eBay

mccamira · ‎09-09-2019

I am a buyer. I ordered an item from an ebay seller a couple weeks ago. Seller shipped promptly. It was scanned as delivered on 28 August. But I didn't receive the package. At first I thought it had been left on the truck and would arrive the next day. Or the substitute mail carrier doesn't like to carry packages so often scans them as delivered. They usually arrive the next day.

But it never arrived. The mail carrier said to check the rental office because people sometimes leave misdelivered packages there (this is an apartment). No luck there. I spoke to my local post office on the phone. They told me that the package was scanned somewhere between my address and two addresses up the street (apartment buildings) but couldn't be more specific. I checked around the mailboxes in those buildings and also the hallways. No package. I went to the post office and spoke to the supervisor. I asked for a printout of the delivery scan showing the GPS coordinates. He wouldn't give it to me. He said to file a claim. I don't know if the package is insured, so I asked the seller (no reply yet).

I think ebay will cover this if the package wasn't insured, but not unless I can prove that I didn't receive it. Does anyone have experience with a similar situation? Or are there any USPS employees out there with any advice?

Thank you for any help.

no_zero369 · ‎09-14-2019

@parkersparrow wrote:
After the package is scan as delivered what do you think a seller is able to do besides call the post office and ask the same questions you as the receiver could ask? You have a much better chance of getting results being able to speak to someone in person. Your local post office is the last ones to have handled the package.

Any seller can go to THEIR post office and obtain the same information that the buyer can. The point is that this tracking information is stored in a HUGE USPS database and that information can be accessed anywhere in the USPS system. Now the sellers PO can't physically root around the delivery PO looking for the package, but a seller can ask the supervisor to call the delivery PO and request they look around for it. As a seller I have done all of this because 1) I want to provide the best customer service for my buyers and 2) because I am responsible until that GPS data shows delivered to the correct address.

Hardest part of all of this is recognizing one is working with people and figuring out how to motivate them to help you out when there are little consequences to not doing so. But a reluctance to stand firm and insist on a good answer can be sniffed out in a second, with sadly, predictable results.

buyselljack2016 · ‎09-14-2019

@mccamira wrote:
The Post Office emailed me the GPS coordinates for the scan of my package. The problem is, they didn't give me any official documentation (I need a print-out of the actual information from the scanner) so I don't think I could use this as evidence of where the package was delivered. The person at the post office tried to tell me that she put the coordinates into Google and it said it was my address. Google doesn't do that. It gives a general location, which, in this case encompasses 4 addresses.

So I took my phone to all four of these addresses, stood outside the same apartment number at each address, and got the GPS coordinates. But it didn't help because the Compass app on my phone does not give fractions of a second. It displays in degrees, minutes, seconds in whole numbers. The coordinates the post office gave me have a fraction. The seconds of longitude are 7.7". When I walked around with my phone, two addresses had seconds longitude of 8 and two addresses have seconds longitude of 7.

The mail carrier could find the location if he wanted to. His scanner displays in fractions of a second. But no one at the post office will try to figure out where the package was delivered.

Does anyone know of an app for iPhone that displays fractions of a second? I have not been able to find one in the app store. Most compass or GPS apps don't show how they display.

The GPS location may be a fairly precise thing. As mentioned, within feet.

The problem there is that the carrier, in some instances, may not be waiting until they are in the exact delivery location to make that scan.

Walking carriers do not wait until they are at the customers door to get their mail ready to deliver. In many instances they divide the mail bundles up as they are walking to the next spot, so that it is ready to be put in the box/receptacle when they get there. If they wait until at each address to sort they would still be out there when it got dark.

A package scan could be done some distance from the actual mail box. Possibly even at a different physical address. When customer 1 gets mail, customers 2, 3 have no mail that day, and customer 4's mail is in hand ready for delivery 50 feet before the address, and the carrier is also working on getting customer 5's mail ready.

kensgiftshop · ‎09-14-2019

@buyselljack2016 wrote:
A package scan could be done some distance from the actual mail box. Possibly even at a different physical address.

True.

I'll be talking to our mail carrier and he'll be grabbing packages and scanning them while he is setting there talking.

Have a great day.

buyselljack2016 · ‎09-14-2019

@kensgiftshop wrote:
@buyselljack2016 wrote:
A package scan could be done some distance from the actual mail box. Possibly even at a different physical address.

True.
I'll be talking to our mail carrier and he'll be grabbing packages and scanning them while he is setting there talking.

And of course that is OK as long as they get where they belong:) (and stay there)

no_zero369 · ‎09-14-2019

@kensgiftshop wrote:
@buyselljack2016 wrote:
A package scan could be done some distance from the actual mail box. Possibly even at a different physical address.

True.
I'll be talking to our mail carrier and he'll be grabbing packages and scanning them while he is setting there talking.

er, um, ah...... Then your mail carrier is not following proper procedure and is part of the problem. I'm just saying.

The scan needs to happen at the mailbox/door/delivery address. Otherwise it puts ALL sellers at jeopardy.

Can you please tell me what is your 10-digit zip code, such that I can avoid shipping to that zip code and be liable when porch pirates steal the package and I'm on the hook because the GPS data shows it wasn't delivered to the address on the order?

Anonymous · ‎09-14-2019

I did talk to my local post office post master, I was told by her It was never shipped to them and was never out for delivery to me and She told me to have the seller call her and she would have told her. I did tell the seller to call and gave the number... She never called and just closed the case because the tracker she had said Delivered .... This was a small item and I didn't know to get a print out of the GPS to win the INR..... MY post office said it was not delivered to my address...... I already lost the case with Ebay and it would not let me appeal the case...... Had the Seller called like I ask she would have found out I never received the package, But she didnt care....... Like I said it wont happen again.. Now I know what to do....

mccamira · ‎09-14-2019

@buyselljack2016 The mail carriers in my neighborhood normally either scan at the mailboxes in the building foyer or at the door of the apartment they're delivering to. There are about 45 feet between buildings. So if the package was delivered to another building, the GPS should show that.

buyselljack2016 · ‎09-14-2019

@mccamira wrote:
@buyselljack2016 The mail carriers in my neighborhood normally either scan at the mailboxes in the building foyer or at the door of the apartment they're delivering to. There are about 45 feet between buildings. So if the package was delivered to another building, the GPS should show that.

Ideally yes. Scan location does not always insure/confirm delivery location.

Your situation/mail delivery location would be less apt to be involved with a walking carrier scanning prior to being at the physical location.

It could happen more when there are not multiple deliveries such as a foyer, or row of cluster boxes.

parkersparrow · ‎09-14-2019

@no_zero369 wrote:
@parkersparrow wrote:
After the package is scan as delivered what do you think a seller is able to do besides call the post office and ask the same questions you as the receiver could ask? You have a much better chance of getting results being able to speak to someone in person. Your local post office is the last ones to have handled the package.

Any seller can go to THEIR post office and obtain the same information that the buyer can. The point is that this tracking information is stored in a HUGE USPS database and that information can be accessed anywhere in the USPS system. Now the sellers PO can't physically root around the delivery PO looking for the package, but a seller can ask the supervisor to call the delivery PO and request they look around for it. As a seller I have done all of this because 1) I want to provide the best customer service for my buyers and 2) because I am responsible until that GPS data shows delivered to the correct address.

Hardest part of all of this is recognizing one is working with people and figuring out how to motivate them to help you out when there are little consequences to not doing so. But a reluctance to stand firm and insist on a good answer can be sniffed out in a second, with sadly, predictable results.

Sorry but no, I as the seller can't go to the buyers local post office and have them question the the mailman that scanned the package as delivered or ask the neighbors if they got it by accident. All I as the seller can do is call and have them look at the same tracking info I see online and they say yep it was delivered. Now I as the seller can decide to refund the buyer or not. That is up to an individual's discretion. Also a lot of times local post offices phone numbers are not available online. They usually revert to the 1-800 number. Where if you call them about a first class package they will say sorry, first class is not insured, your out of luck.

parkersparrow · ‎09-14-2019

@Anonymous wrote:
I did talk to my local post office post master, I was told by her It was never shipped to them and was never out for delivery to me and She told me to have the seller call her and she would have told her. I did tell the seller to call and gave the number... She never called and just closed the case because the tracker she had said Delivered .... This was a small item and I didn't know to get a print out of the GPS to win the INR..... MY post office said it was not delivered to my address...... I already lost the case with Ebay and it would not let me appeal the case...... Had the Seller called like I ask she would have found out I never received the package, But she didnt care....... Like I said it wont happen again.. Now I know what to do....

In that case it sounds like they seller might have pulled a scam on you by not shipping to your address but to some random place in your zip code. I would try and report them. That's not really a regular case. If it had shown delivered to your actual address then you should have been able to work it out with your local P.O.

no_zero369 · ‎09-14-2019

@parkersparrow wrote:
@no_zero369 wrote:
@parkersparrow wrote:
After the package is scan as delivered what do you think a seller is able to do besides call the post office and ask the same questions you as the receiver could ask? You have a much better chance of getting results being able to speak to someone in person. Your local post office is the last ones to have handled the package.

Any seller can go to THEIR post office and obtain the same information that the buyer can. The point is that this tracking information is stored in a HUGE USPS database and that information can be accessed anywhere in the USPS system. Now the sellers PO can't physically root around the delivery PO looking for the package, but a seller can ask the supervisor to call the delivery PO and request they look around for it. As a seller I have done all of this because 1) I want to provide the best customer service for my buyers and 2) because I am responsible until that GPS data shows delivered to the correct address.

Hardest part of all of this is recognizing one is working with people and figuring out how to motivate them to help you out when there are little consequences to not doing so. But a reluctance to stand firm and insist on a good answer can be sniffed out in a second, with sadly, predictable results.
Sorry but no, I as the seller can't go to the buyers local post office and have them question the the mailman that scanned the package as delivered or ask the neighbors if they got it by accident. All I as the seller can do is call and have them look at the same tracking info I see online and they say yep it was delivered. Now I as the seller can decide to refund the buyer or not. That is up to an individual's discretion. Also a lot of times local post offices phone numbers are not available online. They usually revert to the 1-800 number. Where if you call them about a first class package they will say sorry, first class is not insured, your out of luck.

@parkersparrow

er, sorry for the confusion, but when I said THEIR, I meant the seller's post office. But no, calling isn't all a seller can do on a mis-delivery claim. A seller can go to the seller's post office and ask for the GPS data. I know this for a fact as I have done that! If you haven't done that you should try it!

So with a bit of leg work, a seller can see if the package was mis-delivered or delivered to the address on the order. In the later case the seller wins the INR case as it is up to the buyer to have a secure delivery location.

Good luck!

parkersparrow · ‎09-14-2019

@no_zero369

Yes, I know what you meant. I'm saying the buyer will have better luck getting answers at their local post office, than the seller would at theirs or calling.

The buyer should be able to get it as well. If their post office is telling them no it's either they don't feel like going to the trouble or they know they screwed up are trying to cover it up. I have had issues with missing packages myself and my post office has no problem giving me the gps info when I ask. GPS is not always available. I've been through it several times so I know what gets the best results, and that is not wasting any time and question the mail carrier as soon as possible.

no_zero369 · ‎09-14-2019

OK, glad we are on the same page! Thanks for the clarification!

Now I'll say this, fwiw, as I know not many other sellers are going to agree with me but....

As a seller I think it is my obligation to watch my shipments and advocate when something goes awry. So when an item headed north, takes a turn and heads to one of the coasts or a buyer claims an item was mis-delivered, I am at the USPS inquiring.

But hey, that's just me and the kind of customer service I strive to provide to my buyers! I try to offer the best 'customer experience' than I am capable of doing.

I'm sure that doesn't work for everybody, but hey.... to each their own.

toomstoys · ‎09-15-2019

https://community.ebay.com/t5/Shipping-Returns/Wow-Christmas-is-going-to-be-a-treat-at-the-PO/m-p/30...

As a USPS employee Can You comment on this thread? I think it's either bad training or misunderstanding the upgrade.

I agree with you too on the GPS location tracking. Have had to use that info before to prove that a package was miss-delivered.

lja440 · ‎09-15-2019

@no_zero369 wrote:
@kensgiftshop wrote:
@buyselljack2016 wrote:
A package scan could be done some distance from the actual mail box. Possibly even at a different physical address.

True.
I'll be talking to our mail carrier and he'll be grabbing packages and scanning them while he is setting there talking.

er, um, ah...... Then your mail carrier is not following proper procedure and is part of the problem. I'm just saying.

The scan needs to happen at the mailbox/door/delivery address. Otherwise it puts ALL sellers at jeopardy.

Can you please tell me what is your 10-digit zip code, such that I can avoid shipping to that zip code and be liable when porch pirates steal the package and I'm on the hook because the GPS data shows it wasn't delivered to the address on the order?

You are right. If the carrier is scanning packages in batches then they are not following proper procedure.

I am a rural carrier and therefore can get away with scanning at my Jeep but then again I am in their driveway, not on a city street or even a cul-de-sac in the 'burbs, I am most defiantly on their property. Even with that I only do so if I have a large package or stack of packages that makes it hard to also carry the scanner. The closest I come to a city type situation is a small trailer park, each of the 10 or so singlewides has an attached car port, I make sure to scan well inside the carport at the steps leading into the trailer.

OP have you called the Postal Inspectors yet? If not Call them.