much appreciated and I have learned much already. I very much look forward to your further comments in this area.

John

[4166mcdonnell]

Ragbutter,

Thank you very much for your own historical perspective. I learned a lot from your contribution as well. I am so sorry about your negative lot buy experiences. For my part I am still really thrilled with the lot I mentioned earlier in the thread of the very old postcards from French-speaking Europe and North Africa. In addition to ongoing positive sales activity with those cards I also similtaneously learned a lot from doring the research on them.

One of the thrills with the lot was coming across a series of cards with satirical cartoon content. They were designed in the 1912 to 1920 range by an French-Alsatian, using the pen-name "Hansi" during the time Alsace changed hands a number of times between the French and Germans. His drawings made subtle and not so subtle humour against the German occupiers and also celebrated French victory. I ended up with 3 buyers for various of these cards, some counter-bidding against each other, and learned lot about that period and "Hansi". Two of the buyers were in the US and one was in France. One of the US buyers also bought another cartoon series of postcards that featured boy and girl clowns from that same lot.

I found that the topic of older cards with dogs was also popular. One card pictured and ancient religious sculpture from Mauritania with a dog in it and it sold to somebody in the US who appeared to work for an animal shelter. Another old German card that showed multiple dog heads was snatched up by another American buyer.

The one individual card that surprised me in terms of the heavy counterbidding that went on was a postcard that showed a Jewish cobbler in what was then French Morocco. Bidders drove the price up from $2 to over $8, the highest bidding for any one card of that lot so far. The final winner was also in the US. Another card that surprised me that it even sold was one that showed an ocean vessel on it leaving a port. The French flag flew on that vessel but the one thing I could not see was the name of the ship. It was nowhere on the side of the ship and I am guessing it must have been on the back of the ship which was the one part not viewable in the photo. I listed it as a French mystery ship and admitted in the listing I simply could not identify it. Somebody bought the card anyway. Other cards of interest to me in that lot included one from Tunisia (when under French control) that showed a teen age girl in tribal outfit (bought by someone in France), one from then French Morocco showing a Franciscan Order receiving orphans and giving a lot of information on that order (bought by somebody in the Quebec City, Canada area) and a card showing a drawing of a French soldier arriving at a train station fresh from the front (bought by somebody in France) - I learned a lot of info on that aspect of World War I and that artist as well. I am eagerly looking forward to many more months of interesting research and sales with this lot.

I genuinely wish you more success with future lots than what you experienced in the past because good lots are such a pleasure to work with. Thank you again for all that I have learned from you here too.

John  

[ragbutter]

4166mcdonnel

Thanks for your encouragement and fine tips. I always just assumed I would never in a million years find good cards at a garage sale. I am going to start looking this spring.

I was thinking about making digital collage sheets out of my old damaged cards. However, I think I will just sell the damaged cards to people that want to make their own collage sheets, or want to use them for any type of scrapbooking or art or craft project. As long as the cards were published before January 1, 1923 it is legal to use the images. Lots that sell for such purposes seem to do pretty well. I have seen them go for as much as .50¢ per card - and it's honest.

Again, thanks for the encouragement and the assistance. I will start hitting the garage sales.

[lbstamps]

I think you're partially correct on the copyright issue for those pc's before jan 1923, but if an image or postcard from 1923 - 1977 does not  state a copyright notice, those are considered in public domain as well.  It gets a little more complicated the later you go.  I may be wrong. I would like to hear anyone else's thoughts.

Larry

www.PulpDaddy.com

[ragbutter]

Thanks Larry. That is certainly good to know. I really need to get rid of these damaged cards and they would make great scrap for artwork. I can't stand the thought of throwing them away. I too, look forward to what others have to say on the subject.

[4166mcdonnell]

Like you, I detest the thought of throwing out damaged postcards (or any other collectibles for that matter). A couple of ideas concerning effective disposal of damaged postcards have come to my mind, based on similar experiences in the stamp world when I liquidated my own collection some years ago on eBay and elsewhere. I offer these possibilities for your consideration:

1. When getting to the end of the stamp disposal project there were several thousand that had minimal to significant damage which I would not have felt comfortable offering as regular offerings. Out of curiosity I started to list lots of 1000 damaged stamps for 99 cents on auction. Both the title and description contained plenty of reference to it being only damaged material. To my absolutement amazement some collectors actually started to outbid each other for this material and one collector in particular bought more of the lots than anybody else. He explained to me that he did not care about the condition, just wanted them for his own collection and that he would not be passing them onto anybody else. I actually sold all the lots and quicker than I expected.
2. Elementary schools, scout groups, children's stamp clubs and other similar parties would from time to time put out the call for donations of unwanted excess stamps and collecting supplies (i.e. hinges, albums, etc.) so as to enable them to spur on children's interest in the hobby. I regularly responded to such requests even before I liquidated my collection and was quite thrilled with some of the thank-you responses. In that situation I obviously never sent out damaged stamps. None-the-less the thought occurred  to me that if all else failed in getting rid of damaged postcards would there be similar organisations that would be willing to accept donations of damaged postcards for things such as children's art projects or other similar purposes?
3. Perhaps there is an unknown market out there somewhere for even damaged postcards. If a significant number of your damaged cards have stamps on them and the stamps themselves are undamaged there could very well be stamp collectors interested in buying the cards for dirt cheap just to get their hands on the stamps. Perhaps there are others out there who want to use postcards for artwork or other decorative projects who are not willing to pay full price for quality cards but would be only too willing to buy heavily discounted damaged cards that are clearly described as damaged, as they would be intending to damage the cards anyway in their creative efforts.

Anyway, these are just thoughts that came to my mind in wanting to give you some hope for being able to dispose of the damaged ones without having to hit the dumpster. Hope they prove helpful.

John

[ragbutter]

Thanks John.

I had never thought of donating the cards. My favorite thing in the world as a child was Arts & Crafts class. I took Arts & Crafts at Church Camp, School and Private Classes. I will see if they want the cards for craft projects. I will also see if there are any good stamps on the cards.

Thanks for the great ideas.

[deltilogical]

I've been collecting postcards for over a decade now and only this week found this group on ebay.  I was amused by some of the topics in this thread.

Many sellers don't seem to understand how overpriced their cards are.  And maybe if you have relisted every 3 days for a year without selling it for $19, maybe that indicates you're too high.  I'm getting really tired of these wanna-be museum owners who relist their common chromes every other day for absurd prices.  And this talk about 99 cents being too much, well, many of the cards on ebay would be a challenge to sell for a 25 cents.  My favorites are the "excellent condition" cards that have obvious pieces torn out of them or big folds down the middle - they aren't even quarter cards.  

Generally, postcards aren't big profit items.  The $1 card guy might only make 25 cents on a card, but if he sells 100 of them thats $25 he didn't have. 

Recently I was watching a $10 card i thought might be priced to high, it didn't sell and the wanna-be museum owner has now relisted it as a buy-it-now for $20.  I guess if you like having a museum to display your cards and not sell any that makes sense. 

For damaged cards, sometimes I might cut out some of it for artistic work but I have been making a point of throwing away damaged cards.  They're junk, they need to be tossed.  If I had boxes fo them, though,  I would do something different.

[ragbutter]

While I certainly do agree that some people charge too much for their cards, you have to pay extra if you want to buy cards online. I think most people understand that. So much goes in to getting all those cards on eBay. Such as -

• Finding the cards which requires quite a bit of time
• Filing and organizing your cards
• Creating templates to showcase your store items
• Scanning - cropping & optimizing file sizes for all images
• Listing
• Communicating with buyers
• Printing labels - packing & shipping
• Marketing

That's just for starters. If you figure up the total amount of time you spend on one card - it could be in excess of a hour and don't forget about the eBay listing - upgrade & final value fees - and the Paypal fees - and the shipping supplies - and the toploaders ( if you really care to ship safetly ). Add it all up and 25 cents is a real joke.

I haven't been back on eBay for long. I was here when there were only 2,000 cards on eBay. You could sell cards for less, because you had less competiton and you could move your inventory a lot faster. I am figuring out slowly that perhaps the reason some people have such high prices on their cards is because they have had to pay to list them so many times and have put so much work into that one card - that they really have no choice. You can't take a hit in any business. You have to get paid for your time and you have to recoup your money. Otherwise, what's the point.

If you want cheap cards you really need to go out and find them youself. If you want to buy from people that have put tons on money and work into getting them out there - you have to pay for it. That's just the way it is.

[4166mcdonnell]

I fully agree with your reply about the realities associated with offering postcards for sale online, whether here at eBay or elsewhere. For that reason I believe it is unrealistic to find 10 and 25-cent postcards for sale here or elsewhere on line. While I sell here I certainly do not buy postcards here or anywhere else online because 99% of what I buy is destined for re-sale. I sense too that the majority of those who buy from me are not dealers looking to re-sell but rather specialised collectors with specific collecting needs. These collectors themselves sometimes drive up the selling prices because of trying to outbid each other. I typically list my postcards for 75 cents, 99 cents or $2.00, based on different criteria. Some collectors have driven up the final selling price of some of my cards to as high as $18.00. Many others sell simply for the starting price and many others never sell at all.

To enable me to sell like this I am forced to buy either good sized lots where the price works out to ideally no more than 10 cents a card or to visit those rare dealers at flea markets and church bazaars that will let me cherry-pick through their lots for hours on end and still let me pay no more than 10 cents a card. Add on all the other expenses you mentioned in your posting and it does not take a university mathematics degree to figure out that I am not getting rich at the levels I am charging on individual sales. I am rather counting on my business growing through a combination of as much volume as possible, certain cards skyrocketing in price and developing ongoing repeat business. I am only too happy to go this route though because I enjoy the combination of seeing niche collectors getting the missing items in their collections from what I offer and at the same time bringing in income from a hobby that I personally enjoy very much too.

On an important note about condition, it bothers me when I read complaints about other vendors selling damaged cards for high prices. Ideally I try to stay away from damaged cards however some do end up in my lap sometimes that I feel are just of such potential interest to some niche collectors  that I should offer them for sale in case that would be the only copy they could get of that item. When I do offer such material I make every effort to include full damage details in the condition description and item description and include photos that clearly show the damages so that there are no nasty surprises for buyers. To do otherwise to me is just simply stupid and serves only to scare away what could possibly have been valuable repeat customers.

There are many people who enjoy collecting postcards but can only, or are only willing to, pay very minimal amounts like 10 cents a card. My own buying habits prove that thousands of interesting cards await such people at venues such as flea markets, church bazaars and garage sales but they will have to be willing to accept the associated costs and inconveniences such as gas costs and an extensive amount of time. It's like when you go to those same venues to get really low prices on clothing, appliances and the like as opposed to going online or to major department stores who have much higher overheads than those simply renting table or kiosk space. I really believe it is realistic to have different expectations for the two very different forms of market places.

[ragbutter]

I completely agree with everything you said mcdonnell. I too, do this because I love it. By the time I purchase my cards and pay fees, I make no money but I enjoy what I do. Like you, I get great pleasure in connecting these old postcards to people that will cherish them for many more years to come.

I just want to add that one person's trash is another person's treasure. There are places from my childhood that I would pay ridiculous amounts of money for postcards of, should they ever surface. I would not even care if they were miniatrues - chromes or continentals with scalloped edges. It wouldn't matter to me. I had an email alert set for many years for a restauraunt in Blowing Rock, NC that my Dad used to take me to as a child. When I finally received an email (after many years) that the postcard was on auction - I bid a ridiculous amount of money immediately. It was a large chrome postcard. I was the only bidder and got it for $12.99 which some would consider CRAZY. It didn't care - I would have paid whaterver the seller wanted for the good memories. I cherish that card and look it at often. It means the world to me.

I don't sell damaged cards either. If the card is really rare and has a small amount of damage - I always mention it in the listing. I pride myself in giving really fair descriptions. I have to charge a little more for my cards - but not much because I present all of my cards in soft sleeves and rigid toploaders and I ship them in clay coated no bend rigid mailers. I know - that's nuts. But my customer love it and I feel proud everytime I ship one. I think all cards are special and I treat them as such.

I love arts and crafts - always have. I have scores of postcards that I fully intend to cut small circles out of to make necklaces with - if I ever find the time - and I won't feel the least bit bad about. We will all morph into something new one of these days. I also think I will take some to the home for disabled persons here in town and see if they can use them for there arts & crafts class - thanks to the previous forum member that mentioned that ( sorry - I can't see your name on the message writing screen I'm on right now). I think it's perfectly fine to sell severely damaged cards as long as you sell them for what they are - craft supplies.

PS - If anyone out there has a postcard of the interior of the Oasis Restauraunt in Hickory, NC from the 1960s - I'll pay whatever you want - even if it is a chrome card.

[lbstamps]

This is what I find so interesting about postcard collectors, err buyers.  I come from the stamp dealer/collector realm and it's pretty much straight forward.  Buyers of stamps, buy for one reason, to collect, and thus, are easier to price and value.  Condition is an upmost factor.

Whereas postcard buyers are indefinable.  They buy for the art, for the subject material, to express themselves in art, either personal or professional. To reminisce of a times past or a time remembered.  Condition of the card is only one of many considerations and even that, may not be a determining factor.

Larry

[ragbutter]

Amen Larry.

[4166mcdonnell]

Ragbutter, I spent a number of hours visiting the postcard vendors in the flea market where my kiosk is this weekend. I went through their stocks looking for a postcard showing the Oasis Restaurant in Hickory, NC. I really got my hopes up at one dealer because he had a huge supply of postcards from the Carolinas, Georgia, Florida and Alabama. He had a number of restaurant postcards from NC and I felt like I was getting warm but there were absolutely none in the end for the restaurant you were looking for.

Be assured that I will continue to keep my eyes open for you during my future purchases of postcards. Please be so kind therefore to adivse us here should you end up finding such a card yourself and want us to stop looking for you. I ask this favor as restaurants are not a topic I normally buy and offer and so I am not sure if I would have a market for such a card once you no longer need it. Thanks in advance.