I Sold a Computer as Partially Functional, Stated no Refunds - Buyer Requesting Refund

[bpajwhite]

Hello,

I need a little help.

I sold a Mac Mini computer.  In the listing, I stated everything that was wrong with it and that it would only boot in safe mode.  I stated everything I had tried to get it working correctly, but that I hadn't been able to.  I sold the computer at a price far below market value to reflect this condition.  I stated that all sales were final and that I was not going to sell the computer to someone so that they could tinker with it, and then send it back if they couldn't get it to work. 

The buyer has had the computer for a month, has told me that they have installed a new operating system, and now wants to return it.  They emailed me to request a return and I said no. 

They have now initiated a refund request stating that the item is defective.  Of course it's defective, it was listed as such. 

I called eBay and they said I could not decline a refund from within the dashboard if the buyer says the item is defective.  

How do I proceed?  What should I do next?  Should I use the "report buyer" function?  If so, do I use the "Returned an item after they opened, used, or damaged it" option or the "Buyer made a false claim - Claimed the item was not as described when that wasn’t true" option?  Both are appropriate. 

I appreciate the help. 

[hurryagain]

@bpajwhite 

 I am truly sorry for your experience with this "buyer."

My first piece of advise to you is to accept the return.  I know that this is NOT what you want to hear but it is in your best interest to do so.

If you try to fight it, the buyer can escalate the case which will force eBay to step in and at that point, eBay will issue a full refund and NOT require the buyer to send back your item so in essence, you will be out both the money and the computer.

Once a buyer files a "not as described" case against you, the buyer is always going to win the case.  Accept the return and when you get the item back, you can then report the buyer made a false claim...not before hand.

Again, I am sorry that this has happened to you.  In regards to electronics - computers and phones  - are a risky thing to sell these days.

[bpajwhite]

Thanks for the advice.  To make the story a little more interesting, I just found out that the buyer has taken the package back to the post office and told them he wishes to refuse the package.  This after he has opened it and had it for a month.  When I click on the original tracking information, it shows that the package is coming back to me.   I can't believe the post office let him do it. 

[hurryagain]

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@bpajwhite wrote:

Thanks for the advice.  To make the story a little more interesting, I just found out that the buyer has taken the package back to the post office and told them he wishes to refuse the package.  This after he has opened it and had it for a month.  When I click on the original tracking information, it shows that the package is coming back to me.   I can't believe the post office let him do it. 

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...What?!  My PO would NEVER allow me to do that...you're kidding?...WOW!  There is something so wrong with this picture...

Well, accepting the package is the best thing you can do anyway...hopefully the computer is in the package.  Report him after you get the package.

BTW...let us know what YOUR mail carrier says about the buyer refusing the pkg a month after he has had it in his possession AND opened it...etc...  I have GOT to hear what your mail person has to say on that!...downright bizarre...is his PO operated by a bunch of newbies or what...

So sorry...

[no_zero369]

I think where you went wrong with CS was that you should have emphasized that the seller altered the item by installing a new OS.  Anytime you "fix" something that voids the MBG.  Buyer needs to be able to return the item in the "condition" it was received and that is clearly not the case now.  Might take the right CS rep or supervisor to grasp this difference, but it is a significant alteration of the item.

When you get the item back make sure the serial number is the same.  If it is different came back and ask about the steps for filing Fraud charges against this buyer.  Doing so might get you a courtesy refund from ebay.

Also look for signs that the item has been "repaired".  Again, doing such should void the MBG.  If you have evidence of such repair attempts in the buyer's emails, that could have been pointed out to CS as well.

Yes, once you get the item back use the report buyer function.  Upload as much info as possible.

Oh and next time, don't offer anything as "partially functioning" as that is too open to interpretation.   No one is going to be the arbiter of what "partially functioning means" and that just means SNAD waiting to happen.   Either it works 100% like new or it is sold "for parts."

[reallynicestamps]

has told me that they have installed a new operating system, and now wants to return it.

You sold a computer that didn't work and get back one with a new operating system? Go for it!

But if you really never want to see it again.

If so, do I use the "Returned an item after they opened, used, or damaged it"

would be the way to go.

[reallynicestamps]

When I click on the original tracking information, it shows that the package is coming back to me.

And he paid for return shipping?

You're doing well out of this deal.

 You may be out the original shipping, but you get a machine that might even work, since I gather you are more competent in dealing with broken computers.

[bpajwhite]

No, according to what he has told me, he updated the OS to Catalina, but it still crashes all the time.  I won't be getting a fixed computer back.  

Regarding the shipping, it looks like he resealed the package and gave it back to the post office marked "return to sender".  Since it is still using the original tracking number, I don't think he has paid for new shipping.   If so, I'm really surprised the Post Office let him do it, as you cannot refuse delivery of a package that you have already opened. 

I'll wait to see if I get it or not.  If it arrives, I'll also have to check the serial number as suggested and look to see if it's been taken apart. 

[johnrj1226]

@bpajwhite 

Here  is  where you went  wrong you sold the  item as USED should  have been  sold a Parts Only - no such thing  as a Partially working  category.

Used by eBays definition is

"Used: An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections. See all condition definitions.

eBays  definition will trump any thing  written in your condition description

Click on the See all condition definitions link above for more info.

[bpajwhite]

All,  

I thought I'd close this out with an update.  

The seller returned the package to the Post Office and refused to accept it, having it marked return to sender.  (He'd had it for nearly a month when he did this).  When I got it back, all sorts of parts were rattling around inside the computer, leading me to believe that it had been disassembled and not put back together properly.  I don't know, but it is possible that there are missing parts taken from the computer.  I don't have the correct specialty driver bits to disassemble it myself to find out.  The buyer also sent me a message through the eBay system stating that he had installed an upgrade in the computer for me. 

eBay sent me an email saying the the case had been closed out in the buyer's favor and that a refund would be issued.  I called them and told them what was going on.  I was happily surprised to find out that since the buyer had not used the label he was provided to return the computer, he have voided the eBay money back guaranty.   I discovered that returning an item via "Refused - Return to Sender" is specifically not covered by eBay.  They also made plenty of notes about the computer having been tampered with and taken apart, and also that the buyer had admitted to "upgrading" it.

eBay reversed their earlier decision and closed the case out in my favor.  The refund was not issued and they released the hold they had placed on my PayPal account.   

I think I dodged a bullet on this one.  I've learnt that you NEVER sell something on eBay that is not 100% functional (even if you clearly disclose any issues), as it is very easy to get screwed.  In this case it worked out, but it was quite a hassle to deal with.

Thanks for all the suggestions. 

[lacey294]

Hopefully this decision ends up being the final one.  Since he "refused" the package that voids his buyer protection (in this case).  I've seen the buyer fight for their refund and get it in the end.  Ebay plays buyer favorites over facts.  I hope you are done with this creep.  Ebay may have also eaten this one and both you and the buyer may have gotten refunded, I hope not.  The buyer deserves to be out his $$.  If he leaves neg feedback make sure to call CS and have them remove it, as long as the case is in your favor they will.  You may want to report this buyer for abusing returns and MBG.....but make sure to add this person to your blocked buyer list.  

Good going!!

[lacey294]

"I've learnt that you NEVER sell something on eBay that is not 100% functional (even if you clearly disclose any issues), as it is very easy to get screwed."

In electronics, or really anything sold on Ebay, if the buyer is out to scam you it doesn't matter how perfect your item is. If they're dishonest they'll get what they're after. Your buyer just made a couple really stupid mistakes that worked in your favor. Hopefully buyer didn't take parts and return you a paperweight.

[a_c_green]

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@bpajwhite wrote:

All,  

I thought I'd close this out with an update.  

The [buyer] returned the package to the Post Office and refused to accept it, having it marked return to sender.  (He'd had it for nearly a month when he did this).

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Regarding this detail about how it was returned... yes, the USPS will accept a package as Refused even if it was delivered some time ago (although 30 days in this case is definitely pushing it, and I'm surprised that they let this much time go by). It should at least appear to be unopened (assuming such as in this case that the buyer is fibbing about not opening it); genuinely unopened is what is officially expected. I don't know what kind of haggling or pleading the buyer did at his PO, but they did accept it, so the cost of shipping it back is on them, not the buyer (or you).

[edwedw8383]

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@bpajwhite wrote:

I thought I'd close this out with an update.  

The seller returned the package to the Post Office and refused to accept it, having it marked return to sender.

I was happily surprised to find out

that returning an item via "Refused - Return to Sender" is specifically not covered by eBay.

The refund was not issued and they released the hold they had placed on my PayPal account.   

I think I dodged a bullet on this one.

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If your obviously-savvy seller @bpajwhite paid with a credit cardUnlike eBay, credit card issuers live in the real world, and "Refused Delivery" (last on the list above) is a valid method to return goods.

So if your seller files a credit card chargeback for Goods returned Credit not issued, you'll be repaying the entire payment, lose your eBay and PayPal fees, plus pay a $20 chargeback settlement fee.