Someone got busted for the return scam we hear so much about!

[glasser]

This guy did exactly what happens on eBay.  Bought things initiated a return and the returned another item of far lesser value

Inside the Amazon return scam that netted $300K in rare guitars, fancy toilets and high-end home ent...

[chapeau-noir]

It was the fancy toilets that did him in.  He could have stopped at expensive electronics, musical instruments, maybe high-end designer accessories, but noooooo...he had to reach for that gold ring...he had to try fancy toilets.

[glasser]

Ut's true @mr_lincoln there are thresholds for LE involvement in this kind of case and also clout like Amazon probably has ex-FBI on staff that maintain connections with the "home" office.

[dbfolks166mt]

     This does not happen as often as it should and there are a number of reasons for that. First you are talking about a law enforcement and legal system within the US that is both constrained with regards to resources and also moves rather slowly. The speed factor is often by design to build and solidify a case to make sure there is a high degree of success with the prosecution. While an initial report to LE for a $300 item may not attract much attention LE will look for repeated reporting or pattern repetition amongst the reports they receive. Emphasis being placed on the reports they receive. If nobody reports then there is little for LE to build a case on. 

     Two important differences between the Amazon case and the eBay case eunster1313 mentioned. With the Amazon case it was Amazon's fraud department that collaborated with LE in building the case probably through an analysis of seller complaints and buyer activity. I have found Amazon to have a bit better balance between it's buyer and seller protections than eBay who is traditionally tilted heavily towards buyer protection. 

     Ironically with the eBay case it was the investigative work by the postal service in response to numerous reports they received. Nowhere is there any mention of any assistance from eBay and I highly doubt there was any openly offered without LE pressuring eBay for the information. EBay is more focused on shutting down and restricting sellers than they are in looking at fraudulent buyer activity and will openly admit in a he said, she said case the buyer's word always takes priority. 

     Internal fraud departments within a company have a direct impact to a companies bottom line. They are an operating expense that generates no measurable revenue and are often a tough sell to shareholders other than the positive light the place on protecting a companies reputation. It's a tough balancing act but one a lot of companies have in place. Even Google has a scam reporting site to report abuse of gmail accounts being used in scamming attempts. I have used it several times to have gmail accounts terminated. EBay to the best of my knowledge has no fraud department and their security center simply points you to other LE reporting sites where you can report issues. They simply pass the buck. 

     Bottom line is if nobody ever reports fraud to the available LE sites there is 0 possibility that the perpetrators will ever be caught. 

[mr_lincoln]

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

It was the fancy toilets that did him in.  He could have stopped at expensive electronics, musical instruments, maybe high-end designer accessories, but noooooo...he had to reach for that gold ring...he had to try fancy toilets.

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@chapeau-noir   What amazed me was he STILL HAD THE STUFF (or at least most of it) including the toilets right?!?  Do you think he was planning a big yard sale?

[chapeau-noir]

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@mr_lincoln wrote:

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

It was the fancy toilets that did him in.  He could have stopped at expensive electronics, musical instruments, maybe high-end designer accessories, but noooooo...he had to reach for that gold ring...he had to try fancy toilets.

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@chapeau-noir   What amazed me was he STILL HAD THE STUFF (or at least most of it) including the toilets right?!?  Do you think he was planning a big yard sale?

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I know!  And of any of that stuff, the fancy toilets would be absolutely the easiest to get rid of on Craigslist for a nice profit - I mean people would be beating down his door for one of those toilets (with or without bidet) for a decent price.  This I know, because I just paid to have both my bathrooms renovated and OMG, those Toto toilets are not cheap (and we didn't even get bidets).  I sure wouldn't have asked questions.

[justafemster]

And each of those 3rd party sellers he ripped off will never see their products or their money.  The confiscated goods will be sold at police auctions and the money used for whatever law enforcement deems it to be used for.

And amzn kept the fees on each and every sale, because that's amzn's policy, well, it is for CC chargebacks.  SIGH.

[ittybitnot]

@eunster1313 

The people in your link got "probation" and have to pay back $$$$ at $200 a month. 

[dbfolks166mt]

     This is almost sad. At $200 a month that give them just over 26 years to finish the paybacks. 

https://digitaledition.orlandosentinel.com/tribune/article_popover.aspx?guid=f7e1bd2b-a322-4f4d-bcbc... 

[dbfolks166mt]

Actually according to the court records they will get their money back. .

[glasser]

I don't believe eBay doesn't have a fraud unit. trust and safety have been elements of eBay since day one. Many of eBay's buying and selling rules are based on fraud prevention.

However, given the distributed nature of buying and selling on eBay and the volume of sales, it's likely the can't keep up.

There doesn't appear to be an easy way to alert eBay to fraud other than contacting CS (you can report a listing from the listing page) to seek resolution to your specific instance this creates a barrier to reporting and therefore an incomplete picture of the extent of fraud on the site.

I suspect, no evidence idle speculation here, that eBay has become like the banks. They can live with a certain degree of fraud either covering themselves or letting a buyer of seller shoulder the burden. It's cheaper then totally eliminating it both in people hours and the complexity of the systems needed.

[retro_entertainment_collectibles]

I've said it before, eBay needs to display some buyer metrics to vendors and then some.

Feedback is fine but it doesn't show a fast metric for buyers or sellers.  Buyers should see how many sales total a vendor has had, how many transactions without issue and how many with.  Same for sellers so a vendor can see if a person has filed numerous returns, chargebacks, disputes etc.  This adds an additional layer of prevention as vendors can reserve the right to do business, that simple.

There should also be something for new buyers, a purchase limit until such a time as they have completed some watermark just as is done for sellers.  

[pauls-parts]

What "Fraud " unit?  Does not exist on eBay. Only in what they tell sellers.

[skatefool]

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

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@mr_lincoln wrote:

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@chapeau-noir wrote:

It was the fancy toilets that did him in.  He could have stopped at expensive electronics, musical instruments, maybe high-end designer accessories, but noooooo...he had to reach for that gold ring...he had to try fancy toilets.

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@chapeau-noir   What amazed me was he STILL HAD THE STUFF (or at least most of it) including the toilets right?!?  Do you think he was planning a big yard sale?

---

I know!  And of any of that stuff, the fancy toilets would be absolutely the easiest to get rid of on Craigslist for a nice profit - I mean people would be beating down his door for one of those toilets (with or without bidet) for a decent price.  This I know, because I just paid to have both my bathrooms renovated and OMG, those Toto toilets are not cheap (and we didn't even get bidets).  I sure wouldn't have asked questions.

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Maybe he had a short list of building contractors that were his usual customers.  😳