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What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

Okay, I am keenly aware that it's a seller's prerogative to determine how much they want to charge for shipping, that some do it knowing they are overcharging and will pocket the overage as profit, but it's not against Ebay rules to do this because the seller can claim any amount for materials, labor and transport of the package to the carrier, so basically it's totally the buyer's responsibility to decide whether or not the shipping cost is a deal breaker, before buying/bidding. 

I get that.  So, when I saw that a small lot of pre-owned costume jewelry I'd estimate to weigh no more than 7 or 8 ounces had a shipping charge of $11.75 for "Expedited" Priority, (not only would the low weight make it First Class eligible but her charge is even more than the cost of a Small Flat Rate box into which this lot would easily fit), well I decided to bid anyway because the starting bid was fairly low for the quality of items.  My proxy bid was only a couple bucks more than the starting bid, because the quality was not so great that I'd be willing to pay much more, namely given the shipping cost.  

Well, nobody bid against me so I won for $13.70 plus the $11.75 shipping, and paid in less than 30 seconds from hearing the notification.  That was Thursday afternoon, and the seller didn't mark the package shipped until last night (Sunday) but since Ebay listings no longer show the seller's handling time, I don't know if she shipped as fast as she privately committed to Ebay or not.  I do know it takes only a few minutes to chuck a ziplock of jewelry into a SFR box, lol, but whatever; this isn't a very exciting lot so I'm in no big hurry to receive it.  However I DO like to know where my packages are and what day to watch for deliveries on my porch, so it did irk me a bit to see that the seller had only 'marked' the package sent, no tracking number.  Incidentally, it did say it was shipped Priority, so I guess she had to choose that from a menu or it automatically stated it, given that's the tier she chose when she created the listing.  So I shot her a quick message, just asking if I could have the tracking number.  She didn't directly reply but I see now that she uploaded the tracking number to the Order Details.  

And can you guess the problem I saw when I clicked the number?  --Yup, she shipped First Class, paid around $4 maybe $5.  And only time will tell whether she even packed wisely or if I'll receive a squishy envelope of crushed hardware and loose rhinestones.  But I immediately thought, 'That's it, she's already getting at least a neutral for this.'  But the thing is, she already has one neutral and one neg, out of 13 feedbacks.  --Yes I did see those before I bid, but they are not shipping-related, nor of any concern regarding the lot I was bidding on.   

So clearly this is a new seller who quite possibly is just struggling to understand shipping and ebay policy.  Looking at her current listings, she has bigger lots with lower shipping (stated as 'Standard,' First Class, for $5.25), and lots even smaller than mine with the $11.75 charge.  It's as if she used NO rhyme or reason when making the listings; the overpriced ones aren't even necessarily her 'older' listings, as if she since learned to stop doing that.  And I suspect a couple of her lots will be over a pound and therefore not be eligible for the First Class price she put on them. 

In other words, Girl is on a crash course with an abysmal feedback score soon to ensue if she doesn't get shipping sorted out, so I kind of feel like I should try to help.  But given her lack of (personal) reply when I wrote to ask for the tracking number, I have a sense that she might not take constructive criticism well, especially because I would be asserting my own complaint (of paying about 3X actual shipping for my purchase), in addition to the problematic ones on her horizon. If I explain her problem too succinctly she could take it as curtness, if I explain it at length I might waste a bunch of time only to get no reply (or defensiveness despite my attempt at tenderness).    And ha, in the other extreme I could wind up with a newbie who starts writing to me for advice and information on every conceivable facet of ebay selling.  

So what would you do?  And by the way, I wouldn't have written this big long thing only to get advice on this one seller; she's not the first I've encountered who was irksome in a way that could be just rookie mistakes, and she won't be the last.  So really this is an open invitation to talk about dealing with this issue, in general.  Personal stories totally welcome!  

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?


@fab_finds4u wrote:

I am reasoning Priority Mail is a subset or extention of First Class because USPS says it is , and I quote from the Priority Mail Fact Sheet >About USPS home

Priority Mail items are First Class items  weighing more than 13 ounces.


I couldn't find that exact text in a quick search (feel free to post the full link if you still have it), but I have not seen the USPS calling either one a subset of the other.

 

If anything, First Class Package would be the lesser one, as it's only offered over a limited range (up 13 ounces over the counter or 15.999 ounces on-line) and does not offer insurance. Priority is available over the same weight range and offers up to $50 or $100 indemnity, which might be useful for higher-value shipments.

 

USPS does distinguish between First Class and Priority when it comes to handling speed and routing now. Before the past year or so, there was not much point in buying Priority for a package qualifying for First Class (unless you wanted insurance) as the two methods generally had the same shipping time, but that's no longer the case. I now see a clear and consistent difference when tracking both these days, with Priority getting there first, if only by a day.

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

Go to GOOGLE.  Type in USPS Postal Bulletin 22218 and hit go or enter.  When it gives you the page the link to it should be first in line. Click on it and scroll down the bullet points to "Priority Mail Fact Sheet."   Open that page.  

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

Hey, I also typed Priority Mail Fact Sheet in the Google search bar and got it that way.

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

 


@gurlcat wrote:

They could have found out that your payment didn't cover Priority when label was purchased at the post office.

Even if they didn't use a Flat Rate box, the Priority label would have cost no more than $7-8.  So I definitely paid more than enough for one.  


Maybe- Not much ships priority anymore for 7-8 bucks after the last increase.   Small flat rate box is suddenly 9.45   If it is a new seller, they may be running to the post office and paying retail.     

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

Everybody seems to be assuming this OP is new due to low number of FB when they could be starting a new store (or their 10th) be it under their IP address or a friend or family's and they could be only too familiar with shipping and handling costs and had to close previous accounts due to too many Neu/Neg FB. 

Most long time sellers will take a look at a buyers FB Left For Others. If they don't do it themselves they may have somebody in their team do it and may not always do it but it's not a good look for a buyer to be so picky as to constantly leave neutral and negative FB. And like somebody here said..sellers tend to notice the faults of other sellers. 

Everything I sell can ship through the mail and I've been working with the USPS for over 30 years be it thru online sales or my career prior to online sales. I know beforehand how something I'm selling will ship be it First Class or Priority. Once something has to be shipped by another carrier  - UPS or FedEx or other..I'm lost so I stick with what I know. Since I research my product beforehand I use that knowledge when figuring out the shipping price if I even charge one. If I can absorb the shipping cost even by marking my item up a bit I will do that but if I do charge shipping I ALWAYS offer reduced pricing. I see it this way..they chose to buy my item, from me. I'm grateful for that so I give them great customer service and free or reduced price shipping. 

 

I still will make a mistake with something and when I do I let the customer know what's going on as soon as I can. If I print a label for something to ship by say Tuesday but I can't get it scanned for a day or two or whatever after that I'll message the buyer. I have been very lucky to have had great buyers. I think they know that I care about their order. I just had an order where I received it on Friday, printed the label to ship it (or have it scanned) on Saturday but I couldn't make it to the post office until Monday. I messaged the buyer to let him know and he messaged me back No problem and Thanks for the heads up. I used a Priority letter size envelope; It was a 3-day shipping point; Ship price was $7.95 (give or take) through eBay labels and I charged the Buyer $5.99. During the last couple of Christmas holidays and since 2020 really it's obvious that the post office is understaffed and just burned out as I see it so I try to get something shipped even sooner to allow a day or two in case of their delayed delivery time. That's all I can do. Once I give a package over to a carrier it's out of my control so all I can do is my best. 

 

Be the buyer or seller that you would want to have. In this particular situation I think I would have messaged the seller letting them know that I KNOW the particulars and a good seller should have checked you out as the buyer and seen that you're an experienced seller also and what would they do then? That "good seller" should have offered a bit of a refund but if they didn't I'd make a note of them and not give them my business again.  

Pardon any typos - it's late and I'm tired and still gotta list. 

PS - Gurrrrrlcat - you have some neat stuff in your store - very nice!

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?


@fab_finds4u wrote:

Is a cheaper method always a downgrade? I thought a slower method is a downgrade. PM  is a subset of First Class. They both deliver by 3 days.


No, a cheaper method is not always a downgrade.

 

But in the case of First Class Package vs Priority, First Class Package is a downgrade in price from Priority and does not include the free insurance that Priority offers. 

 

There is also a perception among buyers that it is a downgrade in service, if they have not kept current with published USPS policies. 

 

 

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

Sorry for such a delayed response; I've been very busy and the situation with this seller isn't fully resolved yet, but I WILL update when it's all said and done.  For now, suffice it to say there have been interesting developments.  
One thing, if I wasn't certain she was actually a new seller before, I am now, for a bunch of little reasons, but the gist is this: all the ways she's "lousy" are newbie failures, not the tactics of a scammer on their umpteenth account to keep scamming people.  I know those do exist and I'm certain I've dealt with several, but this chick is definitely no scammer in newbie clothing.  --If that WERE the case, LOL, it would almost have to be some kind of research project to see how many goofy oopsies buyers will put up with, if they believe the seller is new, NOT to make any real money, ha. 
But I just wanted to reply to the main point (I think) you were making about what you do for your buyers, and the insights to be gleaned from buyers who are also sellers.  I could have written 100% of what you said because I'm exactly the same way (even the part about not messing with UPS or FedEx because USPS is what I know, and I know it well; I would only add that UPS is consistently too expensive for what you get, and FedEx simply sucks in too many ways to go into here).  Thing is, I have had so many jobs where the most disgusting coworker is the one who publicly pats themselves on the back for how they always give 110% (eyeroll) as a way to suck up to the boss and also psyche out everyone else, as if it's a competition and the goal is to demoralize others for only giving 109% or something, ha.  But ebay is a whole other animal, because each time our phones make the 'sale' sound, the buyer that triggered it, THAT is our new boss, or one of multiple bosses, for the next X number of days (apparently as many as 130 days, as my last CC chargeback would indicate).   So, here I don't see tooting your own horn about service to buyers as bragging or brown-nosing; I see it as sharing what WORKS, if you want to succeed at this.  
A prime example was the winter 2020 'Ship-nado' crisis, where tons of sellers were having to issue tons of refunds for packages that weren't even permanently lost (just very slow), some putting their stores on vacation until January, some saying they were leaving ebay (of course), all because of problems that they had so much actual control over, if only they looked at it that way, instead of ignoring them and hoping they'd just resolve themselves, pretending they didn't need to treat buyers like people whose money they had, while the buyers had nothing, not watching their tracking on their behalf, not getting concerned if packages were stuck, not filing missing package cases with the carrier, not even writing to the buyer to give the slightest indication that "I haven't forgotten about you."  My buyers seemed so shocked that I bothered to do that, and it was so EASY (just copy-pasting the same little message to each of them, one with more 'warmth' than a corporate-sounding form letter, you know what I mean).  In other words, just a person communicating with another person, which in my opinion is what sets ebay apart, or it should anyway.  I didn't have to issue one penny of refunds, in fact I had buyers feeling sorry for MY frustration to the point that they would write the moment their package finally arrived, to give ME the good news to celebrate (which I did!).  
So, it's more saddening than angering when I buy from a seller who is so opposite of the give-a-hoot that I am, namely if they are a new seller, that I want them to do right not for me, but for themselves, for their OWN success!  When I update the events ensuing after I started this post, I think you'll agree, this seller almost seems like a split personality or maybe someone with substance abuse issues, l guess the simple term is "flaky" ha.  I don't think she's going to make it, unfortunately.  

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Re: What would you do about this new-ish seller's bad practices (and/or similar ones)?

UPDATE
Well here's what ensued.  The lot of jewelry arrived in a taped wad of bubble wrap, or rather a recycled bubble envelope wadded into a ball (no box), with the price showing on the FC label as $7.30, exactly within the $7-$8 estimate I gave for how much the approximate weight of jewelry should cost.    Remember she charged $11.75 for Prioritiy shipping, and she obviously didn't put any money into packing.  I'm FINE with recycling shipping materials, do it all the time myself to save my buyers money, but this was clearly not the case, and because the tangled wad of jewelry was vulnerable to crushing, a necklace was broken and some loose stones from another piece flew out of the wad as I cut it open.  

I wrote to her, reported the damages and asked if she would just refund the extra I paid for Priority.  She replied immediately, like within 5 minutes, apologized profusely and offered to refund me a whole $10 for the shipping overcharge AND damages.  This was very encouraging, and I couldn't wait to report here about how the advice to write the seller and seek resolution was correct, rather than just negging her.  I replied:

I feel I got enough of a deal on the pieces I was most interested in. How about an even $5, but then take a look at your listings; I see several lots that are about the same size as this one but also have the $11.75 shipping charge, and say Priority. If you revise them to First Class you will definitely sell them faster and avoid any problems if you do ship them F.C. (there are buyers out there who would be furious and just automatically neg you for shipping at a lower tier than advertised, and it's an actual ebay policy violation).
 

Again she replied very quickly, saying she would look at her listings but said she doesn't "set" the shipping price, because "it is calculated".  So yeah I thought, 'well then how did it calculate this one I bought so incorrectly?'  Anyway her final sentence was "I'll send your refund tomorrow" (and I thought, 'why not send it now?  It's only $5).  

Welp, that was Jan 29.  "Tomorrow" came and went, no refund.  On the night of 31st I sent a message just saying "Did you forget my refund?"  No reply.  And I know she wasn't in the hospital or anything, because I also sent a question about another lot she had for sale, which I didn't even realize was the same seller handle until later, and apparently she didn't realize I was the same buyer either, ha because she quickly answered THAT .....but no reply to the 'refund' one.  Yesterday (the 3rd) I wrote a message explaining how this isn't even about $5, $10, or whatever, but how I want her to succeed and that isn't going to happen if she doesn't do what she says she will and ignores messages, etc.  Today I wake up, no reply, no refund, and I go to her items for sale, see that not only did she not revise any of the existing listings' shipping, she had started bunches of new listings with small lightweight lots for $11.75 (Priority).  The crazy thing is, she also has some listings with $5.25 FC shipping for lots that I know are heavier than the $11.75 ones, in fact I suspect a couple of these will weigh over a pound and REQUIRE Priority.  There's no way she's using calculated shipping, unless she is purely guessing weights, and very badly.   

So that's that, I finally gave her the neg, and comment explaining why. 

The sad thing is, it looks like she has stumbled into some pretty nice vintage/antique inventory, but her (now) 88.9% feedback and the 3 unflattering comments (2 negs, 1 neutral) out of only 20 sales are going to lose her a lot of prospective bidders, and therefore fetch her low winning bids or no bids, on quality items.  


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