Defects on cases that have been escalated, but not settled by eBay.

[ducksandmore]

As the systems change, I notice new hassles. I tried searching for this topic, but not too much came up recently.

In the event of a return, a case is opened. 

If you do not respond by X date, The case can be escalated by either party for eBay to settle.

If you want to dispute the case with facts, you must call in on day X, but calling doesnt open until early morning.

If a case is escalated, ebays automatic system is usually able to close it within an hour.

Example: You dispute a return, and have facts to close out the claim. Buyer decides to escalate case at 4AM. Your options at that point are to just issue a refund or take a defect.

If you let ebay step in and settle the case, they may ask the buyer to return it or issue a refund, but you can not contest this choice. You are forced to take that return at that point, even if you have 100% reason to have it settled in your case. In addition, you receive a defect on your account.

Now, if you are able to step in after the case esacaltion, and issue a refund before ebay settles the case (before Phone CS opens and you even have a chance to air your case to an ebay rep)  you still receive a defect.  Even though ebay had no part in settling the case, and on the case page it even states you issued the refund and closed the case, unlike when ebay settles it and it says that ebay issued the reimbursement and closed the case.

Per the ebay website:

A case closed without seller resolution is any case the seller is unable to resolve with the buyer prior to the buyer asking us to step in and help with a request, or escalating a case to PayPal for review, AND eBay or PayPal determines the seller is responsible.

I have a few cases in which ebay did not determine responsibility, I issued a refund because I had no other choice since there is no 24hr support to fight the choice, and I still received a defect. By ebays own guidelines the case must be escalted and settled by ebay to count as a defect. Ebay support reps on the phone completely ackowledged this, yet refused to remove the defects without reason, usually leading to me being hung up on. These 2 cases dropped me to below standard, caused higher fees, a hold, and a loss of paypal working captial acceess. Are the ebay guidelines that we follow just incorrect, am i misenterpretting them, or are these reps just making up guidelines as they go in order to not remove the defect which would put me back to top-rated seller status?

[mam98031]

Why do you want to wait until Ebay "determines" who is responsible?

When I get a Request for Return, I evaluate what the buyer is saying in the Request.  I communicate with them inside the Request and ask them for any additional information I may desire to include pics if they are claiming damage.  Once I have that information, I authorize the return, assign a RMA number and issue them a return label if it is a SNAD.  I don't need or want Ebay to tell me how to handle the Request.  I just take care of my customer, usually within a short period of time after the open the Request.

I don't drag things out at all.  I try to make it as easy as possible on a SNAD.  Knowing that Ebay is rarely going to stand up for a seller on a SNAD.  Just process the return and move on.

If it is a Buyer's Remorse return.  I usually do as I stated above with the exception that the buyer pays return shipping.  Sometimes, however rare, I will try to discourage the return, but it all depends on what the buyer is saying in the return.

[penguins_dont_fly]

@ducksandmore

The defect is issued as soon as eBay has to "step in". It isn't the refunding part ... it is the fact that the seller did not handle the problem on their own.

The strike is called "Unresolved by Seller" ... Just because you are issuing the refund under the wire before eBay does, does not mean that you resolved the issue. You said it yourself that you are "forced" to refund after eBay steps in.

Handle your issues before eBay has to step in.

[myboardid]

You are not understanding the process.  You get a defect because eBay was contacted, not because you haven't yet settled the case. 

You cannot fight returns, at all, not ever, without getting a defect.  Just accept them no matter what reason the buyer has, no matter whether the buyer has sent pictures.  Do it BEFORE enough time has passed that the buyer can contact eBay.  Do it as soon as the buyer opens the case, or even before when they contact you directly.   

[ducksandmore]

It seems as so no one read the part why eBay essentially forces you into this situation by not letting you call in on the day where eBay can step in. You can fight returns, and you should. Just because some of you chose to get walked over by scamming customers is one thing, but we aren’t in that business. All of you are once again quoting rules out of thin air, the guidelines are written in stone to be followed. So once again, are the guidelines eBay dictates on its own website incorrect? No where on any document does it say a defect is occurred once they ask eBay to step in. eBay can’t make up rules as they go. 

[ducksandmore]

Additional fun fact:

You can not close the case outside of a refund until the first day eBay is able to be asked to step in. A customer can ask eBay to step in at 12am but a seller can only call at 6am pt. You can have almost any return closed in your favor, but they have a 6 hour adavantage to beat you. Quit being a sucker to these customers 

[penguins_dont_fly]

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@ducksandmore wrote:

It seems as so no one read the part why eBay essentially forces you into this situation by not letting you call in on the day where eBay can step in. You can fight returns, and you should. Just because some of you chose to get walked over by scamming customers is one thing, but we aren’t in that business. All of you are once again quoting rules out of thin air, the guidelines are written in stone to be followed. So once again, are the guidelines eBay dictates on its own website incorrect? No where on any document does it say a defect is occurred once they ask eBay to step in. eBay can’t make up rules as they go. 

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Why are you waiting? You can call before the deadline.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-performance-policy?id=4347#section3

A case closed without seller resolution is any case the seller is unable to resolve with the buyer prior to the buyer asking us to step in and help with a request, or escalating a case to PayPal for review, and eBay or PayPal determines the seller is responsible.

[penguins_dont_fly]

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@ducksandmore wrote:

Additional fun fact:

You can not close the case outside of a refund until the first day eBay is able to be asked to step in. A customer can ask eBay to step in at 12am but a seller can only call at 6am pt. You can have almost any return closed in your favor, but they have a 6 hour adavantage to beat you. Quit being a sucker to these customers 

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Looking at your feedback ... you seem to have a lot of problems with shipping and SNAD. And we all know that feedback is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to actual transaction problems 😞

Instead of wasting your energy fighting ... why not put some of that energy into trying to figure out what is wrong on your end and how you might improve.

Why are your items not being shipped on time?

Is there anything you could change about how you describe your items?

On one PlayStation game you have ...

Used

Condition: Good

No mention of any defects, scratches on the disc, cracks on the case or anything.

You use the dreaded "see pictures", but don't show a good close-up of the disc itself (only label-side up in the case).

Take some of that time that you are wasting fighting your customers and put it into building a clear, concise listing with full disclosure facts.

Ship on time, using the method stated in the listing. Upload tracking immediately (if you aren't using eBay labels )

Seriously ... do some hard looking at your business practices.

[myboardid]

ducks - I'm sorry, but you are wrong on almost all counts here. 

Calling in gets you the defect.

You can call any time, you don't have to wait.

You cannot and should not fight returns, ever, period.  You will lose every time. 

Not all buyers who want returns are crooks, the large majority are honest and got a defective product or just don't like the item. 

You are going to lose your rights to sell if you keep this up.  Defects will put you out of business. 

[mam98031]

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@ducksandmore wrote:

It seems as so no one read the part why eBay essentially forces you into this situation by not letting you call in on the day where eBay can step in. You can fight returns, and you should. Just because some of you chose to get walked over by scamming customers is one thing, but we aren’t in that business. All of you are once again quoting rules out of thin air, the guidelines are written in stone to be followed. So once again, are the guidelines eBay dictates on its own website incorrect? No where on any document does it say a defect is occurred once they ask eBay to step in. eBay can’t make up rules as they go. 

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You may want to view your dashboard.  Click the down arrow beside the section called "cases closed without seller resolution".  There you will see the following statement.

A case closed without seller resolution is any case the seller is unable to resolve with the buyer prior to the buyer asking us to step in and help with a request, or escalating a case to PayPal for review, and eBay or PayPal determines the seller is responsible.

Now if you get lucky and Ebay rules in your favor, then you are correct a defect does not occur.  But Ebay has started the automated return process a few months back.  It is extremely hard to win a case.  

You have a No Return Policy.  So you must adhere to the MGB, which is you need to accept SNAD requests and allow your buyers to either return the item or  you can refund and allow them to keep the item.

If it is a BR request, it must be filed that way.  It can't be a SNAD you feel is actually a BR.  On a BR request, you can refuse to take the return if that is your choice.  

The No Return policy does NOT protect you against SNADS.