eBay

kakorsm · ‎05-12-2020

I just had a harrowing few hours because I tried to issue a refund to a buyer and couldn't! I had to contact Paypal and Ebay customer service to get it straightened out and I'm appalled at what's going on here.

So I tried to do the cancellation and refund automatically through Ebay like I always do, no issues. I find out later "refund failed," no explanation. I tried to issue the refund through PayPal to see if that would work, it said I had to add money to my wallet rather than use my bank balance (which I do for everything, no issue). I contacted Paypal support and they said Ebay had recently changed something so that you can't issue refunds through them using bank accounts, because of a scam issue. That made sense, so I tried to contact Ebay customer support chat to confirm if this was true. I got a very unhelpful and hard to understand response, which included this:

"Well just want to inform you that we are not tied with PayPal and we do not chacnge policies for the refund process, and actually we do not have any access on your payment we are just market place but for payments and refunds, it will be PayPal who will handle this concerns as you can see on Ebay site that the cancelation was done but for the refunds, it will be PayPal."

That seemed to say the exact opposite, and that it was PayPal's responsibility to issue the refund, though would not say what PayPal said wasn't true. So I contacted PayPal support again to figure out what was going on.

PayPal was AMAZING! They gave me a clear answer:

"In November, eBay changed the how sales tax was collected on sales. Previously they would charge the buyer through a separate transaction which led to a lot of confusion for buyers. They then changed it, to where the sales tax comes through with the payment to the seller, then they pull the amount of sales tax collected. When this change was made it caused the change with how a refund can be issued to balance only."

Why, I ask, will Ebay not say this, or anything even close to this, if only to inform me what I need to do and what I need to do in the future???

Anyway, the problem here is that it takes 3-5 business days to transfer money from your bank account to your Paypal wallet. This is just barely if not outside Ebay's window to issue a refund to a buyer (and I probably already lost a couple days not realizing my refund had failed). So unless you happen to have money in your Paypal balance at all times - who does? - or basically at the right time to issue the refund, you're screwed. I told Paypal about this issue, and they very helpfully issued a temporary credit so that I could refund the buyer (and they would take back the money out of my account in a week's time). Then the wonderful associate took the time to answer a few more questions I had, including if it was possible to "keep" money in my PayPal wallet for Ebay refunds, since this is apparently going to be a thing. Unfortunately it's not, because if you have any sort of recurring payment set up (like a subscription), it will use your Paypal balance first, then bank, and you can't change that. So I guess Paypal is a bit at fault there, but that at least makes sense. You can, however, go in and set your preferred payment method to bank first, balance second, so there's a better chance of having the money available if you need to issue a refund, so I did that.

This is a big problem, though, Ebay! Sellers basically just have to hope they happen to have enough money in their PayPal balance to cover the refund, within the 5 day timeframe they have to issue it. There's no way to "insure," or keep some money for that purpose. I don't understand the intricacies of the taxes that made this change apparently necessary for Ebay, but something needs to change. The obvious thing would be to extend the refund window to acomodate the time it takes to go into Paypal and transfer money from your bank. I don't see any other way of reliably getting money into your Wallet, except to ask a friend to send you the money, but I don't think that's always instantly available either, although in my experience it is - that's kind of annoying you can get money transferred to you instantly but you have to wait a few days to get your OWN money from the bank - and who wants to do that every time? It's completely unacceptable the way it is currently. I as a seller want to do the right thing, but am physically prevented from doing it. That's not right. Thoughts, everyone? Way to make Ebay take notice?

thevintagesilvershop · ‎05-20-2020

OP, as others have said, this is not new, it started late last year. I, too, always sweep PP funds to my business bank account, and in the past, if I had a refund, I'd initiate it and Paypal would suck the funds from my bank account. Easy peasy and worked with my accounting process well.

I had a refund late last year and had your same problem with no notice at all. And with Ebay and PP pointing fingers at one another. So, I still continue to sweep my PP account to -0- and when I have the rare refund, as soon as I get notice that the buyer shipped it, I transfer money to cover the refund back to PP. Causes me more of an accounting issue, but since refunds are rare, it's workable for me. And usually, the transfer gets to my PP account well before the return is in my hands.

mam98031 · ‎05-20-2020

@cynthealee2 wrote:
@kakorsm wrote:
I would have to go through every single thing I have a subscription to or a recurring payment on, figure out when it would be taken out (sometimes they're not at regular dates) and make sure I have enough money at that time to cover that AND add more money on the off chance I have to refund for a buyer-requested cancellation or a lost package. That's ridiculous.
OR
You could and SHOULD have had separate PayPal accounts ... One for Business and one for personal.

I do this, but not with my PP account. I use it on my CC that I get cash back bonuses. Then I pay it off each month. I like earning those bonuses and I save them all year long as part of my little Christmas fund. Most everything goes on my CC. Even groceries. But I am disciplined to make sure I pay it off each month. If I am in a tight spot for one reason or another. I have other cards I will use with a low interest rate to carry a balance on, but I of course steer clear of those if at all possible.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

kakorsm · ‎05-21-2020

Also I believe postage fees come out of your PP wallet if there's money in it? Does anyone know for sure or if you can change that? PP is the only option available when I do it, doesn't say if it takes it from wallet first, but luckily it will draw from bank if necessary.

kakorsm · ‎05-21-2020

That's not the issue or amount of money I'd need, though. If I could just "keep" about $20 in my wallet at all times I would. The problem is the way PP is set up, they take from your wallet first for any "recurring payments" like subscriptions, apps you pay monthly for, etc. and there's no way to tell it not to. So say I added $20. That would be gone the day I'm charged for a hypothetical premium app subscription, and I'd have to add more. And even if I put in enough money to cover those things AND have extra for refunds if necessary, it would just take it out the next month. With the subscriptions I have, I'd have to perpetually add about $100.

To be fair, THAT issue is with PP. I don't see why they need to take money from your wallet rather than bank connection. The MAIN issue is that, ONLY on Ebay refund transactions, you are not able to use your bank connection. It may be an issue "using" PP but there is no other restriction on this for any other payment, it's only with Ebay refunds. Regardless of who "made" this happen, it's an issue with Ebay transactions, Ebay should fix it. Or at least inform us first.

astrobasecadet · ‎05-21-2020

I keep my account empty from the stories of PayPal randomly closing, locking, or stealing from accounts. Refunding customers is super annoying because I have to put money back in and must frustrate customers because it takes days to get a refund.

mam98031 · ‎05-21-2020

@kakorsm wrote:
That's not the issue or amount of money I'd need, though. If I could just "keep" about $20 in my wallet at all times I would. The problem is the way PP is set up, they take from your wallet first for any "recurring payments" like subscriptions, apps you pay monthly for, etc. and there's no way to tell it not to. So say I added $20. That would be gone the day I'm charged for a hypothetical premium app subscription, and I'd have to add more. And even if I put in enough money to cover those things AND have extra for refunds if necessary, it would just take it out the next month. With the subscriptions I have, I'd have to perpetually add about $100.

To be fair, THAT issue is with PP. I don't see why they need to take money from your wallet rather than bank connection. The MAIN issue is that, ONLY on Ebay refund transactions, you are not able to use your bank connection. It may be an issue "using" PP but there is no other restriction on this for any other payment, it's only with Ebay refunds. Regardless of who "made" this happen, it's an issue with Ebay transactions, Ebay should fix it. Or at least inform us first.

PP only takes "recurring payments" from the funds in your PP account IF YOU have those payments with whatever vendor it may be set up to pull from your PP account. If you don't want the payment coming from you PP account, then go to your account for those vendors and change your payment method to another one that they accept, like a CC.

The reason they pull from your wallet is because you set up your payment with the other vendor to pull from your wallet. You have control of this and can change it any time you choose.

Ebay refunds will ALWAYS pull from your PP wallet first. When a buyer is refunded in Ebay for whatever reason the refund is happening, it ALWAYS refunds from the source used to fund the payment originally. There are no exceptions to that.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

mam98031 · ‎05-21-2020

@astrobasecadet wrote:
I keep my account empty from the stories of PayPal randomly closing, locking, or stealing from accounts. Refunding customers is super annoying because I have to put money back in and must frustrate customers because it takes days to get a refund.

Those are rare cases and usually much more to the story than is often shared publicly by the person that had their account locked.

I've been with Ebay for 20+ years. I have used PP since the beginning. I ALWAYS keep a balance in PP that will at a minimum cover a couple of refunds just in case something comes up. I never zero out my PP account. It has never presented an issue for me in all these years. And my buyers are always taken care of quickly and efficiently.

@astrobasecadet

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999