Beware of iPhone Buyer Scams - eBay does not help

[frassanm]

You need to beware that there are fraudulent buyers out there which are trying to scam iPhone sellers.  Below are the details of how they are scamming people and eBay is not helpful to sellers.  

1. The fraudster opened their eBay account on December 26, 2023, only 5 days before the fraudster purchased my iPhone 14 Pro Max.   The iPhone was purchased on 1/1/2023.
2. The fraudster paid for the iPhone and I shipped the iPhone promptly on 1/2/2023.  The item was delivered on 1/4/2023.
3. On 1/7/2023, the fraudster requested a refund because the fraudster claimed it was not working.  This was a lie.  Here is the fraudster’s reason for return.  "Hello, the phone I bought from you is working very badly, the sound in the microphone is bad, it turns off by itself while talking, then the phone starts flashing and restarts by itself, because the phone is defective, I want to return it.”
4. Because of eBay's buyer guarantee, the only option was for me was to offer a refund to the fraudster.  I accepted the refund and purchased a label directly from eBay which pre-populated my address.  The label was sent to the fraudster directly with tracking.
5. I have been an eBay member and have been selling my old iPhones via eBay for many years now and this was the first time I have had a return. I noticed the date when the fraudster opened their eBay account.  I was already suspicious about the refund and sent the buyer the following messages.  “Hello, I never had problems with the phone and I was the original owner. Please ensure that you send everything back including the same cable, stickers and protective sticker over the face of the phone. Once I inspect the phone, I will reach out. Thanks!”  “I also notice that you opened your eBay account in December 2023, just 5 days before you purchased the iPhone. I will be taking the returned iPhone to the Apple Store to verify that there was nothing changed to the iPhone internals. I have copies of the IMEI numbers and all internal specifications. I took pictures of everything before it was sent out. Once I receive the iPhone with all the accessories that I included and the Apple Store verifies that everything is in good order, then I will issue the refund. There are a lot of scammers out there and I will not issue any refund to scammers, even if my eBay account gets closed. Thank you.”
6. On 1/13/2024, the fraudster shipped back hair ribbons in an envelope, but altered the address on the label so it would be delivered to my neighbor instead of me.  The address that was on the label that eBay sent was my correct address.  The fraudster did this intentionally so it would show “Delivered” via the USPS system.  
7. On 1/16/2024, the item showed delivered on USPS, but it was delivered to my neighbor because the fraudster altered the eBay shipping label.
8. On 1/18/2024, I went to the local post office to speak with a supervisor and opened a case with USPS on the matter because the item showed “Delivered”, but my Ring camera clearly showed that it was not delivered.
9. On 1/19/2024  at 5:59am, the fraudster asked eBay to step in to secure their refund.
10. On 1/19/2024 at  6:27am, less than 30 minutes later, eBay without checking my side of the story, issued a refund to the fraudster.
11. On 1/19/2024 at 7:30am, I filed an appeal to the decision.
12. On 1/19/2024 at 9:30am, the postal carried found that the package was delivered to my neighbor instead of me because the fraudster altered the shipping label.
13. I immediately reported the buyer as a fraudster.  I made several attempts to try to speak with someone via phone using the eBay number, but there was no option that would get to me to a live agent.   I left another email message via member@ebay.com to try to get someone to call me back.  

This case was a fraud case the entire time and it was allowed using eBay’s policies.  I kindly ask that you further investigate the matter which is clearly fraud.  I will not be liable for any refund that as issued by eBay on my behalf because this was stealing by the fraudster abusing eBay’s policies.  There are seller protections as well.  

[kensgiftshop]

You need a letter from USPS stating that the address was changed and not addressed to you.

File mail fraud and a police report.

Once you have those 3, use them to appeal the case.

[klhmdg]

eBay isnt here.

New sellers and cell phones are scams waiting to happen.

There are few seller protections and unless you can prove it was delivered to a different address than yours, and not a USPS issue, eBay will not side with you.

IF it was delivered to your neighbor why didnt you go ask the neighbor for the package?

[frassanm]

The address was altered on the return label so it would be delivered to my neighbor, but it would show delivered by USPS.   The fraudsters changed the label so eBay would automatically give them credit for the phone.  And trying to call eBay to let them know before they gave credit was useless.  There  is no way to get them on the phone.

[ittybitnot]

because the fraudster altered the shipping label.

@frassanm 

This is nothing new.  To what city/state did you send this phone?  Google the address and see if it was to a Freight Forwarder (typically in but not limited to Delaware, Miami Dade area, Oregon, etc.)  

[tobaccocardyahoo]

Selling iPhones online is a high risk venture in any venue.

If you did not know that already, you have paid for an expensive lesson.

There was little Ebay or any other marketplace site could have done for you without violating consumer protection laws.

Do what it takes to turn that phone into a brick.

[frassanm]

It was in Wilmington, Delaware.  The fraudster opened their eBay account 5 days before they purchased the iPhone.  Below is eBay's claims about seller protections.  None of those so-called protections were useful.  @ittybitnot   eBay can shut down the fraudster's account, but they got a free iPhone and will open another account to do it again.  

When you sell on eBay, you’re protected by policies, transaction monitoring, and data systems that make eBay a safe and vibrant community. You can sell with confidence because our dedicated seller protection team works around the clock to enforce policies and track problems before they start. Backed by large-scale, automated detection systems monitoring millions of transactions every day, our team uses world-class technology to prevent problems before they start, so you can focus on your business.

[frassanm]

There's a lot that eBay could have done to make it safe for sellers @tobaccocardyahoo 

1.  They could have actual phone agents to allow sellers to reach them by phone.  I tried calling the phone tree several times to warn them that the fraudsters altered the mailing label, but the system kept directing me to the eBay FAQ online.

2.  They could have required a signature on the return package.  eBay forced to add Signature Required when I shipped it out, but did not require the fraudsters to add it on the return.

3.  They could require a longer-time return period for newly-established accounts.   

I followed all of eBay's policies, but still experienced fraud.  There is more that can be done on eBay's part.

[ittybitnot]

 Backed by large-scale, automated detection system.....

@frassanm 

That is just a bunch of nonsense.    When an international buyer uses a freight forwarder, they give up the opportunity for protection under the Money Back Guarantee.  Unfortunately, eBay's automated detection system is a fail, and if such buyer files a not as described claim IT IS UP TO THE SELLER to inform eBay of same.    eBay just proceeds as if it were a normal sale.  

The typical updated version of the scam (should you be ignorant of the fact a freight forwarder was used)  would be to actually use the label you send from the forwarder address back to you, ALTER addresses  and simply send a parcel to an alternate address in your zipcode.    Had you known sooner, this could have been possibly prevented at the outset.    This scammer was not so bright using an address of your neighbor, when the local gas station or CVS  would suffice for a return. 

While buyers that are victims of the "fake tracking scam" can file a credit card chargeback, sellers are at the mercy of eBay who controls the money and the outcome.  Do not waste your time with the outsourced foreign  call center reps that you get on an eBay chat or callback.  

Hopefully, you retained the envelope as this the "evidence" so to speak, but you need to contact eBay through one of their social media portals.  These are US ebay employees that are VERY FAMILIAR with this issue and do have some authority to help you.  Use the blue message button at the top of this page: 


https://www.facebook.com/eBayForBusiness

OR one of these

https://twitter.com/askebay

https://www.instagram.com/ebayforsellers/

Let them know you need help with a fake tracking return scam for an international buyer that used a freight forwarder. 

BTW, if your buyer has zero feedback, you won't be able to see their country of registration. 

Use this link: 


https://pages.ebay.com/services/forum/feedback-login.html

You will also be able to see if they are "still a registered user" which will help your case if they are not. 

Also you do not need to keep posting the same topic over and over.  You can see your previous discussions by clicking on your user name/ profile.  You can ask the mods to delete them by self reporting before you get slapped for spamming the boards. 

[tobaccocardyahoo]

There is nothing a phone agent can do.

A signature would not be useful because the next step would be a credit card dispute AKA chargeback.

Extending the return period would have exactly the same problem.

When you lose a chargeback, you are charged a fee. If Ebay protects you when they lose, Ebay pays the fee,

Chargeback rates can affect the credit card fees Ebay pays, so Ebay wants to minimize chargebacks.

No Internet marketplace provides any better protection than Ebay. No Internet marketplace deploys human beings who are unable to influence the end result either.

The solution is not to sell iPhones online.

[frassanm]

This is very helpful @ittybitnot !  Thank you!

[stainlessenginecovers]

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@frassanm wrote:

There's a lot that eBay could have done to make it safe for sellers @tobaccocardyahoo 

1.  They could have actual phone agents to allow sellers to reach them by phone.  I tried calling the phone tree several times to warn them that the fraudsters altered the mailing label, but the system kept directing me to the eBay FAQ online.

2.  They could have required a signature on the return package.  eBay forced to add Signature Required when I shipped it out, but did not require the fraudsters to add it on the return.

3.  They could require a longer-time return period for newly-established accounts.   

I followed all of eBay's policies, but still experienced fraud.  There is more that can be done on eBay's part.

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1.) How would the site having a 'phone' stop a thief? 

2.) How would a return change anything? Thief STILL could've shipped you rocks, and then you would've had a signature for a box of rocks.

3.) So the buyer could just rip you off 2 weeks later? Would HAVE to be within the 30 day return window no matter what.

Therefore, all 3 of your ideas would accomplish nothing. 

[frassanm]

Hi @tobaccocardyahoo   What would your recommend to brick the iPhone?  I have the IMEI number, but I wiped it before I sold it and it's no longer on my cellular account.  

[berdoo08]

Sorry, but that last comment makes no sense as eBay does not provide better protection for sellers only buyers period !!  Also, there are plenty of e-commerce sites that deploy human beings who can figure things out with common sense and evidence, but eBay chooses not to spend the manpower in resolving these problems and very rarely does the seller win and it affects your selling here on eBay period !!   I sell on multiplatform sites including here on eBay as you just have to be very careful what you sell and document everything take pictures of everything and call the police eBay will listen to the seller or buyer if fraud by mail occurs as it is a felony in most states with evidence, if it's worth it  !!  Also don't sell phones on eBay.  How about let's not sell anything here on eBay??  That's what eBay is all about, if you can dream it you can buy it here on eBay, almost !!   

[chiccario]

The same thing happened to me this week. The buyer told eBay they wanted to return my iPhone 14 plus because, it didn’t fit.  He tried changing the address 8 times. The post master took control of the entire case. The address was changed to an address 5 miles from me in my town. EBay sends a message that they refunded the buyer and closed the case but they truly don’t. It’s procedure. I was able to send in the shipping form with  buyer’s signature and weight of package to buyer. I then attached the return mail form showing the return weight from the buyer. The weight was 6 ounces from buyer. EBay was very helpful and I was refunded within 12 hours. Once you click the case decision, you go to the bottom of page and click appeal. Complete the appeal, eBay will send you a declaration to sign and return to them. Send in Pictures and documentation and they will honour the seller’s protection. They have to close the case to help us sellers. It’s procedure and it’s will show that buyer was refunded but in fact the funds are put on 5 day hold while they wait for sellers declaration and documentation. The jagaloon thieves are getting creative. I noticed a big problem when the return was sitting in my home town and all of sudden it was on it’s way to Oklahoma.