cancel
Showing results for 
Show  only  | Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

I need some advice. I'm wondering if I just got hit with a scam and if I'm gonna lose my money after sending the product via FedEx Shipping on Ebay. 

I sold a video card for around $1,000. Printed a FedEx label using Ebay's shipping and I made sure signature was required since the purchase was over $750 and I wanted to make sure I would be covered by seller protection. 

Now here's what happened that has suddenly made me concerned. I tracked the package which was sent to Florida and I find out it was redirected to New Jersey (?) and delivered there. 

I called FedEx to find out why the package was redirected because I did not authorize this and I did not see any options to prevent this. FedEx said the recipient's party called and they were able to redirect the shipment and paid for the shipping changes with their account. FedEx would not provide me with the delivery address or the account used to pay for the redirecting of the shipment, they said that information was private (?). 

Any thoughts or help would be appreciated. Since the package was delivered today I'm concerned that I will be dealing with some sort of chargeback through paypal or ebay in the near future.

 

Message 1 of 82
latest reply
81 REPLIES 81

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

When I see the word “damage”, I think “claim” as in a claim for loss or damage of the shipment. When I see the word “scam”, I think “illicit or illegal activity” as in a civil or criminal charge of fraud and its ilk.

In terms of the former, domestic carriers each have their own network and delivery strategy (air/ground transportation) and, when it comes to legal matters, the question is not whether it is UPS or FedEx but, rather, in which capacity UPS or FedEx is acting since there is a difference between a claim for damage against a motor carrier (ground transport) and a claim for damage against an air carrier (air transport). As a general principal, ground carriers are registered with and subject to a regulatory framework comprised of Federal Statutes and Federal Regulations, which have been in force in some form or another since the 1930s, the basic essence of which is to make them liable for damage unless there is a VALID limit of liability contained in the carrier's tariff or in an individual contract, which carriers are not generally able to avoid by “rule, contract or otherwise” (emphasis added). In contrast, domestic air transport has basically been deregulated since the 1970s meaning that, while they do have liability for damage (under principles of common law), they can more easily limit their liability within their tariffs or contracts and also establish short time frames for filing claims.

Moreover, perusal of the UPS and FedEx websites shows they offer various other services, such as ocean freight for example. Such other services are governed by yet another layer of international treaties, laws and the particular carrier’s own T&Cs. In other words, to determine the rights and obligations of UPS or FedEx with respect to you, the seller/shipper customer, it is not enough to say "it's UPS" or "it's FedEx." Rather, it’s important to know the differences within the FedEx and UPS corporate structures as it is to know the differences between FedEx and UPS. (Note: General information for educational purposes only. If you would like more information or require legal advice, if any, please contact your lawyer about your particular factual and legal circumstances).

When it comes to the latter – i.e., suspected fraud generally, a matter for the local police and reportable also to the FTC (and FBI) when it involves suspected internet-facilitated fraud (identity theft, mail and wire fraud, etc.): https://www.justice.gov/criminal-fraud/identity-theft/identity-theft-and-identity-fraud , https://www.ic3.gov/default.aspx . A serious matter, and so, too, is the punishment for criminals who are convicted of identity theft / hacking / wire fraud: see, https://www.fbi.gov/contact-us/field-offices/washingtondc/news/press-releases/man-pleads-guilty-in-e... , https://www.wklaw.com/the-serious-federal-consequences-of-computer-hacking/ .

Meantime, and regarding FedEx “Delivery Manager”, note the emphasis: “II. … Recipient represents and warrants that Recipient is AUTHORIZED BY the SHIPPER to use or request the FedEx Delivery Manager … “ . In other words, requires seller/shipper consent, and acknowledged. In the event recipient lies about it, I do wish FedEx all the best in pursuing its claim against and collecting upon that warranty from the recipient (as they say, a warranty is only as good as the one who issues it).

May justice prevail!
Message 61 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

So many f***ing loopholes in the PP and Ebay system.   Glad I am done with it.

Message 62 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Unless organized enough, and becomes a major issue with scenarios like Eastern European scammer gangs using stolen credit card numbers to set up FedEx Delivery Manager (FDM) accounts and redirect online purchases to reshippers for delivery overseas, or someone in LE gets a wild hair (election time?), in general I doubt anything would happen.

Relatively certain FedEx would go all Sgt Schultz (nod to bubbleman) with "We see nothink", and at best would shut down repeat offender FDM accounts, but that wouldn't prevent damage to an eBay seller by a one time buyer working the scam. It remains to be seen if it will be an actual issue. Just because it's a possible scam tool doesn't mean it will be used enough as such to cause an issue, other than the localized effect on the one eBay seller who loses $1500 - from his perspective the sky has fallen.

Message 63 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

The “Sgt. Shultz” defense – thank you for the laugh!

And we should all take a moment, sit back and laugh at everything that could and did go wrong in what used to be the unregulated, hands-off “wild west” approach to the Internet because those days are not only decidedly over, but in fact activities conducted online were always for the most part subject to existing laws and regulations many of which have since been amended (updated) to better apply, with new ones enacted to deal with problems (and opportunities) as they arise. To be certain, there are always risks when transacting business and, without the face-to-face experience, even more so online. That said, it is the case today in some places that consumers arguably have more rights online than they would if shopping in person at a retail store – Britain mainly, but some other places as well, presumably because overseas regulators are trying to foster and encourage online retail growth in their own nations which, in the US alone, now accounts for around 10% of total retail sales and some $200 billion in revenue. With all this growth, it’s only “natural” for couriers to try and make their own lives easier, I suppose. But this in no way affects their responsibilities—convenience is not an excuse. Taking the case of “FedEx Delivery Manager” as an express example, if that is what happened here (we don’t know exactly, but some good detective work) it arguably doesn’t change the contract of carriage they have with the shipper/seller (i.e., doesn’t suddenly become a contract of carriage with the recipient/buyer – thankfully, that’s just not how it works!). Again, we do not know exactly what happened, according to the OP FedEx isn’t being particularly clear here, but now that the file is an open investigation, trust that the OP will have answers soon, along with a fair and proper resolution. (And in the unlikely event PayPal’s Seller protection for some reason doesn’t apply, then OP arguably has other avenues).

The eBay/PayPal programs are supposed to be and provide an extra layer of security and protection for buyers and sellers alike, reducing fear (and all the so-called ‘loopholes’ that buyers/sellers/shippers would otherwise have to navigate on their own, a land mine for sure). These programs supposedly act as a form of fraud insurance and, just like other forms of insurance, it’s not “free” but paid for. Accordingly, and similar to what’s happening across the Pond in Britain with the Royal Mail (see, previously linked article), it would truly reduce trepidation and fear when dealing with i.e. shipping issues if PayPal were a little less ambiguous, spelling out its terms in clear and concise language using plain English.

As to going after and prosecuting “scammers,” also a good point and this was certainly true in past -- it being a question not of law, but of enforcement. This is because internet-facilitated crime is a relatively new phenomenon in the scheme of things, so very true, and many departments simply had little in the way of resources or any particular training to even properly identify much less investigate these crimes. But the landscape is changing.

Meantime, and in the end, who ultimately pays for all of this? Why, insurers and underwriters (meaning, the cost of everything goes up such that WE, each and all of us, do!).
Message 64 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

I got some good news this morning. Paypal closed the case and covered the loss:

 

Dear xxxxxx,

As you know, one of your buyers opened a case with their financial institution.

We're happy to confirm that this transaction was covered under Seller Protection as you met the PayPal Seller Protection requirements. The disputed amount is now available in your PayPal balance.

Here are the case details:

Buyer's name: xxxxxx
Buyer's email: xxxxxx
Buyer's transaction ID: xxxxxx
Your transaction ID:xxxxxx
Transaction date: February 28, 2018
Transaction amount: $1,069.65 USD
Disputed amount:$1,069.65 USD
There is no further action required from you. We'll let you know if we need any further information.

Thank you for your patience during this process. We appreciate your business.

You can find additional information and tips about buying and selling safely on our Business Resource Center. After you log in to your PayPal account, click Tools, and then click Business Resource Center under "Grow your business."

Sincerely,

PayPal

Message 65 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

CONGRADULATIONS!!!!!!

Member of the Grumpy Old Man crew
Message 66 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Great news! Thanks for posting an update @powertell

Message 67 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Congratulations.

Let's hope PP goes after Fedex for reimbursement as the shipper never gave permission for the recipient to redirect.

"If a product doesn't sell, raise the price" - Reese Palley
"If it sold FAST, it was priced too low" - also Reese Palley
Message 68 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Yay!  So glad to hear it! Thanks for letting us all know.  relieved

Message 69 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?


@lookng2015wrote:
Congratulations.

Let's hope PP goes after Fedex for reimbursement as the shipper never gave permission for the recipient to redirect.

Let's hope PP goes after ebay for allowing this loophole in their 'negotiations' with fed ex.

 

_____________________________
"Nothing is obvious to the oblivious"
Message 70 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?


@d-k_treasureswrote:
Let's hope PP goes after ebay for allowing this loophole in their 'negotiations' with fed ex.

I don't understand your comment. The issue was with PayPal, not eBay. There was no loophole because the OP was covered under PayPal's Seller Protection.

Message 71 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?


@lovtaco0wrote:

@d-k_treasureswrote:
Let's hope PP goes after ebay for allowing this loophole in their 'negotiations' with fed ex.

I don't understand your comment. The issue was with PayPal, not eBay. There was no loophole because the OP was covered under PayPal's Seller Protection.


The OP can't do anything with Fed Ex because it's ebay's account number. Ebay should have 'no redirect' in their contract. What happens if when the new payment processor doesn't cover UA's the same way as PP does?

 

Anyone using Fed Ex here should have their own Fed Ex account linked so that there is some control.

 

_____________________________
"Nothing is obvious to the oblivious"
Message 72 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Yep, yep and yep.

"If a product doesn't sell, raise the price" - Reese Palley
"If it sold FAST, it was priced too low" - also Reese Palley
Message 73 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Thanks for providing more information. I didn't realize you were referring to the FedEx account being eBay's.

Message 74 of 82
latest reply

Re: Possible INR coming my way -- FedEx redirect Scam?

Yay. I love it when the good guys win! Will the same outcome be possible when the new PayPal UA goes into effect May 25. I wonder...

Message 75 of 82
latest reply