Hello all, "including, but not limited" to: Kristjan, Duncan, Keith, Mick, and Guy.
I have decided to post "Part 2" of my overall response that began on the (paraphrasing, as I cannot recall due to my occasionally short term memory problems.... '-) "illegal auction wrecking BIN" thread..." So, here goes.
In doing a search, both in the Chat Section and the Chess Discussion section, using the word "ethics", it appears that the overwhelming majority of topics referred to two subtopics: 1.) Ethics and Ivory.... and 2.) Ethics in Chess Dealings. But I do not think it has to stop right there - and in fact it did not. There were a few others digressing discussions surrounding the topic of ethics. Go and look for yourselves.
However, one of my own main opinions on the topic (which in at least one instance focused at least initially on CCI) was prompted by some excellent questions of Guy Chesspurr. Rather than reiterating that discussion, why don't all of you go and take a look at what I had to say. It can be found at:
Re: Ethical dealing in chess sets
Posted on: Mar 30, 2010 3:15 PM, by member: knight_knight_zzz (120 ) View Listings
Now, as far as chess sets, it is completely understandable, I think, how one would want to focus on chess sets - since this IS a primarily a chess (sets) discussion group. However, to have the whole focus be essentially all about aspects surrounding only chess sets, (I think) misses a point of which I have repeatedly mentioned over these many years. That, as humans, we each have biases, faults, preferences, strengths, weaknesses, etc. etc. etc. (And our chess sets, which can't help but reflect our own humanity, have their own qualities and imperfections!)
If one is looking for 100% consistency in everything that each and every one of us does.... well, then.... one is going to be thoroughly disappointed in each and every one of us. "There ain't no such an animal", no matter how much arguing and convincing one tries to do with others - or in one's own life.
One might TRY to be consistent - and that could, in fact, be admirable. . But it is certainly a losing battle if one is looking to achieve perfection. We all do misdeeds, mistakes, neglectful and harmful things in our lives. There could be some debate as to how or if some folks display a greater degree of that than other folks. But we are fooling ourselves if we think that we ourselves are without fault. And frankly we come away not only appearing foolish, but we might even fertilize it with our own doings and sayings. (As an example, I myself often make a fool of myself in a number of my postings. I even seem to encourage it.) The unfortunate thing is that sometimes, more than one of you do it too, and you do not even realize it...! Some of you are blind even to yourselves!
One (of many) Internet websites, which defines ethics defines it terms of "moral principles" and of "rightness an wrongness". Other words which seem to associate with "ethics" are "cultural", religious, and medical.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ethics
I would now like to do a little bit of not only listing, but an "honest" expansion of the things that could be involved with ethics... (we will not even get into the legality of some things.) We will stick with the "ethics" of things for this little discussion. I would like to have this "discussion" begin with a expanded list of questions:
1.) Is it ethical to abandon one's dreams and hopes and aspirations for one's self, and deny oneself at least some pleasures in life (such as chess and chess sets) and to try to "save the world from war, famine, and environmental "disasters"?
2.) Is it ethical to focus - either exclusively on - or for the overwhelming majority of their time and life - on just chess sets?
3.) Is it ethical to spend hundreds and thousands of dollars on chess related sets and items.... while there are so many other problems of life and death and physical (and mental) health?
4.) Is it ethical for a number of us to just be spending so much time on various aspects of the chess world, when other (perhaps more) "important" things could be done - not only for and to others - but also to and for ourselves?
5.) is it ethical to send prohibited items in the mail cross the ocean?
6.) Is it ethical to allow a chess friend to bid (and win) an ebay item, when we ourselves really wanted that item?
7.) Is it ethical to buy (at an extremely low price) an extremely rare or economically valuable chess set from an unknowing seller?
8.) Is it ethical to give, as a gift, to a newly found chess friend, a set that the friend has longed for..... while at the same time, donating significantly less the truly needy, starving people in the world?
9.) Is it ethical to apparently not give any credit to another "researcher" for work he supplied to the chess research world?
10.) Is it ethical to knowingly sell (or to miss, despite a claim of American Experthood) a chess set with defects or replacement chess pieces?
11.) Is it ethical to not speak up, when one really should speak up?
12.) Is it ethical to monopolize conversations - in this or other Ebay forums? In CCI Circles? In Private Groups
13.) Is it ethical to lament too much?
14.) Is it ethical to never actively contribute to this group?
The issue of ethics and morals..... and what is right or wrong.... and what is proper and appropriate..... can be and is a sensitive one.
In the end, each of us must make those decisions - FOR OURSELVES. Of course, each of our decisions can and do affect others. "No man is an Island".
While I think it is relatively normal for people to judge others, (and I do it myself... and sometimes, I think or realize that I am wrong about some things, and sometimes I think I am right about some things - like this posted message "Part 2" right here!)
There is an old saying that, I believe, comes either from one of a higher authority..... OR perhaps from just a wise old man or men.... "Judge not lest ye be judged." There are some other sayings which a number of you may decide to "poo-poo" due to their supposed biblical origins. But those sayings do carry some validity, I think. Those other sayings mention things about casting a first stone.... and splinters, sawdust, and logs in eyes.
My interest here is to not try to take the joy away from chess collecting and discussion, but rather to try to place things in perspective.
John, Vermont
John, Vermont.
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Edited by r.van.der.veur at 11/04/2007 2:18 AM
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Edited by r.van.der.veur at 11/04/2007 6:04 AM
