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Continue to Bite the Hands that Feed You

Let me see if I can get all these new changes straight. Just for review, in the last six months or so sellers here have seen:

 

1. Guaranteed delivery take a bite out of our sales because customers cannot (not without a lot of trouble and hassle) purchase multiple items and get combined shipping. We join the program in good faith, and we lose money.

 

2. A 10% decrease in our discount for being a top rated seller plus--without ANY reason, trade-off, or apology given.

 

3. Loss of placement in the search, and our items basically hidden because we won't get on board with the "free" returns nonsense.

 

4. Threats to RAISE our final value fees, if our returns increase over a "certain" percentage--based upon whatever eBay deems as excessive--and we have NO idea what those numbers or standards will be based upon. 

 

5.  Changes to the feedback system, in our listing abilities, and countless other "NEW" and "improved" systems, that in reality--cost us more time, effort, and frustration. Useless and pointless changes--like the new shipping page--why? It is clunky, takes longer, and I have to scroll to do every single shipment--again, why?

 

6.  Randomly being charged final value fees for TALKING to someone in a message, then pulling a listing--with the implied reason being that we took the sale off-eBay, even if we are totally innocent. Even if we have been here 20 years, and have NEVER had an issue.

 

7. Harassing letters from eBay, restrictions, and threats to our account--for a buyer sending US their phone number or contact information, even if we expressly told them that we couldn't accept it--and then facing #6.

 

8.  Increases in postage that are so out of whack with the economy--it should be criminal. Padded flat rates went up over a dollar in only two years? And eBay refuses to negotiate a better deal for sellers here.

 

9. LOSS of transparency--for example, being able to see our views on our listings.

 

10. Increased invasion into our "personal" space, i.e. our stores that we pay fees on. With other sellers listings taking over our space, and even pushing our descriptions down BELOW other seller's listings. 

 

11. Intrusion in our promotions--for example, I offered buy two get one free in my store, and (I was doing this from someone else's account just to see what it looked like) after I agreed to purchase one item, a box popped up with ANOTHER seller's items in it that were recommended--how in the world does this make sense? I was confused and I KNEW what was happening--totally disgraceful. And I don't even understand what the purpose of this was--was it to slow my sales? Was it to coerce the buyer to spend more? Was it just a stupid move by eBay that wasn't very well thought out? 

 

12.  Threats for having "contact" after a sale with a buyer. Does eBay not realize that there are ALL kinds of reasons for a buyer to contact a seller--not necessarily bad ones--in fact, with the "return this item" button staring them in the face--why would they even bother to contact us first? By keeping these parameters vague, eBay retains the right to boot anyone for their so-called violation of this mystical and unknown to anyone BUT eBay, magical number of "too much" contact. Absurd.

 

13. An increasingly hostile environment, where sellers cannot defend themselves against even the most in-your-face, out and out, theft. Where the seller's word is dirt--no matter if they have been spotless for 20 years--a ZERO feedback buyer wins. Only serving to attract the bottom feeders, and completely ignoring the fact that eBay SELLERS ARE BUYERS TOO--and usually GOOD ones. Absolutely horrendous. 

 

14.  Now not allowing sellers to use the promotions tool in the manner that it was SOLD to us when we purchased our stores--now having to wait 14 days to put an item on sale--absolutely disastrous for sellers, and this will only serve to shrink our already slow sales down to a trickle.

 

15. Continued support of foreign sellers over American sellers here--by allowing rule infractions, multiple postings, return scams, and preferential placement in the search.

 

16. A continued lack of respect for the small sellers--the ones who built this company--the ones who have bent over backwards to follow the rules, to treat the buyers with respect, and the ones who made eBay what it is today. To turn a cold shoulder to those sellers is beyond reprehensible, and truly shows what eBay has become. A greedy, corporate machine--with an agenda that benefits no one but whoever the "chosen" ones are--and small sellers, we ain't the ones.  Not anymore--not after they wrenched from us all they could--now they are on to bigger and better. And if they can't steal the last couple of pennies from our hands, then we aren't of any use to them anymore.

 

I am sure I am forgetting some things--it truly has become a nightmare around here. I would have never believed you if you had told me that this is what eBay would become. I used to get on these boards and BLAST anyone who dared to disrespect this site--anyone who had a complaint. I would tell them that they were absurd--oh yes, I was a cheerleader for sure--and if anyone mentioned treating a buyer badly, God help you when I got through with you. I was so grateful to have eBay--because it truly changed my life. And throughout all the changes I have seen, up until now--I have still maintained that eBay was the best thing going. All the unique and awesome items--and all the great sellers with their personalities and chatty little messages. I know that I am not alone--I know that the personal service eBay used to provide to customers meant a lot to some of them. Sure, there are people that have no time for that--but that's what AZ was for--unpersonalized buying. Here--it was just a bonus for some--nice to have the option, at least. 

 

Sellers--they have taken everything we have to give, and to keep us living in fear, on this hamster wheel of stress that they have created is beyond horrendous--it is shameful. And eBay, you really ought to be ashamed. You grew on the backs of every small seller here, what you are today you could have never accomplished without the small US sellers. And I know it is the "new" way right now to disrespect, use, abuse, and cheat your employees--I see this all over America right now--and that is partly the reason why the economy is in such a state, and also partly the reason why America is failing. eBay do you really want to add to the problem?

 

You have an opportunity to set an example--you have an opportunity to bring about some change. Instead of rolling with the pack of wolves that are devouring the middle class, instead of taking advantage, instead of promoting overseas business ahead of American interests--you could rise above this and come out like a hero. If you changed your plan to decimate your small American sellers, and instead embraced your roots and promoted your struggle--YOUR struggle eBay--the struggle you have faced dealing with other companies who have overrun you (but maybe only temporarily--can't you SEE that), and if you cornered your niche--and were HAPPY about having that niche--you could still win. If you promoted your US sellers and THEIR struggles, if you put yourself behind us and let the public know that you have some kind of morals and loyalty--regardless of what your THINK TANK thinks--people DO still care about stuff like that--can't you see how powerful an advertising campaign based around that could be?

 

But in any case, you won't win this way. What you are doing right now is the wrong way--and I don't care how many savvy millennials or millionaire executives you have telling you differently--they are wrong. You will not win here, not this way. You see, the difference between you and the others is that your company was built with a LOT of help. By sellers who have stuck with you through all the hard times, and who have stayed loyal. Not only is it morally reprehensible to turn out those sellers, but it also, in the long run--makes you look even LESS reliable and aimless. Honestly, your company looks like a clueless follower--like you don't have any idea of where you are going or what you are doing. Just looking for the latest trend, and hopping on board whatever looks attractive in the now. Where is the forward thinking? Does no one up at HQ give a thought to what this treatment of your long time sellers is doing to your reputation? Do you honestly think that you can just scrap the old and begin anew? Without thought or care to the many, many Americans (many disabled, veterans, single moms, college students, side-hustle middle class) that you are harming? How about an ad campaign based upon those types of sellers? Can you say tear-jerker? You are going to lose millions of buyers. Has anyone really thought that through?

 

What you are counting on is that the American public will continue to turn a blind eye--that they continue to allow politicians, businesses, and the government to take advantage of their good nature. That they will simply be distracted and not notice the unfairness and inequality that surrounds them every day. That they will continue to allow themselves to be thrown under the bus for the 1%, for corporate interests, and that getting a little shiny thing for cheap will continue to appeal. But we are not the proverbial frog in the pot--and a revolution is on the horizon. How long do you think people will watch as their children go jobless--paying off inflated student loans, with no hope of a bright future? How long do you think people will continue to become poorer and poorer, with no reliable health insurance, no raises, and no money in savings? While the rich just continue to take and get richer.  A change is coming--you can bet on it. And you could be at the cutting edge of that change, instead of trying to ride the "**bleep** America" bus all the way to golden parachute land. Think about it eBay--please think about it. You have a lot of people's lives in your hands. And before you make these sweeping decisions and changes all the time--can't you even contemplate for one second, how to use your power for good? For America, and for the small sellers that have had your back all these years? Can't you find it in your heart to at least give us a fair chance? If you can't, then I say to you--best of luck, because you are going to need it.  Already the on-line buzz is that eBay is making terrible choices--and NO one wants to support a company that appears to be ignorant and that has NO identity--no matter how cheap the trinkets (and that cheap trinket bus is losing its appeal for buyers--please someone up there LOOK at the data). Just because you allow millions more sellers of garbage on here, doesn't mean that garbage is becoming more popular. Social media will be filled with stories of how sellers are being scammed here, and when their losses become too large, then the last of the hangers-on won't be here anymore either--at least, not the small American ones.

 

So in closing I say to you, sellers--the time is NOW to make yourselves heard--before eBay completely destroys this site that WE have built. For them to be so incredibly arrogant, and so delusional--to think that they don't owe their sellers here any more than this--how dare they? How dare they threaten, coerce, steal, undermine, harass, and devalue us? Write, call, post, use Social Media--anything you can do to make them HEAR us--because they obviously think that we have no voice, and that we will simply accept any garbage that they ask us to swallow.  But we will NOT.  At least, I will not. And if I have to surrender my account to say so--then so be it--change requires sacrifice.

 

And to you, eBay execs--I implore you to think things through here--because this really is the end--for so many of us. You have pushed the sellers here to the point where the stress, disrespect, and constant fleecing of us, has reached the critical stage. You have stripped us of our pride--both in our work, and in YOU. You have taken any kind of independence and control of our businesses away from us, and you have restricted our abilities to sell, by binding them to your ever evolving, and increasingly harmful agenda. Forcing us to bend, over and over again to your will, and forever setting the bar higher and adding hoop after hoop for us to jump through. For many of us--to continue down this path of degradation with you, and to continue to allow ourselves to be debased, and treated like simpletons that require a firm hand and a leash--is an exercise in self abuse that we cannot tolerate anymore--and we simply cannot, in good conscious, continue to support a company that obviously does not have our best interests at heart--nor even in mind.

 

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The last post I wrote was in response to your first post here.  I hadn't seen the latest one. However, it doesn't matter what road sellers take to express their dissatisfaction--there is no "right" thing to do here, and there certainly isn't just one way.

 

If you deny the power of words, protest, and fighting back--and only take the passive route--then so be it. For others, like myself, there is a force that comes with actually "doing" instead of sitting back and quietly opting out--although I do that too. What makes you feel heard is likely going to be much different than what motivates me, and there should be no argument about this. Yes, you are doing what you feel is the right thing to do--I feel that the more attention paid to the ugly turn this site has taken, will also do some good. 

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Thank you for writing this! I also have been with eBay for 20 years and I am in complete disbelief of what this company is doing to it's sellers (that built this business)! Your comment was well written and articulate. Hopefully the 'Powers-That-Be' see this and take a moment to think!

Thanks again!

 

 

very sca

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Corporate greed and mismanagement killed Radio Shack. They had a unique niche in the market...my hubby is a techie engineer & ham radio operator and RS was the only physical store he could go to to get the parts he needed for repair and building things. It was hands-down his FAVE store.

 

THEN, a new CEO (who had worked for McDonalds) took over and convinced the stockholders that RS should emulate Best Buy. Slowly but surely, the "niche" factor disappeared even though frustrated managers relayed all the long-time, dedicated customer complaints to the higher-ups. These were the customers who made RS a sucess story. Customers like my husband, quit going to RS and bought supplies online instead. Once dedicated Managers threw up their hands in exasperation and found work elsewhere.

 

And Radio Shack died because Corporate thought they knew best. Corporate Greed is KILLING business in the USA. WAKE UP, PEOPLE!!!

 

 

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So Well Said.  Long time seller here too.  I am not going to jump through anymore hoops with eBay.   Not going to do Guaranteed Delivery (my Postal Carrier laughed hard when I told her about this) and I am not going to do 30 day free returns.    I am not going to buy even a 1 cent item from china, until they change those two stupid rules.  I will buy elsewhere.  Sorry sellers.   If they are going to give me no exposure and no sales, then I am not going to buy anything either.  eBay has become a joke among Internet buyers.  I get the "there is still an eBay?" when I mention it to people in passing.  

Change the channel!
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@mczombies  Some replies as noted:

 

 

8.  Increases in postage that are so out of whack with the economy--it should be criminal. Padded flat rates went up over a dollar in only two years? And eBay refuses to negotiate a better deal for sellers here.  My take on this is more like inability to negotiate a better deal and not limited to padded flat rates.

 

12.  Threats for having "contact" after a sale with a buyer. Does eBay not realize that there are ALL kinds of reasons for a buyer to contact a seller--not necessarily bad ones--in fact, with the "return this item" button staring them in the face--why would they even bother to contact us first? By keeping these parameters vague, eBay retains the right to boot anyone for their so-called violation of this mystical and unknown to anyone BUT eBay, magical number of "too much" contact. Absurd.

This one sort of counfused me, do you get emails from eBay about post sale contact with Buyers?  Is this only when a Buyer contacts you first?  As to the "threats", what exactly are they threatening?  I have post Sale contact on a regular basis ... either Buyers messaging with thanks, questions or the rare return.  I also initiate contact if I Refund shipping right after the order and the item is packed and labeled, eBay already monitors this but there have been no "threats" ...

 

Regards,
Mr. Lincoln - Community Mentor
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8.  Increases in postage that are so out of whack with the economy--it should be criminal. Padded flat rates went up over a dollar in only two years? And eBay refuses to negotiate a better deal for sellers here.  My take on this is more like inability to negotiate a better deal and not limited to padded flat rates.

 

12.  Threats for having "contact" after a sale with a buyer. Does eBay not realize that there are ALL kinds of reasons for a buyer to contact a seller--not necessarily bad ones--in fact, with the "return this item" button staring them in the face--why would they even bother to contact us first? By keeping these parameters vague, eBay retains the right to boot anyone for their so-called violation of this mystical and unknown to anyone BUT eBay, magical number of "too much" contact. Absurd.

This one sort of counfused me, do you get emails from eBay about post sale contact with Buyers?  Is this only when a Buyer contacts you first?  As to the "threats", what exactly are they threatening?  I have post Sale contact on a regular basis ... either Buyers messaging with thanks, questions or the rare return.  I also initiate contact if I Refund shipping right after the order and the item is packed and labeled, eBay already monitors this but there have been no "threats" ...

 

 
8. I did not mean to imply that the only type of postage I am concerned about are the flat rates, although I use those a lot and the rate that they have been increasing at is truly disgusting. How can eBay not be able to negotiate a better deal? Other, smaller on-line sites have done it--making the postage not only cheaper, or if not cheaper--MUCH more simplified. Mypersonal feeling is that their greed for those extra pennies keeps them from truly trying to help us ship any cheaper.
 
12. This comment was in reference to a vague (not yet explained to us fully--I just can't wait to hear this good news, I tell you) update that stated that eBay will be "paying attention to after sale contact between buyers and sellers." Not sure if that is worded correctly, but it went something like that. Just another weird fear tactic to get sellers worked up. I don't know exactly what it means, but I am 99.9% sure that it isn't going to be good.
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I am a Member since: Oct 14, 2000 - that's nearly 18 years!!

 

and... I'm done.  I have been forced to Liquidate my store, I'm going down to 50 items and selling only what they give as free listings without a store.  I refuse to pay eBay for a store and get kicked around, you suck, and I'm done giving you my money.

 

I will leave my items posted because and take advantage of anything they give out for free ONLY because I need the at home business write off, I will ONLY buy from american sellers.

 

When I called eBay today about the "promotions rules" he blamed "the sellers" saying how we requested rules like the 14 day waiting period and 48 hour hold be applied to make selling more fair.. HA, I do not like being lied to.

 

Juli - plumloved143

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Very well said we agree with you 100%.   They dont care about any of us.  Just themselves.  Best regards

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Corporate greed and mismanagement killed Radio Shack. They had a unique niche in the market...my hubby is a techie engineer & ham radio operator and RS was the only physical store he could go to to get the parts he needed for repair and building things. It was hands-down his FAVE store.

 

THEN, a new CEO (who had worked for McDonalds) took over and convinced the stockholders that RS should emulate Best Buy. Slowly but surely, the "niche" factor disappeared even though frustrated managers relayed all the long-time, dedicated customer complaints to the higher-ups. These were the customers who made RS a sucess story. Customers like my husband, quit going to RS and bought supplies online instead. Once dedicated Managers threw up their hands in exasperation and found work elsewhere.

 

And Radio Shack died because Corporate thought they knew best. Corporate Greed is KILLING business in the USA. WAKE UP, PEOPLE!!!

 

Absolutely--the greed and corruption is out of control--and so many Americans are just so complacent about it--how can it be that over 70% of American households cannot afford a 1000 dollar emergency? 

 

By the way--I had NO idea that was what happened to Radio Shack. My husband AND my daughter were so upset when they all closed down. They loved that place--it was the only way she could get my husband to go to the mall with her!

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"If another site came about that was just a platform, it would take off and make millions just as eBay did."

 

That's easier said than done.. there are many platforms out there, however eBay has a huge market share and invested millions into making itself a household name, we don't just need a platform, we need a "Zuckerberg" to reinvent online auctioning.  eBid, ubid, Bonanza.. etc.. they exist, but are missing something.. there is a reason we haven't all jumped ship yet, we need that something.

 

The best thing is to vote with your dollar, and stop spending money when you don't beleve in a company and thier policies.

 

 

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they obviously think {snip} that we will simply accept any garbage that they ask us to

 

The number of sellers on eBay has grown slowly but steadily for years.  The number of listings on eBay has grown slowly but steadily for years. The dollar volume of merchadise sold on eBay is growing slowly but steadily for years. This tells me that sellers - including you - have already been swallowing this "garbage" for years.

 

What you are counting on is that the American public will continue to turn a blind eye {snip}  and not notice the unfairness and inequality that surrounds them every day

 

I think most Americans notice the unfairness and inequality that surrounds them every day. But perhaps when it comes to prioritizing those injustices, kids being shot in schools and people being trafficked for sex and people being denied healthcare might take precedence over your postage rates being too high or your TRS+ discount being only 10%. 

 

 

 

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@mczombies wrote:

The last post I wrote was in response to your first post here.  I hadn't seen the latest one. However, it doesn't matter what road sellers take to express their dissatisfaction--there is no "right" thing to do here, and there certainly isn't just one way.

 

If you deny the power of words, protest, and fighting back--and only take the passive route--then so be it. For others, like myself, there is a force that comes with actually "doing" instead of sitting back and quietly opting out--although I do that too. What makes you feel heard is likely going to be much different than what motivates me, and there should be no argument about this. Yes, you are doing what you feel is the right thing to do--I feel that the more attention paid to the ugly turn this site has taken, will also do some good. 


There is time to make noise in protest and a time to protest through quiet action or inaction.   Believe me, I know as I have been aggressively on a peace protest since the day after Bush rolled into Afghanistan 17 years ago.  Nothing changed despite the protests, except Bush announced that war was over and some of the gullable fell for it.  Now it has been going on so long, creating newer and more powerful enemies that most people don't think about it because news about it is more a habit to hear because it doesn't intrude on their lives.

 

To protest a business, money talks and cowpaddies walk.  You hit a busines in the wallet out of protest, after a reasonable amount of time and enough people do it, they will see it your way and make changes, IF those changes will bring them as much, if not more profit than before.  That part is the core of my point about how you can't make them change...businesses will make changes, but only if they will profit from those changes in a way that will bring them more than before.

 

ebay usually has plans with the announce something, and it often takes time to see what, if any, ebay's long term plans are.  Sometimes you can stop something by not doing it, like not opting into free shipping, but they will come something that will make up for it down the line - like the ship gouge.

 

Back when the defect system came into being, I moved an entire genre, and most of my money makers to another site - I was not the only one.  Thanks to paypal being joined to ebay, ebay could see the money that the other site was making and ebay wasn't, and after a couple of years ebay started currying the favor of sellers of that genre.

 

The thing is, that I am doing so well in other places, I can see ebay for what it is AND depend on it a lot less than I used to.  Because of that, I have a surprisingly steady income on ebay and none of the problems and angst that many sellers that come to the boards and complain do.  I have a very zen attitude about ebay now.

 

I use ebay as ebay uses me - to make money.

(*Bleep*)
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@mczombies  Thanks for the reply ... comments as note:

 

8. I did not mean to imply that the only type of postage I am concerned about are the flat rates, although I use those a lot and the rate that they have been increasing at is truly disgusting. How can eBay not be able to negotiate a better deal? Other, smaller on-line sites have done it--making the postage not only cheaper, or if not cheaper--MUCH more simplified. Mypersonal feeling is that their greed for those extra pennies keeps them from truly trying to help us ship any cheaper.

Several possibilities:

A. eBay doesn't bother to negotiate and simply records the carrier (may as well throw all of them in the barrel) price increases and passes that on to Sellers.

B. eBay has a very poor negotiating team

C. China sure go a sweetheart deal

D. ebay actually HAS negotiated better shipping deals but that savings is not being passed on to Sellers

 

12. This comment was in reference to a vague (not yet explained to us fully--I just can't wait to hear this good news, I tell you) update that stated that eBay will be "paying attention to after sale contact between buyers and sellers." Not sure if that is worded correctly, but it went something like that. Just another weird fear tactic to get sellers worked up. I don't know exactly what it means, but I am 99.9% sure that it isn't going to be good.

Any monitoring of communication starts with an army of programmable Bots that electronically shoot around through all messages, listings, accounts, etc. looking for what they are programmed to look for.  Take the whole "off-site" sales Bot Brigade ... those little guys were working over time but had to be tweaked a few times so that NON-Off Site communication wasn't being flagged.  Once Bots identify potential violations then humans get involved for a closer look at who said what and why.  This part was explained by eBay on either a Weekly Chat or thread specific to Off-site sales warnings.  That is how it was explained for a situation I have regularly ... when I refund for shipping I first go to PayPal and process the Refund.  I next go to the Sold file and Contact the Buyer stating I am able to ship for less then the original estimate and just processed a Refund (identical notation used in the PP Notes window and part of the message to the Buyer).  I was told eBay reviews this communication because a Refund issued after a Sale is a potential issue with the item or transaction (their comment in so many words).

 

Regards,
Mr. Lincoln - Community Mentor
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they obviously think {snip} that we will simply accept any garbage that they ask us to

 

The number of sellers on eBay has grown slowly but steadily for years.  The number of listings on eBay has grown slowly but steadily for years. The dollar volume of merchadise sold on eBay is growing slowly but steadily for years. This tells me that sellers - including you - have already been swallowing this "garbage" for years.

 

What you are counting on is that the American public will continue to turn a blind eye {snip}  and not notice the unfairness and inequality that surrounds them every day

 

I think most Americans notice the unfairness and inequality that surrounds them every day. But perhaps when it comes to prioritizing those injustices, kids being shot in schools and people being trafficked for sex and people being denied healthcare might take precedence over your postage rates being too high or your TRS+ discount being only 10%. 

 

 

And in come the de-railers to the thread. 

 

If you are going to quote my writing in your post, you do not have my permission to *snip* away at what I wrote so that it suits the purpose of your argument. That is something that I have experienced from you before--taking words out of context, or only quoting half of a sentence or idea--and I have to tell you, I find it most distasteful.

 

Furthermore, while I agree wholeheartedly that the world faces much more horrific atrocities than me losing my 10% TRS + discount, those atrocities are not the subject of my post--the subject of my post, in case you lost sight of it--was all of the horrible changes for sellers here on eBay.  However, if you would like to start your own thread and discuss all the horrific things going on in the world right now, I would certainly be willing to participate in it.

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@retrose1  Good post, well written and explained.  I agree on many points in there, especially cowpaddies and living in Amish country would add what the horses leave behind on the roads we drive.

Additionally, many Sellers here have offered up good suggestions for many things yet I see few that are accepted and implimented ... nor have I been a recipient of the alleged "surveys" taken or part of the group of "Sellers who wanted this" or that change ... or Buyers for that matter since I Buy too ...

So while I love the hobby selling on eBay, the historical research aspect of antiques, collectibles, retro, vintage ... you know things our country once manufactured, I also understand at the end of the day the venue is a business and the 1st sentence of your 2nd paragraph sums it up. 

I too steer away from selling certain things on this type of venue ...

Regards,
Mr. Lincoln - Community Mentor
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