Is this a violation?

[richard1rst]

eBay’s policy on outside sales states “Using member contact information obtained from eBay or using any eBay system to offer to sell ANY LISTED ITEM outside of eBay”

If someone who bought from you before asks if you have a spare part available, one that you DO NOT and NEVER HAD listed on eBay, and in an effort to accommodate a previous buyer, you offer it to them by sending an invoice through Paypal. Is that a violation? And if it is then how should it be handled? (The Send an Offer button was not present)

Remember, this is a $6.00 spare part I just happen to have available and I DO NOT HAVE IT LISTED on eBay.

[sockmonkeydave]

@webwanna

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No do not do this, ebay will see the wild swing in price and assume it is a hacked account.

And your money will be on a 21 day hold.

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That's interesting.  I've done this many times and never had any issues.  Have they done that to you?

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Yes a few years back, at a time when I did not have any PP money holds.

A guy ask a question about an item, I knew that it would take some time for me to find the answer.

I jacked the price so it would not sell out from under him.

It was BO and I sold it to him for the normal price.

PP put my funds on a 21 day hold, so I called them to ask why.

They said a bot had seen the price changes and flagged it, and then they said.

"No human can override a bot, the bots have final word"

[a_c_green]

PP put my funds on a 21 day hold, so I called them to ask why.

They said a bot had seen the price changes and flagged it, and then they said, "No human can override a bot; the bots have final word."

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See "The Technological Singularity" 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity

Wait, what am I laughing at...?

[city*satins]

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@missjen831wrote:

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Sellers might want to consider what "intermediated payments' might eventually mean if Paypal becomes supplanted, along with the easy access to contact information (email address) it provides.  That particular window for sellers and buyers who start on eBay and want to continue a business relationship elsewhere, could ultimately slam shut.

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Were that to become the case, I would simply print up business cards to drop in the package. Many sellers I buy from are doing this already.

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I would too. But I believe that is against policy, however it is completely unenforceable soooo....

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Not sure that there is a policy against this but if there is, you're right, its unenforceable.  After all, eBay won't entertain buyer complaints that their package contained extraneous material like religious or political brochures or that pages from Uncle Spunky Magazine were crumpled and used as packing material.  Even a complaint of cockroaches and left-over used litter in an automated litterbox will move eBay.  

But by gum don't dare ask an customer for their email address  for sending the quarterly catalog they specifically signed up for 8 years ago and have been receiving regularly  but the last one bounced back.

[cjs_estatesales]

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@d-k_treasureswrote:

Also, members can't use information obtained from eBay or any eBay systems to contact each other about buying or selling outside of eBay.

Well, there's a plus right there that PP is no longer part of ebay, since that's where we can get the email address from.

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I'm wondering if this isn't part of Ebays plan to have their own "in house" payment system.  They 'll make it mandatory & then won't give us the email address once a payment is made - everything will go through them.  

[tiramisu41]

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@cjs_estatesaleswrote:

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@d-k_treasureswrote:

Also, members can't use information obtained from eBay or any eBay systems to contact each other about buying or selling outside of eBay.

Well, there's a plus right there that PP is no longer part of ebay, since that's where we can get the email address from.

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I'm wondering if this isn't part of Ebays plan to have their own "in house" payment system.  They 'll make it mandatory & then won't give us the email address once a payment is made - everything will go through them.  

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Possibly, @cjs_estatesales     Etsy's payment processor is Adyen.  When you look at your orders on your Etsy Order page while there is email info for your buyer there and it is also included in the auto-generated transaction notification email both receive when a sale has been made.

At Etsy, this notification email urges buyers/sellers to get in touch with each other directly *via email*  (not Etsy Messaging) so obviously Etsy is less paranoid about the type of convos buyers/sellers may have and in fact, encourage sellers there to be proactive in their marketing by doing things such as enclosing business cards, alerting them about local shows/events sellers may be attending, etc.

eBay, of course,  can set up their Adyen integration/interface any way they like --  meaning they could send out the same sort of "sold" notification via email to buyers/sellers as they do now.  But unlike the Etsy one, eBay could choose not include email addresses of buyers/sellers in order to restrict trading off-eBay.

Email info would also not be available as it is now via Paypal, as payments would no longer be processed through PayPal.   And for those wondering, at Etsy with Adyen as the payment processor, Etsy sellers never have any dealings with Ayden at all.  All your transaction records and details are available from within your seller account.  If you have a problem or question, you contact Etsy.

Don't know if any of the above will be helpful to folks.  Who knows how this will all play out?

All I know is that Adyen as a payment processor on Etsy has not been a problem for me.  But Etsy isn't eBay.  Will just to have to just wait and see...

[d-k_treasures]

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@tiramisu41wrote:

@cjs_estatesaleswrote:

@d-k_treasureswrote:

Also, members can't use information obtained from eBay or any eBay systems to contact each other about buying or selling outside of eBay.

Well, there's a plus right there that PP is no longer part of ebay, since that's where we can get the email address from.

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I'm wondering if this isn't part of Ebays plan to have their own "in house" payment system.  They 'll make it mandatory & then won't give us the email address once a payment is made - everything will go through them.  

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Possibly, @cjs_estatesales     Etsy's payment processor is Adyen.  When you look at your orders on your Etsy Order page while there is email info for your buyer there and it is also included in the auto-generated transaction notification email both receive when a sale has been made.

At Etsy, this notification email urges buyers/sellers to get in touch with each other directly *via email*  (not Etsy Messaging) so obviously Etsy is less paranoid about the type of convos buyers/sellers may have and in fact, encourage sellers there to be proactive in their marketing by doing things such as enclosing business cards, alerting them about local shows/events sellers may be attending, etc.

eBay, of course,  can set up their Adyen integration/interface any way they like --  meaning they could send out the same sort of "sold" notification via email to buyers/sellers as they do now.  But unlike the Etsy one, eBay could choose not include email addresses of buyers/sellers in order to restrict trading off-eBay.

Email info would also not be available as it is now via Paypal, as payments would no longer be processed through PayPal.   And for those wondering, at Etsy with Adyen as the payment processor, Etsy sellers never have any dealings with Ayden at all.  All your transaction records and details are available from within your seller account.  If you have a problem or question, you contact Etsy.

Don't know if any of the above will be helpful to folks.  Who knows how this will all play out?

All I know is that Adyen as a payment processor on Etsy has not been a problem for me.  But Etsy isn't eBay.  Will just to have to just wait and see...

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Because at 3.5%, what reason is there for taking a sale off site over there? Or even list a new item sprcifically for a buyer?

Big difference. It's nice to see that they trust their sellers with email addresses.

[lookng2015]

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@d-k_treasureswrote:

Also, members can't use information obtained from eBay or any eBay systems to contact each other about buying or selling outside of eBay.

Well, there's a plus right there that PP is no longer part of ebay, since that's where we can get the email address from.

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Hmm, and once eBay converts to adyen as a processor do we get that email? (probably not)

eta: I see others already thought of that.

[gramophone-georg]

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@cjs_estatesaleswrote:

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@d-k_treasureswrote:

Also, members can't use information obtained from eBay or any eBay systems to contact each other about buying or selling outside of eBay.

Well, there's a plus right there that PP is no longer part of ebay, since that's where we can get the email address from.

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I'm wondering if this isn't part of Ebays plan to have their own "in house" payment system.  They 'll make it mandatory & then won't give us the email address once a payment is made - everything will go through them.  

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Of course it is.

[tunicaslot]

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@missjen831wrote:

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To reiterate, you are not violating a rule by entertaining a future sale with a pre-existing customer, but you should not be communicating through eBay about it unless you want to arrange the sale here as well.

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That's what I thought. It comes down to using their message system. And I can understand why they would resent members using their resources if they don't get a cut of the action. No one likes being played for a chump.

But what I and a trading partner do is not eBay's business at all as long as we're not using eBay's resources and not touching their system. I mean, I send PayPal invoices all the time on business that has nothing to do with eBay — like people who want in on one of my Kickstarter campaigns, but didn't discover it until it was over. How's eBay going to claim any authority over that?

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It all comes down to this.....whether eBay likes it it not, they do not own the relationship between you and your buyer. Once a buyer buys from you, there is no law or eBay policy that says he can only ever buy from you ON eBay. It really boggles my mind that sellers are on this thread saying that sending a buyer a PayPal invoice for an item NOT LISTED ON EBAY its a huge violation. How can it violate the off-eBay policy when the item isn’t on eBay?

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jen - the violation is in reference to continuing to communicate with a buyer through Ebay messages about an item they never had listed here. Not sure it is a violation - but since we have our buyer's contact info - it is best to settle thins with them outside of Ebay messages. Don't take any chances - that's where someone else got in trouble.

Can't say I blame Ebay - you're using their resources to conduct business that they'll never see any revenue from. 

[where*you*crowin]

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@city*satinswrote:

eBay would like sellers to believe (and a few actually do) that once you have had a sale with a specific buyer on eBay, that that seller and buyer are somehow contractually obligated to do any and all future sales/purchases  soley through eBay, in perpetuity, forever and ever AMEN.

Of course that is nonsense but certain methods of flouting that "policy" in eBay's line-of-sight can  get a seller in trouble and in the absence of the right to challenge this non-policy policy in court, eBay just wins the day, even if they lose a seller who they've made a lot of money from.  Sellers are totally disposable commodities in eBay's eyes.  Lose one and another 100+ are there to take up the slack.

Sellers might want to consider what "intermediated payments' might eventually mean if Paypal becomes supplanted, along with the easy access to contact information (email address) it provides.  That particular window for sellers and buyers who start on eBay and want to continue a business relationship elsewhere, could ultimately slam shut.

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As long as ebay is not doing the packing and shipping, they will never be able to completely interfere with communication between buyers and sellers.  What goes in the box is what a seller chooses to  put in the box.  Just like the big boys do.  The more they interfere, the more sellers will do what they have to do too.