International buyer used forwarding address to purchase prohibited item

[cynicalpink]

Hi, all. Im in the U.S.

A buyer in Qatar purchased perfume from me, listing New York as their address. They’re now sending me copies of the emails sent by the forwarding company they used, which is threatening to dispose of the package, as (obviously) it’s illegal. 

I had no idea they were using a forwarding company. The problem is, USPS’ tracking number says the item is “still in transit” and hasn’t been updated in weeks. 

Without that confirmation from USPS that it was delivered (which it had to have been, considering the item is now sitting in Qatar customs — unless the seller made fake emails), what options do I have? 

Huge thanks to anyone who can help. 

[itsjustasprain]

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@cynicalpink wrote:

A buyer in Qatar purchased perfume from me, listing New York as their address. They’re now sending me copies of the emails sent by the forwarding company they used, which is threatening to dispose of the package, as (obviously) it’s illegal. 

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Your wording here suggests that the perfume is still in the U.S. What is the forwarding company asking the buyer to do instead that will prevent them from disposing of the package?

If it is still in the U.S. then I would tell the buyer to tell his forwarder to mark the package as Refused. You then refund once you have the package back again.

[albertabrightalberta]

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@kensgiftshop wrote:

If you have to pay any return shipping, it'll be from the freight forwarder, not the buyers country.

You would think if it was illegal to ship to their country, the freight forwarder would have stopped it.

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Isn't it the buyer's responsibility to know what can and cannot be imported to his country? 

[cynicalpink]

Hiyas, and thank you as well for weighing in. They didn’t send me the forwarding company’s email in its entirety; just a portion of it: 

The buyer said they believe it’s in Qatar, but if it is in fact in the US at an address relatively close to where I mailed it, then it’s only a few hours away, and I honestly wouldn’t mind paying the shipping myself if I can work directly with the forwarding company to do so.

If the buyer refuses the package, they said it would be disposed of. In which case, I guess the buyer would win the ebay dispute, unless USPS can give me confirmation that their end of the delivery was completed.

[ittybitnot]

@cynicalpink 

If your buyer files "Item not received" you will likely lose the claim since you do not have a "delivered" (to the forwarder) scan.  This is a relatively recent problem involving USPS and shipping to freight forwarders as they are not scanning the products delivered.  USPS is also not entertaining and "missing package" reports/queries or allowing insurance claims to be filed for non-delivery due to you (the seller shipping to a third party reshipper/freight forwarder).  Posters here have asked eBay staff members what is to be done about this new unsavory problem, with no instructions or responses so far. 

The screenshot you provided does indicate the freight forwarder did receive the package, but whether eBay will accept that as evidence of any sort remains to be seen.  So far, the advice to contact the freight forwarder and request they "return to sender" sounds like a plausible idea at this point. 

If they should file an eBay claim against you, I would not deal with the regular eBay customer service agents you get in a call back or chat.  They are outsourced call center employees in another country. They have little authority to help you, but often claim they will take care of the problem even though they don't.  Following their advice may even  worsen your problem, and eBay won't care if you end up with additional issues by taking directions from such agents. 

If your issue escalates and the buyer does file ANY sort of claim, do come back here for more advice. As suggested by others, buyers that use Freight Forwarders do give up the right to file Money Back Guarantee eBay claims, but eBay ignores that and processes the complaint as any other domestic sale.  Sellers need to be very proactive when an 'item not as described' claim arrives in their lap. 

Most forwarders are located in Delaware, Oregon, S. Florida, Texas but not limited to these places.  New York was a favorite of buyers from the Russian Federation until eBay disallowed people from that country to use eBay at all (without a sufficient work around).  They didn't care about paying sales tax since they were most often going to get the item for free anyway at the unsuspecting seller's expense. 

Offering EIS will not get rid of international users that use Freight Forwarders.   eBay expects you to ship to them or take a serious defect to your account.  Now that the new "no scanning delivered" with USPS seems to becoming more prevalent,  I would expect more of the same problematic transactions.  

In case you do come back for more advice and I don't see it,  here are the best places to contact eBay about buyers using a F. Forwarder AND any other strange issues you may have. These social media portals lead to US based eBay employees that are well versed in most unusual problems and have the authority to help you.  

https://www.facebook.com/eBay/ (use the blue message button)

OR one of these:

https://www.instagram.com/ebayforsellers/

https://x.com/askebay

Good luck, and let us know how it turns out. 

[cynicalpink]

Huge thanks, ittybitty! Truly appreciate you (and everyone) who has offered such valuable guidance on how to navigate this situation. I’m especially grateful that you took the time to offer so much insight into how this situation has been playing out in similar scenarios. I’ll check back in as the situation progresses — hopefully with a positive outcome, so others can benefit if they ever find themselves in the same boat.

Again, major thanks for your time, kindness and patience!

[gurlcat]

Wait, what??  Enabling EIS and excluding Qatar could not have prevented this at all.  I have EIS on all my listings but about half (maybe even more than half) of my foreign buyers use freight forwarders instead.  And in many cases I don't even know what countries they actually live in because their profile says U.S. -I only know they're foreign because I recognize the shipping address as a FF's. 

In fact let me put it this way: although I have no way of knowing WHY they choose to go with a FF rather than EIS -could be cheaper, for instance.  OR, it could be because they know the item is prohibited for import, and a FF is more likely to just sling it over to them anyway, unlike eBay EIS hub employees, who catch the prohibitions.  Classic example: silver and gold jewelry, which is prohibited for import in numerous countries -I have no idea why, not my problem, but it's something I sell and ship like eBay tells me to. 

Really there is zero reason to worry about who, where or what item category a FF -labeled package is destined for.  Our ONLY responsibility is to get it to the United States address registered for the sale, and our listings are already screened for selling only what is legal within the United States.  Beyond that, not our problem. Even EIS policy says so; if a foreign buyer somehow oversteps their eBay platform's policies and they buy a prohibited item from a US seller, EIS simply refunds the buyer and sells the item to a liquidator, zero punishment for the seller. 

The one and ONLY problem this OP faces is the lack of a delivery scan to the FF's address. 

[cynicalpink]

Thanks for elaborating on some of the other points made, gurlcat!! Crossing my fingers that USPS gets back to me with delivery confirmation so there’s (potentially) an easy and positive resolution for both me and the buyer. 

[12345jamesstamps]

You are only responsible for the New York address and it has to state 'delivered' in that NY address.

Qatar....most middle eastern countries...so many items not allowed to be ship there.

Is it perfume...yes...does it have .00009 alcohol?...probably...we know we won't drink it...but its contents in these countries have laws relating to alcohol. Buyer probably didn't know.

It's not a your problem...I wouldn't respond to buyer's email.

If package doesn't show 'delivered' in NY in a scan...but just 'still in transit'...that is a refund to the buyer by you or eBay depending what shipping you used.

I have items still showing 'still in transit' for 6 months...LOL but buyers never have complained and gave positive feedbacks.

[gurlcat]

Fingers crossed INDEED!  But I should have added this:  I do agree with @duffy4444  that you should enable EIS on your listings.  It's an absolutely solid program (even safer than domestic shipping because they handle returns with no actions or refunds from you).  And if you have EIS, then foreign buyers who want your items will at least have a CHOICE, so they won't feel they need to use a FF.   -Not that FF's are anything to fear, though.  There is nothing inherently problematic about them, in fact they're just another avenue for us to make money! 

[ittybitnot]

You are only responsible for the New York address and it has to state 'delivered' in that NY address.

@12345jamesstamps 

It doesn't have a delivered scan, so if the buyer files "INR" it is indeed going to become the OP's @cynicalpink  problem, even if the evidence (see the screen shot by the OP) that if WAS RECEIVED by the forwarder.  It may never show a USPS delivered scan, which is a new issue with forwarders/USPS on eBay altogether. 

[12345jamesstamps]

Didn't I say that?...I thought I did.

[cynicalpink]

Hello again! All’s well that ends well, though I’m afraid I don’t have anything useful to report. 

I asked the buyer to reach out to the forwarding company, to see how much it would cost to get the perfume returned to me (if there was even a safe way to do so).

A few days later, they replied with a photo of the item in hand and thanked me. I’ve no idea how/why they were able to get it, but I stopped asking questions — I’m just happy to have the issue off my plate, tbh! 

Heck of a learning experience. I appreciate everyone’s advice here, as you’ll help me sell safer in the future. Thank you again! 

[grand-and-glorious-purpose]

Blues have not weighed in on the USPS not scanning delivered to F F s?

[cynicalpink]

Unsure, but not that I’ve seen. 

And I should have added to my previous post — I reached out to USPS regarding the lack of a scan, and my query went unanswered.