Charge back claims

[48hrs-clothing]

Should we automatically guide every buyer to filing a dispute with their Bank, Credit card or Pay pal when we only know one side of the story?

Is it possible that this advice unwittingly is leading to more fraud being committed against sellers?

I am not so certain that this advice is always helpful and your valued input would be appreciated.

[soh.maryl]

You asked, so here goes:  It's hard to believe anyone is "automatically" guiding any buyer anywhere.

As we often reply to a buyer, if/when a transaction goes wrong, eBay's Money Back Guarantee is the first resource.  The buyer CAN contact the seller first, but is not required to do that.

Item not received within a few days past the estimated delivery date?  Buyer has 30 days to open an item not received case in the Resolution Center.

Item received, but is not as described? Buyer has 30 days to open an item not as described case in the Resolution Center.

Don't you think it's probably better for all buyers (and sellers also) to make themselves familiar with their options and to do this by reading the MBG and using it appropriately and in a timely fashion?

[dhbookds]

I'm not on the buyer board much.........so don't know how often guiding them to the outside entities happens.

Most of what I see, people tell buyers to file an ebay claim......which would seem to be the best option if there is a problem (we can't tell if legit or not).  I have seen the advice to file other places when the 30 days is up.....but those cases that I've read mostly seem to be a seller stringing along a buyer with various promises UNTIL the 30 days is up.........

[48hrs-clothing]

My apology if my OP caused a misunderstanding or my question was not clear.

I completely agree that sellers and buyers must be aware of terms of their contract which is governed by eBay's policies and terms and conditions and it is their respective responsibility to make sure that they have read and understood these and more importantly adhere to these.

My question was more to do with guidance given to go outside of eBay.

May be eBay have closed the case and buyer is not happy with the outcome and is then guided to go and make a charge back claim.

I just wanted experienced buyers and sellers to share their views on

Should we as buyers and sellers offer this advice to make a chargeback claim when we only know one side of the story?

Is it possible that this advice unwittingly is leading to more fraud being committed against sellers?

[48hrs-clothing]

There is no doubt that there are bad sellers and their main ort only objective appears to be ripping buyers off. There are bad buyers and their only aim is to defraud sellers out of their goods without paying.

Both are equally deplorable.

I raised this question as I noticed this Charge back advice given quite frequently and in my humble opinion advice being given by people who post in order to help may unwittingly be helping abusers who read these posts and think this is an easy way of getting goods fort FREE.

Thank you so much for taking the time to respond.

Much appreciated.

[jscar59]

How about item delivered but customer claims they did not receive? Tracking number

was uploaded but funds still pulled and put on hold.

[calntom]

Buyers only get to go to the credit card trough so may times and they are cut off by the card issuer.  

Same with PayPal.

We give advice as we see fit for the situation. EOS

[frgre3717]

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@48hrs-clothing wrote:

Should we automatically guide every buyer to filing a dispute with their Bank, Credit card or Pay pal when we only know one side of the story?

Is it possible that this advice unwittingly is leading to more fraud being committed against sellers?

I am not so certain that this advice is always helpful and your valued input would be appreciated.

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Actually, the credit card companies usually shut buyers down after a couple of charge backs

[calntom]

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@jscar59 wrote:

How about item delivered but customer claims they did not receive? Tracking number

was uploaded but funds still pulled and put on hold.

---

Same as any other eBay case. Funds on hold until case is resolved.

[dhbookds]

Couple of things........first, as you said, we are hearing one side of the story......but in reality there is no way to determine, even with 2 sides, which is correct.....who is at fault, if there is any fault. If buyers enter into the transaction with an intent to defraud....doesn't matter what is said......they already have figured whatever they are going to do.    If they are honest buyers who get into a situation that they want to return something and are precluded from that for some reason......that's when it get's sticky...  But are they perpetuating a "fraud"? 

I think not......just my opinion.  Today's world is one of returns both a physical return and and an internet return....some people expect it, even if they read "no returns".........not right, but reality.......and one sellers just have to accept, again, just my opinion.  Presumably there are other places to sell where "no return" is the rule and if that is part of a seller's TOS, it may be better for them to move there. 

So many times I read.........I've been here x yrs, sold x amt and now I've got a buyer that want to return on my no return listing.......is it really the end of their world to accept it?  I've been here 14 yrs and probably not had 8-10 returns without a no return policy.....  I have no problem accepting them, even for a remorse reason.  Is that terribly out of the mainstream? 

[soh.maryl]

When you further explain your question, it seems that you feel that our advice might be encouraging buyers to commit fraud.

When a buyer comes here asking for help, whether it be with an item not received case, or an item not as described case, my feeling is that we are obligated to offer suggestions including ALL options open to the buyer and that mentioning a credit card chargeback is one of those options.  

[48hrs-clothing]

Having a tracking number is not sufficient.

Seller is responsible till item is delivered to address as shown on buyers order.

Naturally funds will and should be put on hold as seller and buyer are given time to resolve the issue.

Tracking shows item delivered and buyer claims not received. 

Case closed without a refund to buyer.

There is a chance that buyer is telling the truth and equally buyer is lying.

As a responsible seller you must chase it up with postal service provider and if they accept your claim then you must accept buyers claim even if eBay have closed the case without a refund to buyer.

My OP 

Should we automatically guide every buyer to filing a dispute with their Bank, Credit card or Pay pal when we only know one side of the story? 

How can we be sure whether buyer is telling the truth or lying?

Is it possible that this advice unwittingly is leading to more fraud being committed against sellers?

Charge backs in most cases are not about INR and from posts on this forum appear to be claims of unauthorised payments and to use this method to get round the returns process on eBay.

[48hrs-clothing]

I was not suggesting otherwise.

Every one is entitled to their opinion and that must be respected.

My OP was to simply ask the community whether advice regarding charge back is unwittingly leading to more fraud being committed against sellers.

[48hrs-clothing]

I know that credit card issuer and Banks do take charge back claims seriously and they have dedicated fraud investigation teams whose aim is to stop these crimes. 

I was not suggesting that Banks or credit card issuers are negligent in their duty of care.

My OP was to simply ask the community whether advice regarding charge back is unwittingly leading to more fraud being committed against sellers.

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

[48hrs-clothing]

No question that buyer or seller entering into a transaction intending to defraud is deplorable.

In my view a buyer has a fundamental right to return an item they do not want and this must be accommodated within the stipulated time frame.

I can only speak for myself and a buyer asked to return an item in January that they purchased early November as a Xmas present and this was accommodated ( More than 60 days after purchase). 

No question that every buyer is not committing Fraud.

My OP is it possible that advice to go to charge back is unwittingly leading to more fraud being committed against sellers?

I am grateful for your input.

Thank you for taking the time to reply.