Indiana man indicted on $2mil eBay & PayPal fraud

[fashunu4eeuh]

Found this in my news feed today.

https://www.wthr.com/article/carmel-man-indicted-2-million-paypal-and-ebay-fraud

[gracieallen01]

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@bar-29368 wrote:

I doubt it.

He obviously had criminal connections to start with to be able to get the information needed to set up those accounts in the first place.

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And, your point? 

[gracieallen01]

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@mam98031 wrote:

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

I guess those policing 'bots are still at the academy.

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This is an old and tired statement IMHO.  I know it is popular to blame everything on Ebay, but that doesn't make it true.  It appears that the scheme this particular person was running was far more within the PP site.

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Ah, come on.  I'm pretty sure you aren't suggesting that ebay is doing all it can to prevent things like that from happening, just like it isn't doing all it could, or can, to prevent, avoid, detect or hinder scamming on the platform.

[mam98031]

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@moondogblues wrote:
"While it is extremely important to catch the bad actors, it is very bad for business. Buyer trust goes down and that is not good at all for all of us honest sellers."

I agree to a certain extent...but...if the perception is that eBay does not care that the bad guys are caught then buyer 'trust' will continue to erode. EBay already has the reputation of being scamBay.

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Of course they would.  Why wouldn't they?  The threads are full of sellers talking that way about Ebay as is Social Media.  So why wouldn't buyers that see that be cautious of Ebay.

With that said, the threads here serve a valuable service to many members as it can be a great place to come and get help or a better understanding of something.  

@moondogblues 

[mam98031]

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

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@mam98031 wrote:

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

I guess those policing 'bots are still at the academy.

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This is an old and tired statement IMHO.  I know it is popular to blame everything on Ebay, but that doesn't make it true.  It appears that the scheme this particular person was running was far more within the PP site.

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Ah, come on.  I'm pretty sure you aren't suggesting that ebay is doing all it can to prevent things like that from happening, just like it isn't doing all it could, or can, to prevent, avoid, detect or hinder scamming on the platform.

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No I'm not.  If I had meant to say that, I would have.  But for the particular subject of THIS thread, it is PP that really failed the buyers the most, not Ebay.

[gracieallen01]

Uh huh, and for a good part of that period of time (from 2013, I think it mentioned) when much of that was happening, ebay was the parent company but had nothing to say about how PayPal operated, handled anything or had anything to say to contribute to the possible safety of transactions?

[dirk12955]

Before there was ebay,    There were thieves.     

The first man that discovered fire had it stolen by a neighbor.   

[earlyant-77]

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

I guess those policing 'bots are still at the academy.

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I thought they got them from the movie 'Police Academy' .....

[brettyg599]

@mam98031 

I see you are quick to defend again. Wasn't paypal owned by ebay during much of the time frame in which the individual was scamming people?  

Not sure it makes sense to separate the 2 companies as you did in your comment when at the time to my knowledge they shared all information and profits since they were 1 and the same.

Yes no?

[bar-29368]

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

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@bar-29368 wrote:

I doubt it.

He obviously had criminal connections to start with to be able to get the information needed to set up those accounts in the first place.

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And, your point? 

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LOL I apparently haven't (yet) reached your level of cynicism. 

[mam98031]

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@brettyg599 wrote:

@mam98031 

I see you are quick to defend again. Wasn't paypal owned by ebay during much of the time frame in which the individual was scamming people?  

Not sure it makes sense to separate the 2 companies as you did in your comment when at the time to my knowledge they shared all information and profits since they were 1 and the same.

Yes no?

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I am an advocate for sellers.  Whether that is something you choose to recognize or not, that is the truth.  When Ebay does something I don't like, I'm very vocal about it.  Just take some time and find some of my post on the Service Metrics, the return system and other things.  I've started a few threads on the subject as well.  

My post did NOT "defend" Ebay.  I did NOT say Ebay was innocent.  That is what some are choosing to read into what I said, but it wasn't what I said. 

What I said was Ebay is not at fault for everything that goes wrong around here and in this S P E C I F I C subject, the one THIS THREAD is about it is primarily PP at fault for what happened for as long as it happened.  And unless the article is not accurate, it is what the article describes.

What?  They ARE two separate companies and they always have been.  Yes for a period of time Ebay owned PP, but still they were separate companies.  Whether you choose to agree with that doesn't matter, it is a fact.

And for the specific subject the OP started this thread Ebay owned PP for, 2.5 years [2013, 2014, & 6 months of 2015] of the 7 years this person was running these frauds.

@brettyg599 

[picknparley]

"While it is extremely important to catch the bad actors, it is very bad for business.  Buyer trust goes down and that is not good at all for all of us honest sellers."

I agree.

But you have to admit it's a good feeling (to sellers who have been clipped) to hear that someone has been caught.

And really, I was only making a joke. Hence the lol in my post.   Sometimes a little laugh is good medicine. 

Being that the stories are posted online and in other mail sources means buyers are aware of what's going on.  Some buyers may be cheering that there's one less scammer trying to take their money.  

There's no question that a scammer being caught, and it made public, is beneficial to the entire ebay community. We've seen it over and over where good sellers leave because of significant financial loss on a transaction.  Maybe one or two will decide to stay and sell if they think there's hope.

[mam98031]

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@picknparley wrote:

"While it is extremely important to catch the bad actors, it is very bad for business.  Buyer trust goes down and that is not good at all for all of us honest sellers."

I agree.

But you have to admit it's a good feeling (to sellers who have been clipped) to hear that someone has been caught.

And really, I was only making a joke. Hence the lol in my post.   Sometimes a little laugh is good medicine. 

Being that the stories are posted online and in other mail sources means buyers are aware of what's going on.  Some buyers may be cheering that there's one less scammer trying to take their money.  

There's no question that a scammer being caught, and it made public, is beneficial to the entire ebay community. We've seen it over and over where good sellers leave because of significant financial loss on a transaction.  Maybe one or two will decide to stay and sell if they think there's hope.

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I agree with you in regards to it being wonderful that this guy was caught / stopped.  I'm VERY glad he was busted and I hope he spends lots of time in jail because of it.  I have very little toleration for liars or thieves.

Yes, since the emojis still aren't working it is sometimes hard to tell when someone is joking around.

[gracieallen01]

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@bar-29368 wrote:

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

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@bar-29368 wrote:

I doubt it.

He obviously had criminal connections to start with to be able to get the information needed to set up those accounts in the first place.

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And, your point? 

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LOL I apparently haven't (yet) reached your level of cynicism. 

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What?  What cynicism?  I just remember things like 'Elron'.  Wasn't that something of a 'corner office adventure'?  Where do you think they might have 'gone to school'?  Or, perhaps, taught classes?

[gracieallen01]

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@earlyant-77 wrote:

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

I guess those policing 'bots are still at the academy.

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I thought they got them from the movie 'Police Academy' .....

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Nope, the 'bots didn't even make the movie. 

[chapeau-noir]

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@gracieallen01 wrote:

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@bar-29368 wrote:

I doubt it.

He obviously had criminal connections to start with to be able to get the information needed to set up those accounts in the first place.

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And, your point? 

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It's easier when you have existing infrastructure, and for running games like that there's always 'connections' - just the application changes, and there's always the power trip.  Though TBH, corporate conduct these days often doesn't seem much better.