eBay

manana_cookiekiller · ‎02-19-2020

Hi,

This scam had been around for a long time, it was originated from the Chinese version of ebay called TAOBAO, I guess some buyers in the states are picking it up also .

Basically what they do, is:

1) buy something from you, make fast payment to lower your guard;

2) once they receive the package, they will request a return under " defect/does not match seller description" category, and take it to the ebay customer service no matter what you do/ask unless you refund immediately ---- By ebay policy, the seller will have to accept the return and pay for the return shipping fee;

3) they will keep the item, and return some cheap item of no value back to you --- the scam buyer gets to keep your item as well as a full refund . You the seller loose out on the item, have to pay out of pockets for the shipping fees on both trips.

4) if they know you have proof of what you sent out after taking it to the ebay customer service, they will then purposely break the item before sending it back and claim that's how it was delivered -- seller has to issue full refund ,loose out on shipping fees on both ways, scam buyer looses nothing.

It will then be up to the seller to prove what the scammer mailed back to you is NOT what you sold , and mailed to the scammer buyer. From what I have gathered, only successful cases of proving that is only if you have a continuous video showing the whole process of:

1)you showing the item in the condition mentioned in your listing;

2)you then pack it in front of a us postal service member and send it to the delivery service;

3)the delivery service take that package from you and put in their truck

All those plus when the seller receive the returned item:

4)you receiving the returned package while the mail man hand it to you ( to prove you didn't open the package and put other things inside)

5)you unpack the package and found out it's not the item , or item not in the condition you sent out .

So it will be nearly impossible for the case to be judged in favor of the seller. PS , pictures are not enough to be used as proof.

This is a very low risk scam, even if you have proof of the returned item being different from what you shipped, the scammers can easily argue "o, sorry I had so and so pack and ship it for me, he/she/it must have mixed it up with something else blablabla"

This scam had been circulating around in China for a long time from what I have read. I guess it had finally found it's way to Ebay and hit my little store this past week. Which is really a shame....

These scammers usually target the larger sellers as they are more likely to issue refund without asking questions. But once in a while individual sellers like me would be the victim also, as they know most small sellers don't have the time or the means to fight the case in ebay court .

I had been buying and selling stuff on ebay since 2003, never ran into a scammer till now. Guess I was too naive.... Hopefully my experience would help other small sellers avoid scammers like the one I encountered.

For now though, I think I will try to sell the more valuable things on facebook market place /craigslist etc to avoid being scammed again (hopefully). Have to say I lost quite a bit of faith today....

corvettestainless · ‎02-19-2020

This scam of getting stuff for free via mail order has been going on here in the states for 30+ years, and was made easy here on ebay when they implemented 'not as described' forced returns 10+ years ago.

There is no 'proving' what you received and there is no way to prove that you didn't send that 'rag' 'brick' or 'empty box' in the first place, and there is NO one that wants to entertain hearing it.

This is all very common; selling phones, computers & high end video games are the biggest threats.

divwido · ‎02-19-2020

lose=-something lost

loose+=baggy pants, a failed noose

Good Moms let you lick the Beaters.

Great Moms turn them off first.

luxgoods · ‎02-19-2020

This is the reason I will not sell high value items on Ebay. This platform has become a huge hunting ground for scammers. I have been burned twice by scammers when I sold a higher value item. Ebay talks about "seller Protection" which really does not exist. Ebay has created this scammer paradise and really has done nothing to change things. Like you, I would rather look elsewhere to sell my more expensive items.

kensgiftshop · ‎02-19-2020

@manana_cookiekiller wrote:
From what I have gathered, only successful cases of proving that is only if you have a continuous video showing the whole process of:

The only thing a video will prove is you can take a video.

As far as proof, videos can be faked to easy and they won't even look at them.

Have a great day.

shepar58 · ‎02-19-2020

Right! They dont even return the item and get a refund! Ebay promotes the theft and their is nothing we can do about it! I have had several where my item was not returned but still had to give a refund. If not Ebay, then PayPal or chargeback. So sick of the thieves here on Ebay. Been selling on another platform and am getting almost as many sales at 1/3 of the fees I pay here. In the 6 months O have sold there I have not had one false return or out right theft. Have been winding my items down here. Hope to be off here when my store subscription expires Oct! Ebay needs to stop promoting the theft from sellers!

manana_cookiekiller · ‎02-19-2020

Hi Lux,

I can feel your frustration first hand.

Now to think about it, one thing that was kinda suspicious , was that she bought multiple items from me,both of them ended on the same day with only a few hours apart. In the descriptions I mentioned I offer combined shipping, but she made 2 separate payments immediately after each auction ended . I thought that was kinda odd. Since I didn't know how to adjust total and refund after the seller had paid( you can do that through PayPal btw, I have learned.), so I sent her a message that I would be packing her gift(a piece of Turkish blue lace agate jewelry ) to compensate the shipping fees she over paid on Saturday, she never replied to the message and the package went out on Monday .

Real/legit buyers would most likely have sent me a message asking for combined shipping before making payment; or tell me they prefer money over the free gift; or say something about the gift. But the buyer was totally quite until suddenly opening a "return because defective" case.

I did put that scammer buyer on the block list, and I had filed a report on the buyer ( not sure if it helps anything but I'd like to think it does. )

Scammers are getting smarter ,I wasn't suspicious of this buyer at all at first. I mean, how can you tell when it's someone that had accumulated good reviews in the past 20 years from buying like a million $1 items , and only does the scamming thing once in a while on valuable things? I fell for it but I hope

other sellers could learn from my case and protect themselves with video evidence.

Again it has to be continuous video evidence - meaning no editing, no cut out etc(Basically what a brick and mortar store needs as evidence to convict a shoplifter . ) pictures will not be considered evidence in the ebay escalation center.

manana_cookiekiller · ‎02-19-2020

That's why you have to take the video with the usps worker present in the video, both for when you pack and send it out, and when you receive the returned package.

manana_cookiekiller · ‎02-19-2020

hi, do you mind sharing the name of that new platform with me please ? Thank you so much !

manana_cookiekiller · ‎02-19-2020

hi dressup,

I had been selling random stuff on ebay since early 2000s and this is the first time I ran into such a scam. Have to admit, I was way too careless and naive for putting expensive jewelries on ebay before doing some research first. I do regret that .... aloooooooot. Not to mention the scammer's messages when she demanded the full refund was infuriating.

If you have experience in dealing with those scammers, I'm all ears! I just wish there was something I could do to protect my auctions in the future, it would be great if you could share some tips, thank you so much !

corvettestainless · ‎02-19-2020

Curious before I answer, I only see 4 sales, none of which were 'expensive' enough to typically be scammed. Is this from another account?

tdumonde2014 · ‎02-19-2020

Sorry you were scammed, but you really need a separate account for buying. You are leaving yourself open for retaliation from a seller that you left a Negative for.

"Those who enter the arena unarmed or unprepared are quickly dispatched."

kensgiftshop · ‎02-19-2020

@manana_cookiekiller wrote:
That's why you have to take the video with the usps worker present in the video, both for when you pack and send it out, and when you receive the returned package.

It doesn't matter who you have in the video, they won't take it as any proof.

Have a great day.