Same Zip different address scam using USPS.

[shgayd_55]

Just looking for advice on this issue, ANY help would be very much appreciated. Never had anything like this happen.  I am sorry for the long write up. 

I bought a laptop on eBay on the 24th and got a pretty good deal, not an unheard deal.  After I bought and paid for it, I realized it was a brand new account that was made on the 23rd. I messaged the seller to make sure they were real and they messaged me back promptly so I felt pretty confident that it wasn’t a scam.  The package was "shipped" in a timely manner, I did notice that the sellers address where the package was created was several states from where it had shipped from. I don't know if that matters though.

Anyway... the package said it was delivered to my address on 3-3 but I was home and the post office hadn’t been by yet.  I waited an hour and then went to the post office and they said it was delivered but to a different address a few miles from my house. They didn't give me anything in writing but told me to come back tomorrow the 4th.

I got home I opened a case and informed the seller of the situation (At this point I still thought the Post Office messed up, I also opened one up with USPS)

I went there on the 4th and they talked to the delivery driver (they were supposed to have had the driver retrieve the package on the 3rd but there was a miscommunication or something) They told me that the driver never got the message to get the package back  and they were going to try that day. They again confirmed that the address that the package was delivered to was not mine and that the driver thought he remembered it was address to someone else and not my name. (This is all information they told me over the counter, I did not talk to the driver directly.)

After all of this I started to do research and found out this is a common scam... I thought I was safe buying on ebay with buyer protection, even from scammers.  I should have canceled the purchase once I saw the seller was created on 2-23-2023 but I did not... Hindsight is 20-20.   

If Ebay sides with the seller, which it looks like they often do in this case from my research, I will have to file a police report and take it up with my bank. I think That's what will need to happen anyway...

Sorry for the long winded post. I appreciate any insight. 

[ittybitnot]

Sorry for the long winded post. I appreciate any insight. 

@shgayd_55 

Sorry this is happening to you.  Yes, the "fake tracking scam" is reported here almost daily now, and has in fact been going on for years.  The eBay Money Back Guarantee is a total FAIL in this situation. Since it is automated, just about any scan of delivery of something somewhere will satisfy the eBay bots,  and the regular outsourced foreign call center reps seem to only spout the company line.  There was an interesting post the other day of a buyer whose tracking/delivery confirmation was marked delivered before the item was even purchased. 

Be advised, if you seek redress through your credit card, they need to know that this is NOT a regular "item not received" issue.  You need to seek out their advice PRIOR to filing your claim as to what evidence they will accept.  Otherwise, they send the chargeback to eBay, which provides the same fake tracking number as proof of delivery in response, and you will lose again.   Be advised that if you go this route, eBay will no longer obligated to help you. 

One thing you can look at is your "seller" still a registered user?  If not, eBay likely already knows about the "scam".  That does not mean they won't continue to deny you redress.  For every victim, be they a buyer or seller, that they can deny and make them go away, the more money eBay will save. 

There are two schools of thought on this problem now.  One is to obtain the written documentation from your Post Master, confirming the tracking number is NOT associated with a parcel intended for you. You do not need the actual delivery address.  Then you can contact eBay though the blue send message button on this page:

https://www.facebook.com/eBayForBusiness

OR

https://twitter.com/askebay

This puts you in contact with US based eBay personnel that are totally familiar with the scam, and do have the authority to help you. 

Others feel that if you simply file an "item not as described" claim instead, and choose "missing parts or pieces", the seller will have to issue you a pre-paid return label, and you can send back on their dime the same thing they sent you:  a box of air for your refund. If you don't get the label or refund, return to the claim in a few days and escalate (ask eBay to step in and help).  This is sort of playing the eBay deny bot at their own game for your advantage, since you know how to play as well.   

I don't know how effective this strategy is at this point.  Hopefully, those that have tried it will weigh in.  

At any rate, there is plenty to read here.  Just search the boards by 'fake tracking scam' and sort by date for the latest discussions and advice. 

Good luck to you! 

[shgayd_55]

Thank you for the reply!

I did contact ebay and after pleading my case they responded with;

Thanks. With this case being opened on the 4th, we can't yet action this case. We give the seller 3 business days to help you before we have the option to step in. As far as the case, the uploaded tracking is confirming delivery to the same city, which is what we look at. For an appeal on this case you'll want to provide documentation from the shipping carrier that the item was not delivered to your address. You can send that documentation here when you receive it. ~Natalia

After that response I decided to contact my bank and make a case and the lady gave me hope at least, in that I would win this. Their investigators will call the post office near me and ask if the package was delivered to my address, in which case it should be a slam dunk?...   10 days though.

If the Post Office doesn't come through I will probably have to get the police involved since they should be able to get that information released to me. At least a yes/no answer to if it was delivered to my address.  

Even though there was a red flag from the seller being brand new, there is nothing stopping this from happening again. With a stolen account or something.

I doubt I will ever by any expensive items off of ebay again... Which is a shame tbh. I like spending money on here lol...

[lakefor94]

Good post.  We are seeing far more of these cases the past year. The fake tracking scam has become staple for the thieves.

Buyers/sellers should not have to be doing the footwork on these cases. eBay should be doing it and canning the perpetrators. 

[mudshark61369]

@shgayd_55,

The info given you by @ittybitnot is the way you will have to go to get resolution from ebay. When you go to your P.O. bring a copy of your Order Details page or if you use a phone/tablet bring that to show the clerk the order details page which has the shipping address and tracking number uploaded to ebay by the seller.

You ask the clerk to check the tracking info against the address on the label, and the package info. If those things do not match, ask the clerk to write a note on USPS stationary saying the label address does not match the order address, and if applicable that the package type/size/weight is not appropriate for what you should have received. USPS clerks can only give you general information not specifics.  Have the clerk sign and date the note.

Since you filed an item not received dispute already you will lose it because that system is automated and can only access the tracking scans to look for a Delivered scan.  However, when they close the dispute there will be an appeal button there,  you can use to appeal for up to 30 days from the date the case was closed, and attach a clear photo or scan of the USPS note.  That will be enough to win an appeal.  Going the social media route works well also.  You do not have to file a Police report in order to win an appeal. 

[mudshark61369]

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@lakefor94 wrote:

Good post.  We are seeing far more of these cases the past year. The fake tracking scam has become staple for the thieves.

Buyers/sellers should not have to be doing the footwork on these cases. eBay should be doing it and canning the perpetrators. 

---

@lakefor94,

eBay and the other 3rd party online shopping site's are hamstrung in these cases by shipping agency's privacy policies, which only allow the shipper and proven addressee access to shipping label information, since the shopping sites themselves are not considered to be a party to the shipping contract.   Even when proof is given to them,  they will not give specifics about a delivery address and package info.   It is because of the privacy policies that buyers are the ones who have to do the foot work in order to win the fake tracking number scams. 

[lakefor94]

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@mudshark61369 wrote:

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@lakefor94 wrote:

Good post.  We are seeing far more of these cases the past year. The fake tracking scam has become staple for the thieves.

Buyers/sellers should not have to be doing the footwork on these cases. eBay should be doing it and canning the perpetrators. 

---

@lakefor94,

eBay and the other 3rd party online shopping site's are hamstrung in these cases by shipping agency's privacy policies, which only allow the shipper and proven addressee access to shipping label information, since the shopping sites themselves are not considered to be a party to the shipping contract.   Even when proof is given to them,  they will not give specifics about a delivery address and package info.   It is because of the privacy policies that buyers are the ones who have to do the foot work in order to win the fake tracking number scams. 

---

@mudshark61369 @  Companies with shipping contracts with carriers should have the same access that buyers and sellers have to information that a package was not delivered to their perspective addresses.  That is what I meant by eBay doing the footwork.

It is especially ridiculous to have buyers jumping thru that hoop chasing an eBay seller's scam.

[shgayd_55]

Update:  

It appears my bank sided with me on this and refunded my account. I went through their Fraud department and they said they were going to call the Post Office.  I am still waiting to hear back from the post office. Someone on another post was able to get their Post Office to sign a letter.   Waiting to hear back if the case is closed for sure or if its just a temporary release. I read that some banks do that. 

Posting this update incase someone finds this in a search later on. I think the above comments have good information in them.   I would try contacting ebay via the above twitter or facebook links BUT in my case ebay was (for lack of a better word) useless.

I will post another update if I find anything else out that would be useful to someone going through the same mess.

[docgo]

This happened to me as well and I was using what I thought was a trusted seller. I am out almost $280 dollars even after obtaining a signed and stamped official letter from my local Post Master stating the package was not delivered to my home address.

I disputed this issue with the seller, eBay, and Paypal and all three rejected my evidence. My only recourse is to take the seller to small claims court, unless I was in fact scammed in which case I will file a police report. 

[campanaelia]

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@docgo wrote:

This happened to me as well and I was using what I thought was a trusted seller. I am out almost $280 dollars even after obtaining a signed and stamped official letter from my local Post Master stating the package was not delivered to my home address.

I disputed this issue with the seller, eBay, and Paypal and all three rejected my evidence.

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Paypal's seller protection clearly states the item must ship to the address on the Transaction Details page. So how can they deny these claims with the evidence?

[xadexane]

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@campanaelia wrote:

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@docgo wrote:

This happened to me as well and I was using what I thought was a trusted seller. I am out almost $280 dollars even after obtaining a signed and stamped official letter from my local Post Master stating the package was not delivered to my home address.

I disputed this issue with the seller, eBay, and Paypal and all three rejected my evidence. 

---

Paypal's seller protection clearly states the item must ship to the address on the Transaction Details page. So how can they deny these claims with the evidence?

---

That's because the buyer's Transaction Details page at PayPal

-- identifies "eBay" is the seller 

-- states that "Purchase amount" is the item or items, with an unknown physical or virtual form. 

And PayPal knows that eBay don't ship nothing. Compare that with the PayPal Transaction Details page for eTsy, which properly identifies the seller, phone, email, item name, item number, and quantity -- everything that eBay hides or evades e.g. substituting their phone and email with a pair of synonymous website URLs.

[mudshark61369]

@lakefor94,

You replied to my post:

"Companies with shipping contracts with carriers should have the same access that buyers and sellers have to information that a package was not delivered to their perspective addresses. That is what I meant by eBay doing the footwork".

eBay does not have any shipping contracts with the shipping carriers, since ebay does not ship anything, except for their branded shipping boxes, which all orginate in Hebron Kentucky. The Shipping Kits that include boxes, tape, bubble wrap etc., are sold by individual sellers not ebay.

All ebay does is offer a payment gate way for their independent sellers to use to purchase shipping labels.   Sellers choose who they want to handle packages, and it is the seller who pays the shipping service, for the shipping, not ebay.   Therefore, ebay is not considered to be a party to the shipping contract and is not entitled to the label information other than the tracking scans.

[shgayd_55]

Update:

Still struggling with the Post Office releasing me physical proof… even though some post offices help, this one doesn’t want to.

However! eBay’s Lead production manager in the buyers experience team contacted me and we had a 10 minute call about everything that transpired. 

So, I explained and sent him a link to this forum 

He is also aware of the others having this issue. They are looking into it.

He wasn’t confident that he could help me in my particular case but he was going to try. 

Hopefully eBay can get a handle on this for future customers.  

[ittybitnot]

He wasn’t confident that he could help me in my particular case but he was going to try. 

@shgayd_55 

Didn't you already file a claim with your card?   If so, eBay is sooooo done with you.   

eBay is well aware of the "fake tracking scam" issue.  It goes back years.  eBay is pretty good at deflecting responsibility away from themselves, and on to the victims be they buyers or sellers. 

[shgayd_55]

Yes, eBay knows, they don’t seem to care.
The guy from eBay I talked to didn’t care either. Maybe they do behind the scenes but so far they haven’t told me to get lost or anything. Maybe the case being opened is why he contacted me I have no idea. I really don’t care, I just want my money back so I can be done with eBay.  

I’m mainly posting updates to help someone else if they run into the same situation in the future. They will see what I did and my outcome. For better or for worse but data is data.   I’m not expecting these forums to change the outcome in my case.

If they side with me than it’s an instant case closed with my case.