End Game

[upgradedendmills]

It is truly a shame to see so many sellers being forced to give up their hobby/business due to eBay's shortsighted greed. Hopefully, this will all shake out in the next 60-90 days and the platform will either be sold or completely out of business.

Personally, I am in a holding pattern and willing to absorb my losses for the next two or three months and make any decisions for my future on eBay based on actual information I gain over that time period.  The latest changes here have been a huge distraction and cost me untold hours of labor working around them for diminishing returns.

Sellers leaving in droves and selling off their inventory at fire sale prices is having a snowballing downward effect on other sellers who are willing to keep adapting and trying to make this work. The complete lack of sales leads me to believe that potential buyers are still out there but waiting for prices to bottom out.

I honestly feel that if there is to be a recovery on eBay, it will take years and we will have lost way too many good sellers to get there. Replacing the aggregate dedication and experience these sellers bring to the table is simply impossible.

I hope there is a drop in stock prices bad enough to make investors reconsider their options and replace the management team that is causing the root problems.  As sellers, you do not deserve the disruptions and pain that are being heaped on you.

[mr_lincoln]

@upgradedendmills   Good post but its hard to verify if Sellers are in fact leaving in droves or quantify the % that have or are in the process of leaving?   Are Sellers Leaving? Yes I am sure, but as to how many and in what categories I think is the real question. 

I think that while your post does not come out and say it there is an underlying point and that is Buyers opting to shop elsewhere because of " ... The latest changes here have been a huge distraction  ... "

I think eBay underestimates the perceptions Buyers have about the venue and in the end that is going to come around and bite them.  Buyers aren't stupid nor are they as patient as eBay gives them credit for.

I too agree that in time the venue will be bought out by another entity, as to the timing, 60-90 days is certainly a possibility, as is 24 hours and my estimate back in 2016 was about 5 years meaning by 2021 .... how odd that I unknowingly picked a time frame that today coincides with eBay's completion of their full and completed roll out of Managed Payments ... maybe I should be playing the horses ...

[upgradedendmills]

This used to actually be fun and a decent way to make a few bucks.  Not so much, anymore. My description of sellers leaving in "droves" is only based on what I read and mostly believe here on the discussion boards. 

When eBay fully implements Managed Payments I will probably be leaving also.  I have lost all respect for their management and do not want them to have any control of disbursing any revenue I generate. In the meantime, I will be working as hard as I can to sell my existing inventory with the idea of making a few bucks.

I am truly sorry to see any sellers have to pull up stakes and move to other venues. 

[rixstuff]

Nobody is "forcing" them to leave.  They are overreacting to GTC the same as they overreacted to best offers and to giving up Western Union as a payment method and to the star system, and to higher postal rates. The vast majority of us are adjusting or trying new formats and continuing to sell just fine.  I think the difference is that many of us also sell on other sites where GTC is the norm and has been for years.  Of course the other sites ALSO have fixed price shipping (regardless of the size of the item) using THEIR overpriced labels only, 25% FVF, TWO DAY SHIPPING MANDATES, and hardcore limits on complaints or buyer cancellations (yes a couple will bounce YOU if more than a certain number of buyers cancel or ask for refunds and it is a LOW number!)  And don't even get me started on how you don't get paid until the item shows delivered and the buyer leaves feedback FIRST!

[rixstuff]

BTW-This is comparable to the banks complaining about all the defaults on adjustable rate mortgages. So who was it who adjusted the rate? THE BANKS! They shot THEMSELVES in the head with that one just as many of the sellers leaving are.

[zamo-zuan]

---

@rixstuff wrote:

Nobody is "forcing" them to leave.  They are overreacting to GTC the same as they overreacted to best offers and to giving up Western Union as a payment method and to the star system, and to higher postal rates. The vast majority of us are adjusting or trying new formats and continuing to sell just fine. 

---

Based on the business read out I received from eBay today (due to sudden drops we're seeing), I don't know if that is true based on some of the worrying statistics on here. An example:

According to this, the "Parts & Accessories" categories GMV has dropped 27%. That is huge!

[popeye3165]

Recovery will begin in mid-November with the Christmas season

[popeye3165]

---

@mr_lincoln wrote:

@upgradedendmills   Good post but its hard to verify if Sellers are in fact leaving in droves or quantify the % that have or are in the process of leaving?   Are Sellers Leaving? Yes I am sure, but as to how many and in what categories I think is the real question. 

---

No one will be able to quantify anything until some numbers are released that will take a few months.

I can say this I used to sell a lot of BIN DVD/Blu-rays before GTC because I listed them at the lowest price AFTER GTC I have sold few if any.

[greg5000]

---

@upgradedendmills wrote:

It is truly a shame to see so many sellers being forced to give up their hobby/business due to eBay's shortsighted greed. Hopefully, this will all shake out in the next 60-90 days and the platform will either be sold or completely out of business.

Personally, I am in a holding pattern and willing to absorb my losses for the next two or three months and make any decisions for my future on eBay based on actual information I gain over that time period.  The latest changes here have been a huge distraction and cost me untold hours of labor working around them for diminishing returns.

Sellers leaving in droves and selling off their inventory at fire sale prices is having a snowballing downward effect on other sellers who are willing to keep adapting and trying to make this work. The complete lack of sales leads me to believe that potential buyers are still out there but waiting for prices to bottom out.

I honestly feel that if there is to be a recovery on eBay, it will take years and we will have lost way too many good sellers to get there. Replacing the aggregate dedication and experience these sellers bring to the table is simply impossible.

I hope there is a drop in stock prices bad enough to make investors reconsider their options and replace the management team that is causing the root problems.  As sellers, you do not deserve the disruptions and pain that are being heaped on you.

---

Sorry this is happening to you and many others.  I feel badly for all the Sellers (I was thinking about being one, but don't need the added jump-through-hoops stress in my life).

After nine years of frequent buying I'm done.  I finally got tired of the many Issues, System Problems, and Poor Customer Support. 

[greg5000]

---

@mr_lincoln wrote:

@upgradedendmills   Good post but its hard to verify if Sellers are in fact leaving in droves or quantify the % that have or are in the process of leaving?   Are Sellers Leaving? Yes I am sure, but as to how many and in what categories I think is the real question. 

I think that while your post does not come out and say it there is an underlying point and that is Buyers opting to shop elsewhere because of " ... The latest changes here have been a huge distraction  ... "

I think eBay underestimates the perceptions Buyers have about the venue and in the end that is going to come around and bite them.  Buyers aren't stupid nor are they as patient as eBay gives them credit for.

I too agree that in time the venue will be bought out by another entity, as to the timing, 60-90 days is certainly a possibility, as is 24 hours and my estimate back in 2016 was about 5 years meaning by 2021 .... how odd that I unknowingly picked a time frame that today coincides with eBay's completion of their full and completed roll out of Managed Payments ... maybe I should be playing the horses ...

---

As always, very good analysis!

I'm out as a Buyer after nine years of very frequent buying. 

[mr_lincoln]

---

@rixstuff wrote:

Nobody is "forcing" them to leave.  They are overreacting to GTC the same as they overreacted to best offers and to giving up Western Union as a payment method and to the star system, and to higher postal rates. The vast majority of us are adjusting or trying new formats and continuing to sell just fine.  I think the difference is that many of us also sell on other sites where GTC is the norm and has been for years.  Of course the other sites ALSO have fixed price shipping (regardless of the size of the item) using THEIR overpriced labels only, 25% FVF, TWO DAY SHIPPING MANDATES, and hardcore limits on complaints or buyer cancellations (yes a couple will bounce YOU if more than a certain number of buyers cancel or ask for refunds and it is a LOW number!)  And don't even get me started on how you don't get paid until the item shows delivered and the buyer leaves feedback FIRST!

---

I think the driving force that would make people leave or shift products to other platforms is a sudden drop in sales that does not recover quickly or a slow drop that does not turn and climb back up steadily.  I still think that eBay is THE place to go for that rare hard to find item.  Those items are not the low end low priced items from China or the commodities eBay is trying to compete with Amazon with ... I think the average vintage - antique - collectible sale is a lot higher then a sale from China or commodities. 

There is a lot happening in the  Estate and Auction House industry too.  I was talking with an auction house owner today (I buy and consign there) and one of their big challenges in the vintage - antiques - collectibles categories is sustainability.  The current Buyer group continues to age and they are not seeing many young people at  the live portion of their auctions replacing the older Buyers.  I pointed out that one of their big challenges will be to figure out what the late teens thru early 30s generations are buying AND also pointed out they live their lives (so to speak) on their phones ... part of that generation IS buying lower cost furniture via auction to furnish apartments or first homes.  They can get good quality stuff for low cost as the bottom has dropped out of the used furniture business (they say).  This particular company has been developing their online presence too and while it's a slow process it's also very necessary.

More and more Auction houses are shifting to a combination of both Live and Online auctions for part or all of a scheduled sale day.  I was at one earlier this week and it was their 2nd combo auction ... it is a small company and there were about 20 people there bidding at the outset but towards the end of the day there were only 3 of us still bidding live against numerous people bidding online.  Their shipping arrangement is pretty sweet too, sort of like GSP only its domestic.  Anyone who wins a bid online is put in touch with the local shipping place (like UPS Stores) and they work out the shipping with them ... there's a pick up charge then packing materials charge then the shipping cost.  The Auction venue has NO responsibility for shipping at all ...

[equid0x]

---

@mr_lincoln wrote:

---

@rixstuff wrote:

Nobody is "forcing" them to leave.  They are overreacting to GTC the same as they overreacted to best offers and to giving up Western Union as a payment method and to the star system, and to higher postal rates. The vast majority of us are adjusting or trying new formats and continuing to sell just fine.  I think the difference is that many of us also sell on other sites where GTC is the norm and has been for years.  Of course the other sites ALSO have fixed price shipping (regardless of the size of the item) using THEIR overpriced labels only, 25% FVF, TWO DAY SHIPPING MANDATES, and hardcore limits on complaints or buyer cancellations (yes a couple will bounce YOU if more than a certain number of buyers cancel or ask for refunds and it is a LOW number!)  And don't even get me started on how you don't get paid until the item shows delivered and the buyer leaves feedback FIRST!

---

I think the driving force that would make people leave or shift products to other platforms is a sudden drop in sales that does not recover quickly or a slow drop that does not turn and climb back up steadily.  I still think that eBay is THE place to go for that rare hard to find item.  Those items are not the low end low priced items from China or the commodities eBay is trying to compete with Amazon with ... I think the average vintage - antique - collectible sale is a lot higher then a sale from China or commodities. 

There is a lot happening in the  Estate and Auction House industry too.  I was talking with an auction house owner today (I buy and consign there) and one of their big challenges in the vintage - antiques - collectibles categories is sustainability.  The current Buyer group continues to age and they are not seeing many young people at  the live portion of their auctions replacing the older Buyers.  I pointed out that one of their big challenges will be to figure out what the late teens thru early 30s generations are buying AND also pointed out they live their lives (so to speak) on their phones ... part of that generation IS buying lower cost furniture via auction to furnish apartments or first homes.  They can get good quality stuff for low cost as the bottom has dropped out of the used furniture business (they say).  This particular company has been developing their online presence too and while it's a slow process it's also very necessary.

More and more Auction houses are shifting to a combination of both Live and Online auctions for part or all of a scheduled sale day.  I was at one earlier this week and it was their 2nd combo auction ... it is a small company and there were about 20 people there bidding at the outset but towards the end of the day there were only 3 of us still bidding live against numerous people bidding online.  Their shipping arrangement is pretty sweet too, sort of like GSP only its domestic.  Anyone who wins a bid online is put in touch with the local shipping place (like UPS Stores) and they work out the shipping with them ... there's a pick up charge then packing materials charge then the shipping cost.  The Auction venue has NO responsibility for shipping at all ...

---

The younger generation is completely tapped out with student loan payments and low salaries/underemployment, & high cost of living. I'm sure there are plenty out there who *would* buy collectibles, they just don't have the money for it. 

[coolections]

---

@upgradedendmills wrote:

Hopefully, this will all shake out in the next 60-90 days and the platform will either be sold or completely out of business.

---

People have been coming here for over 15 years or more saying the same thing as you but yet Ebay is thriving. Those sellers that say they are leaving in droves hardly any of them actually leave. Those that do leave another comes in right behind them.

[pauls-parts]

---

@rixstuff wrote:

Nobody is "forcing" them to leave. 

Well ya eBay is forcing them to leave.

They are overreacting to GTC

I am not sure why you are calling them over reacting when sales have fallen from months or like I track years past. They were always within 4-7%.

Now are down over 45% from last year & the past 10 years. And the last two months. If it was a gradual slide I could understand it. But all of a sudden!!! And it has nothing to do with my listing, because as soon as I moved them to other venues sales picked up. 

the same as they overreacted to best offers and to giving up Western Union as a payment method and to the star system, and to higher postal rates. The vast majority of us are adjusting or trying new formats and continuing to sell just fine. 

You are absolutely wrong on this. If you want to speak for yourself that is ok. But if you read the sellers posts we are not selling just fine.

I think the difference is that many of us also sell on other sites where GTC is the norm and has been for years.  Of course the other sites ALSO have fixed price shipping (regardless of the size of the item) using THEIR overpriced labels only, 25% FVF, TWO DAY SHIPPING MANDATES, and hardcore limits on complaints or buyer cancellations (yes a couple will bounce YOU if more than a certain number of buyers cancel or ask for refunds and it is a LOW number!)  And don't even get me started on how you don't get paid until the item shows delivered

I have no problem waiting for the item to get delivered. It is only a few days.  If the venue you are talking about is one of the spice girls, They do not allow returns. If it is the river then returns have to be sent back to them. I have already had returns rejected on both sights. Yes it is a little more expensive but you also get more for your product.

and the buyer leaves feedback FIRST!

---

[popeye3165]

---

@coolections wrote:

---

@upgradedendmills wrote:

Hopefully, this will all shake out in the next 60-90 days and the platform will either be sold or completely out of business.

---

People have been coming here for over 15 years or more saying the same thing as you but yet Ebay is thriving.

---

Is eBay really thriving?