eBay

brittanie@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

Hi everyone! Thanks for joining us for the Weekly Chat with eBay Staff. We don't have a specific topic this week, so feel free to share any general buying or selling questions you may have.

The chat thread will remain open until 2 PM PT at which point we'll close it from additional responses. After that time, we'll continue to work on responding to any queries that might still be unanswered.

To post your question, click Reply in the lower right corner of this post, type your question, and hit submit between 1-2 PM Pacific Time. The format of our chat mirrors the format of our Community Discussion Boards, where each post will appear in the thread chronologically. The Community Team will review each question as it comes in, and will quote the original question in our reply. This quote and the reply will appear later in the thread, so just keep scrolling down to see our answers.

Missed the chat? Send your questions to the podcast by calling 888-723-4630 or email us at podcast@ebay.com and maybe your questions will make it on the air! Or listen to past episodes while you wait for next Wednesday!

Brittanie,
Community Team

justsc92 · ‎12-16-2020

I have commented on counterfeit sports cards, and questions I have seen are how can you tell, what’s makes you an expert.

I want to clarify that I am only talking about a specific segment of counterfeits. Sports cards that are less than 20 years old, that contain an autograph/signature, licensed by Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, or Panini, and that contain one or both of the following specific attributes:

Are a serial numbered issued card (like 20/25, 1/1, 23/23, 62/75, 018/150, etc).
Contain a company’s authenticity statement printed front and/or back (some examples)
- “authentic signature"
- “certified autograph”
- “The autograph is guaranteed by Panini America, Inc."
- “This certificate expressly warrants the authenticity of the depicted athlete’s signature”.
- “You have received an autographed game used jersey trading card”.

Think about it. If a company like Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, Panini would issue reprints with facsimile autographs/signatures and use the above authenticity statements that would be fraud. They cannot express guarantees like the above and deliver a facsimile. That would be deceit and fraud. If such markings cause confusion, cause mistake, or be meant to deceive future buyers, that is fraud.

These companies do not reproduce 1000 or 2000 of the same # 20 of 25, # 1 of 1, etc serial numbered cards. Again these companies do not commit fraudulent practices like making 1000 or 2000 of the same #1 of 1. How is it that a # 1 of 1 would be made a 1000 times and not be deceit and fraud. These are reputable companies.

So if a seller is selling lots of 10 of the same # 1 of 1 card (and has more than 10 lots to sell), and the card states it contains an authentic signature as a reprint (or rp for short), what is your opinion now?

The companies like Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, Panini are not fraudulent, but counterfeiters are.

Actually Topps did recently create a Mike Trout signature reprint, and the card was clear marked a reprint on the back, and stated “Facsimile signature shown is as appears on original 2012 Topps Bowman autograph card”. That is how they do a signature reprint as a facsimile. They do not leave a statement that it is authentic or guaranteed.

So when I see a 2011 Topps Bowman Sterling Mike Trout RC Auto # 1/1 RP for sale. And printed on the back of the card is “The signing of all Topps autographed cards is witnessed by a Topps representative

to guarantee authenticity”. I can say with 100 % certainty it is a counterfeit fake.

And yes I have spent the last 6 months with the legal and customer service departments of these four companies confirming it.

What is eBay’s going to do about signature/autograph reprints containing false printed statements about their authenticity and multiple copies of serialized cards? Not sure what trumps : fraud or counterfeiting.

Fraud would be nice since that skips the entire VeRo process. Really does not matter who made it. Fraudulent no matter who made it.

_____
Edit: A reply to your post can be found here

tyler@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

@golfingaddict wrote:

Thanks for having this discussion.

Thanks for the update on the announcement board about shipping delays. It is nice that ebay is acknowledging our struggles with slow mail.

Hi @golfingaddict - I'm glad that it's been helpful for you! It was updated earlier today as well - shipping is top of mind for everyone this time of year, but especially this year with everything that's been going on. 🙂

Tyler,

mam98031 · ‎12-16-2020

In regards to the PM icon on the top right side of the community. Along with the new format, which I'm not a fan of, comes an issue. If you read post there but do not respond to it, the envelope icon will NOT turn back to black. You have to respond to get it to go back to black. That can end up being an endless circle between members going back and forth. Certainly annoying.

-----

edit: A reply to your comment can be found here

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

justsc92 · ‎12-16-2020

This past week I asked a seller to confirm if an item for sale was authentic or not. The sellers response:

“I have the card marked as a reprint in several different places: title, description,.... This is not an original. I bought it off another site (Etsy) knowing it was not an authentic card. One, due to the price point and two, because it was labeled as such it the sellers description.”

And the seller appended their listing with “Bidders, Please Be Aware That This Card Is A Reprint (RP). The Card Will NOT Pass Any Authentication Process As An Original”

So the seller knew the item was not authentic (a counterfeit). Stated they purchased on Etsy as such.

This was for a common # 20 of 25 serial numbered card where the same # 20 of 25 card has sold over 430 times on eBay since spring 2020.

I reported the item and reported the seller multiple times. I spent nearly 3 hours on the eBay Chat Line on 3 consecutive days trying to get this listing removed as fraudulent.

The listing closed with a $ 10,000 bid. This again proves the current system in place does not work to make eBay a safe place for members.

brittanie@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

@justsc92 wrote:

I could use eBay help in deciding if an item is acceptable for sale on eBay.

A world renowned artist, paints a beautiful oil painting, and marks on the front and back

of the canvas, “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1”.

That same artist decides to print 1000 reproductions, and keep the same markings “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” on each of the 1000 reproductions.

So no copyright or IP issues.

But probably unethical, and likely fraud to make 1000 reproductions with the same “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” markings as the original oil painting (valued at $60,000 to $80,000) . Could these markings cause confusion, cause mistake, or be meant to deceive future buyers?

As a court could define fraud as conduct that breaks a legal or moral duty to another person, causing damages. A scheme reasonably calculated to deceive persons of ordinary prudence and comprehension might also be applied as a definition for fraud and could apply here.

So would eBay consider this a fraudulent item? Could these painting reproductions with markings “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” even though the prints are not an original or an oil painting, and the production run is 1000 and not just 1?

Can these be sold on eBay? If not, why not in terms of the policies of eBay?

If not (as it is a fraud and not IP or copyright or VeRo issue), where does this fall for eBay policy?

@justsc92 It's hard for me to speak to hypotheticals, but at a high-level, any item listed on eBay must comply with our policies and not infringe on the intellectual property rights of the right's owner.

Brittanie,
Community Team

gwzcomps · ‎12-16-2020

@justsc92 wrote:
This past week I asked a seller to confirm if an item for sale was authentic or not. The sellers response:

“I have the card marked as a reprint in several different places: title, description,.... This is not an original. I bought it off another site (Etsy) knowing it was not an authentic card. One, due to the price point and two, because it was labeled as such it the sellers description.”

And the seller appended their listing with “Bidders, Please Be Aware That This Card Is A Reprint (RP). The Card Will NOT Pass Any Authentication Process As An Original”

So the seller knew the item was not authentic (a counterfeit). Stated they purchased on Etsy as such.

This was for a common # 20 of 25 serial numbered card where the same # 20 of 25 card has sold over 430 times on eBay since spring 2020.

I reported the item and reported the seller multiple times. I spent nearly 3 hours on the eBay Chat Line on 3 consecutive days trying to get this listing removed as fraudulent.

The listing closed with a $ 10,000 bid. This again proves the current system in place does not work to make eBay a safe place for members.

My guess is eBay has something in the UA that absolves eBay from any liability in the assisting of sales of counterfeit items. From my experience they willingly turn a blind eye to counterfeits with my assumption being they want the money from the fees collected. Doing the right thing is not a concept major corporations seem to get.

tyler@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

@mam98031 wrote:

Just in case we don't get together next week I just wanted to make sure to extend BEST WISHES to everyone. I know the celebrations are different than previous years but I hope we can all make the best of them. My sincere wishes for everyone to have a fantastic Holiday Season!!!

Thanks @mam98031, and I echo the sentiments!

We will definitely be having a chat next week if you want to join. It will just be me in the office, so it will be a 'for fun' chit-chat kind of thread. 🙂

Tyler,

mam98031 · ‎12-16-2020

brittanie@ebay wrote:

@mam98031

@justsc92 wrote:

I could use eBay help in deciding if an item is acceptable for sale on eBay.

A world renowned artist, paints a beautiful oil painting, and marks on the front and back

of the canvas, “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1”.

That same artist decides to print 1000 reproductions, and keep the same markings “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” on each of the 1000 reproductions.

So no copyright or IP issues.

But probably unethical, and likely fraud to make 1000 reproductions with the same “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” markings as the original oil painting (valued at $60,000 to $80,000) . Could these markings cause confusion, cause mistake, or be meant to deceive future buyers?

As a court could define fraud as conduct that breaks a legal or moral duty to another person, causing damages. A scheme reasonably calculated to deceive persons of ordinary prudence and comprehension might also be applied as a definition for fraud and could apply here.

So would eBay consider this a fraudulent item? Could these painting reproductions with markings “Original Oil Painting” and “Limited Edition 1 of 1” even though the prints are not an original or an oil painting, and the production run is 1000 and not just 1?

Can these be sold on eBay? If not, why not in terms of the policies of eBay?

If not (as it is a fraud and not IP or copyright or VeRo issue), where does this fall for eBay policy?

@justsc92 It's hard for me to speak to hypotheticals, but at a high-level, any item listed on eBay must comply with our policies and not infringe on the intellectual property rights of the right's owner.

Well this is odd. I don't know how my ID got on this post. I didn't respond to the other poster. Curious issue!!!

_____
Edit: A reply to your post can be found here

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

mr_lincoln · ‎12-16-2020

Good afternoon eBay support team,

Northeast Snow Storm Wed-Thurs

Please confirm that eBay will be automatically waiving Late Shipping defects for the Northeast due to the current snow storm in progress. You can expect additional delays in items that already shipped today before the storm really got rolling.

Thank you,

Mr. L

-----

edit: A reply to your question can be found here

Regards,
Mr. Lincoln - Community Mentor

lisa5768 · ‎12-16-2020

Wishing everyone a safe and happy holiday season.

May 2021 bring better times as we say good riddance to the
dumpster fire that was 2020.

lisa5768
Volunteer Community Mentor

donsdetour · ‎12-16-2020

@justsc92 wrote:
I have commented on counterfeit sports cards, and questions I have seen are how can you tell, what’s makes you an expert.

I want to clarify that I am only talking about a specific segment of counterfeits. Sports cards that are less than 20 years old, that contain an autograph/signature, licensed by Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, or Panini, and that contain one or both of the following specific attributes:
Are a serial numbered issued card (like 20/25, 1/1, 23/23, 62/75, 018/150, etc).
Contain a company’s authenticity statement printed front and/or back (some examples)
“authentic signature"
“certified autograph”
“The autograph is guaranteed by Panini America, Inc."
“This certificate expressly warrants the authenticity of the depicted athlete’s signature”.
“You have received an autographed game used jersey trading card”.
Think about it.   If a company like Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, Panini would issue reprints with facsimile autographs/signatures and use the above authenticity statements that would be fraud.   They cannot express guarantees like the above and deliver a facsimile.   That would be deceit and fraud. If such markings cause confusion, cause mistake, or be meant to deceive future buyers, that is fraud.

These companies do not reproduce 1000 or 2000 of the same # 20 of 25, # 1 of 1, etc serial numbered cards.   Again these companies do not commit fraudulent practices like making 1000 or 2000 of the same #1 of 1. How is it that a # 1 of 1 would be made a 1000 times and not be deceit and fraud. These are reputable companies.

So if a seller is selling lots of 10 of the same # 1 of 1 card (and has more than 10 lots to sell), and the card states it contains an authentic signature as a reprint (or rp for short), what is your opinion now?

The companies like Topps, Upper Deck, Leaf, Panini are not fraudulent, but counterfeiters are.

Actually Topps did recently create a Mike Trout signature reprint, and the card was clear marked a reprint on the back, and stated “Facsimile signature shown is as appears on original 2012 Topps Bowman autograph card”. That is how they do a signature reprint as a facsimile. They do not leave a statement that it is authentic or guaranteed.

So when I see a 2011 Topps Bowman Sterling Mike Trout RC Auto # 1/1 RP for sale. And printed on the back of the card is “The signing of all Topps autographed cards is witnessed by a Topps representative
to guarantee authenticity”.   I can say with 100 % certainty it is a counterfeit fake.

And yes I have spent the last 6 months with the legal and customer service departments of these four companies confirming it.

What is eBay’s going to do about signature/autograph reprints containing false printed statements about their authenticity and multiple copies of serialized cards? Not sure what trumps : fraud or counterfeiting.

Fraud would be nice since that skips the entire VeRo process. Really does not matter who made it. Fraudulent no matter who made it.

Since said companies that made the originals could become VERO members of eBay:

and don't..... what is eBay supposedly to do about it??

If they do not care why should eBay??

brittanie@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

Sorry @mam98031 That was my fault. I had accidentally grabbed your tag when I was trying to tag the other commenter.

Brittanie,
Community Team

mam98031 · ‎12-16-2020

tyler@ebay wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:

Just in case we don't get together next week I just wanted to make sure to extend BEST WISHES to everyone. I know the celebrations are different than previous years but I hope we can all make the best of them. My sincere wishes for everyone to have a fantastic Holiday Season!!!
Thanks @mam98031, and I echo the sentiments!

We will definitely be having a chat next week if you want to join. It will just be me in the office, so it will be a 'for fun' chit-chat kind of thread. 🙂

I vote for more recipe sharing !!!! And if I get that Strawberry / Hot fudge pie done I'll post a pic. But I doubt I will have it done by the chat. But I might. I have to get my make ahead mashed potatoes and fruit salad done and my husband will need the kitchen for Pumpkin pies. I'm sure there are other things I'll will be fixing as I like to get as much done a day ahead so that the day goes easier. We have our big dinner on Christmas Eve.

I found that when I was doing it on Christmas day I didn't get to enough Christmas day very much as I was strapped to the kitchen and all that work. So years ago I moved it to Christmas eve. It was an excellent decision. Christmas days is a lazy day and we just eat leftovers. Yummy leftovers!!

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

tyler@ebay · ‎12-16-2020

@firstelm_group wrote:

Hi - I’d love to know what, if any, additional help eBay is going to provide to sellers impacted by USPS delays. I’ve already had to do my first refund because the buyer isn’t going to receive their item by Christmas. This is in spite of sending the item early enough for it to arrive on time, sending updates, etc. I’m very concerned that I’ll have many refunds to do in the coming weeks for something that is 100% out of my control. I don’t feel like I have any choices here because I’m working hard to get and maintain “Top Seller” status. I’d appreciate any guidance you can provide.

Hi @firstelm_group - you can read about the delays we're seeing and what we're doing to protect your seller rating in our announcement here. Thanks!

Tyler,

dhbookds · ‎12-16-2020

Glitch in Time Away...........sorry for all the screen shots......but a picture is worth a 1000 words

Note that on the listing, I am away until Dec 18

One the store, I am away until Dec 19

Since the end time is midnite, Dec 18.........The list verbiage is incorrect......."until"
Dec. 18 implies I am back Dec 18......

In addition what does "expect a delay in shipping" mean? Ebay gives an estimated date......should buyers expect an additional delay? Presumably not......discounting the mess with the post office right now.

Does ANYONE every look at this stuff, either before or after publication?