Tracking number says delivered, GPS scan says different location, but eBay still closes my case

[rswjep212618]

Bought an iPhone XS Max from a seller (0 feedback - red flag 1), which I thought I got outbid on but apparently the seller cancelled the bids ahead of mine and closed the auction early (red flag 2). Tracking number sent after a week and then said delivered. Which is odd because I was home at the time and nobody came to get my signature. So I followed up. My mail carrier had no such package requiring signature confirmation. I went to the proof of delivery on the USPS site. It stated my address as the destination but then it was signed by some lady with clearly different name and the written address is illegible. So I went to the post office. They gave me a printout showing the destination was my street address, yet the carrier route assigned to the delivery was not my carrier, as well as the payment and weight details (it was a Flat Rate envelope weighing 0 pounds 0 ounces - Red Flag 3). Then they looked up the GPS for the scan. It was sent to a local restaurant blocks away with the same zip code and last 4 digits. That different carrier confirmed over the phone that a flat envelope was delivered to the location. So I provided these information, the proof of delivery with the wrong name, the GPS information given to me by USPS showing it was not my house that the signature scan was taken at, and the USPS Intranet Tracking record showing different carrier route and the weight of the package. eBay still closed my case in favor of the seller because the destination address was correct and it was delivered, claiming their "expert" said it was delivered to my address despite the USPS supervisor and all documentation saying otherwise. What can I do?

[dtexley3]

@ja-2149 there was no reference to weight.

flab·ber·gast Dictionary result for flabbergast

/ˈflabərˌɡast/

verb

INFORMAL

past tense: flabbergasted; past participle: flabbergasted

1. surprise (someone) greatly; astonish.

   "this news has left me totally flabbergasted"

   synonyms: astonish, astound, amaze, surprise, startle, shock, take aback, take by surprise; More

[rswjep212618]

I gave the CS reps the GPS tracking information provided to me by USPS that clearly showed the package was not delivered to my address. I gave the proof of delivery which showed whoever signed for it had clearly a different name and address than mine. The Intranet Tracking information I provided clearly shows an envelope of 0 lbs 0 oz was weighed and scanned, which clearly cannot be an iPhone as well as the fact that the carrier route which delivered the package was different from the one that visits my neighborhood. Then your reps kept asking for an Intranet Tracking document asking for the delivered address, which is impossible because USPS doesn't provide that information, only the GPS scan results and a proof of delivery which is illegible because whoever signed for it was obviously in a rush (which is probably why the scammer chose a business). I included a business card of the supervisor at USPS who can also confirm the GPS scan at the different location and that they could not provide me with the changed label on the envelope. The only possible way would be to have an actual photo of the envelope. I was not expecting the kindness of the restaurant owner and night manager, as well as a USPS manager, to provide me with the photo evidence of the actual label and photo of the "package" much later because I was told they may or may not have it (by then eBay already closed the case). CS Rep Carlo J. was the first to tell me I should file with Paypal. I filed immediately after receiving his message 7 minutes later.

[dtexley3]

That message is clearly showing that the CS Rep instructed you to file with PayPal.   @Anonymous Is this different that what you reviewed?

[3714508518]

---

eBay and Paypal are separate companies, why would eBay be saying anything about paypal policies? If the rep knew so much about paypal, I am pretty sure they knew that eBay would be off the hook if they convinced the buyer to open a paypal case. Not only is eBay allowing fraud to happen on its site, it seems like they are border line committing fraud themselves. 

Hopefully you run into less incompetence with paypal. Keep us informed. Might be worth reporting it to paypal that ebay is dodging their responsibility to buyer protection and telling buyers to open cases through paypal.

[rswjep212618]

A week ago I'd be surprised that a company would do such a thing. Right now, it'd be par for the course.

[rswjep212618]

I was surprised as well but considering how fast they closed my case, I felt I had no other option than to comply. They said they'd give me a certain time period and they closed it well before that date. I'm hoping someone from Paypal has a brain and can connect the dots, and now that I have the photo evidence, there should be no reason. I mean short of going back in time, physically intercepting the mail carrier and videotaping him delivering the envelope to the restaurant, I don't know what else I could've done.

[penguins_dont_fly]

---

@rswjep212618 wrote:
Thanks! Weird that this isn't an option on the main paypal dispute case site. Was limited to certain characters but I think I got my message across.

---

@rswjep212618 

Have you actually called  PayPal yet, instead of just hoping you got your message across?

[rswjep212618]

Not yet, I haven't had time to just sit and wait for the what will likely be a long call wait time.

[rswjep212618]

I think I'll call them tomorrow. The scammer probably responded to their request for evidence with the same fraudulent tracking number.

[Anonymous]

---

@3714508518 wrote:

Trinton can you confirm that you listened to the recording and the CS rep did not say that they should file with paypal as they would lose an appeal? You have a history of saying what you see in your review is different than what was described, without any explanation. Often it is an incorrect statement and when you are questioned on it you dont reply.

---

HI @3714508518, happy to clarify why I do not respond to these kinds of questions - my role is to pass along insight to the appropriate teams, clarify policy, and investigate for appropriate coaching so our Customer Service teams can improve. The specific details are often times not something I can discuss beyond confirming that there was misinformation provided, or stating that correct information was given. When indicating that there was different information given than what was described here on the boards, this is as detailed as I can typically be. If there was misinformation provided or a mistake made by Customer Service, I would have no problem whatsoever confirming this and providing appropriate coaching. In this situation, I can only reiterate that the details I've reviewed do not align with the description of events here and I believe there was a miscommunication or misunderstanding. eBay would normally be able to provide protection with the documentation discussed here, but since a PayPal case has been opened the OP will need to work with PayPal. 

We are committed to the privacy of the members of our Community and are thus limited in what we can discuss here. At times we can be more detailed because the OP has provided more detail or because certain pieces of information do not pose a privacy concern.

To summarize, when a representative of eBay has made a mistake or provided incorrect information, I am happy to address this and confirm appropriate coaching will be provided. If I review and find that correct information was given or that the details discussed on the boards do not match what I can see on my end, I will confirm that a misunderstanding occurred and recommend appropriate next steps.

[Anonymous]

---

@rswjep212618 wrote:

@Anonymous Unfortunately, this was not the case. I did not file with Paypal until an eBay customer rep told me I should because eBay closed the case and said an appeal would not likely succeed. I provided all the proof given to me by the courier but was still denied because address when the label was made apparently supercedes a GPS tracking scan even though now I know the address on the actual label differs vastly from when it was first printed. Even the supervisor at USPS was flabbergasted. 

---

Hi @rswjep212618, I will contact you via email to discuss this case in more detail, no problem.

[3714508518]

@Anonymous wrote:

---

@3714508518 wrote:

Trinton can you confirm that you listened to the recording and the CS rep did not say that they should file with paypal as they would lose an appeal? You have a history of saying what you see in your review is different than what was described, without any explanation. Often it is an incorrect statement and when you are questioned on it you dont reply.

---

HI @3714508518, happy to clarify why I do not respond to these kinds of questions - my role is to pass along insight to the appropriate teams, clarify policy, and investigate for appropriate coaching so our Customer Service teams can improve. The specific details are often times not something I can discuss beyond confirming that there was misinformation provided, or stating that correct information was given. When indicating that there was different information given than what was described here on the boards, this is as detailed as I can typically be. If there was misinformation provided or a mistake made by Customer Service, I would have no problem whatsoever confirming this and providing appropriate coaching. In this situation, I can only reiterate that the details I've reviewed do not align with the description of events here and I believe there was a miscommunication or misunderstanding. eBay would normally be able to provide protection with the documentation discussed here, but since a PayPal case has been opened the OP will need to work with PayPal. 

We are committed to the privacy of the members of our Community and are thus limited in what we can discuss here. At times we can be more detailed because the OP has provided more detail or because certain pieces of information do not pose a privacy concern.

To summarize, when a representative of eBay has made a mistake or provided incorrect information, I am happy to address this and confirm appropriate coaching will be provided. If I review and find that correct information was given or that the details discussed on the boards do not match what I can see on my end, I will confirm that a misunderstanding occurred and recommend appropriate next steps.

---

How come you haven't addressed the fact that an eBay rep told the buyer to open a paypal case?  You mentioned the buyer would have been taken care of by ebay if the paypal case wasnt opened. You can say a hundred times you cant do anything because a paypal case was opened, but you are not saying anything about the eBay rep telling the buyer to open a Paypal case...  Since you havent confirmed that this was misinformation provided by the rep, it seems we are to assume the CS is trained/instructed to try dodge eBay buyer protection responsibilities and pass it off onto paypal...

[3714508518]

In case you missed it in your review, there is a message from an eBay rep instructing the buyer to open a Paypal case

[rswjep212618]

Wow, even Paypal won't even recognize the truth. They claim "This decision was made because we received shipment tracking from the merchant confirming that the merchandise was delivered." even though I uploaded the photo of the actual label proving it was shipped to a business in my area.

With this kind of idiocy, I guess there's a reason why so many scammers are out and about on eBay since eBay and PP will do nothing to prevent this. All a seller has to do is print the label off of eBay to prove that it was original address, change the street address to a place that's in the same city and zip-code, send a blank envelope, and then he gets to be bulletproof against all claims. eBay and PP won't even acknowledge the photographic evidence provided by USPS that the street address is a different one.

[no_zero369]

I don't know why you are taking the OP's side in this discussion?

From that carefully worded and totally PC reply, it sure looks to me like there were significant differences between the facts posted here and the facts available to eBay.   To this chair it looks like OP made a few mistakes or has some misunderstandings.  Since we only see one side here and do not see the information eBay has we are not able to make a fair assessment.  

Also, as far as suggesting OP go to PP, the statements make were pretty darn clear to this chair - IF the CS rep had made any mistake then the mistake would have been noted and said CS rep was due some appropriate coaching.  Since that was not stated indicates to me that after a review of the information eBay has, that the suggestion by CS to direct OP to PP was not out of line.

I know it is frustrating and often maddening to read statements by blues, but they tell it like it is, keep things about members private and help others understand the processes without violating confidentially.

I'm just saying....